Indy Ski Pass

[abc]

Agree. Both Epic and Ikon are actual SEASON PASS, meaning there’re mountains you can ski unlimited days!

Indy “pass” is really more a discount, prepaid ticket “pack”. Yes, it targets people who only ski below a certain number of days. (Or in conjunction to another “real” season pass). So it will suffer the same dynamic of pre-paid ticket packs. There are certain demographic that want couple of days in different mountains. That would be their core pool of buyers.

It looks like they’re seeing what happens to many ”non-core” buyers who move on. So the change to auto-renew might actually be the right move. The more dedicated weekend skiers who like to ski different mountains (or go where the snow hits) will happily stay on the auto-renew pool. Those who opt out will probably not come back anyway. That leaves more spots for the new comers.

 

[eatskisleep]

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The add-on for existing mountain pass holders is a steal

 

[AdironRider]

Agree. Both Epic and Ikon are actual SEASON PASS, meaning there’re mountains you can ski unlimited days!

Indy “pass” is really more a discount, prepaid ticket “pack”. Yes, it targets people who only ski below a certain number of days. (Or in conjunction to another “real” season pass). So it will suffer the same dynamic of pre-paid ticket packs. There are certain demographic that want couple of days in different mountains. That would be their core pool of buyers.

It looks like they’re seeing what happens to many ”non-core” buyers who move on. So the change to auto-renew might actually be the right move. The more dedicated weekend skiers who like to ski different mountains (or go where the snow hits) will happily stay on the auto-renew pool. Those who opt out will probably not come back anyway. That leaves more spots for the new comers.

Me thinks there were never limited spots to begin with, which is why it inevitably opens up to the wait list like four times a year. Its just manufactured scarcity.

I have yet to meet a person who wanted an Indy pass who wasn't able to get one.

 

[AdironRider]

I also just went in and checked, as I don't remember my Indy plus add on being that expensive, and sure enough, it went up by $30 from 329 to $359.

 

[millerm277]

Still a pretty good deal, but I'm going to bow out on Indy this year. I've found the mountains I like (Midd, Dartmouth, Jay which I have season passes for all three) and am using my Indy less and less.

Honestly I think this is the downside to Indy's business model and the reason they are shifting to autorenewal. Indy is geared towards casual skiers (in general - not the populace of this board) and for the one's that do progress to being more aggressive in terms of the amount they ski, they often shift to season passes at the mountain they like (like I've done). Losing overall pass purchasers is a big problem for the Indy business model, much more so than season pass products like Epic where all the mountains are owned by Vail and they can adjust accordingly.

You're also spending what, $1500+ on season passes here?

I'm not saying it's the wrong choice for you, but you're talking a very different price range here to the Indy Pass.

Beyond this, I'm not sure it's some big problem for them - they've got the Addon for people like you who are buying a full pass to somewhere in the Indy space but want to ski elsewhere sometimes.

More fundamentally, they aren't operating resorts and my understanding is their payments to resorts are mostly based on actual visits to them on the pass rather than large fixed payments. If 10% fewer people buy it - that might be unfortunate and would mean less revenue, but it's not like they have the kind of large fixed capital + operating costs that the actual ski resort operators have.

 

[AdironRider]

I get pretty good deals on my Midd and Dartmouth passes as part of my contracts with them, but yes spring rates would put me at about 1500 for those three passes if I was to be a regular paying customer. I also get approx 75 days a year so the math works for me.

Not operating resorts is their biggest liability because they can't adjust based on sales. Vail can hire fewer people or curtail hours but Indy just has to pay out.The Indy model only works if there are enough pass buyers that don't use the passes much to offset those that do use them a lot. They bake in a little bit of security by adjusting the rates they pay to resorts depending on redemption rates, but that can only do so much. If the balance for Indy shifts to far into the heavy user, the model collapses. Think gym memberships, or (and not saying this is the case for Indy), ponzi schemes. They need money coming in to support the money going out. Vail can just adjust operating expenses when shit hits the fan.

 

[Smellytele]

I also just went in and checked, as I don't remember my Indy plus add on being that expensive, and sure enough, it went up by $30 from 329 to $359.

That is not the add on price. That is the base indy price.

Sorry I was mis-remembering and was think of the non + add on.

Although if you work at an indy ski area they have a killer deal for empolyees I have heard

 

[LoafSkier19]

That is not the add on price. That is the base indy price

No, he’s right. Indy+ Add-on is $359 and Indy Base pass is $349

 

[deadheadskier]

I
think the appeal for Indy depends on a number of factors.

I have several friends who only buy Indy and love it. They ski about ten days a year. I have other friends who are more frequent skiers that do the Add On. And some like me that do another pass plus Indy.

The one constant with most everyone I know who buys the pass is they like the less corporate culture / vibe that most Indy mountains provide. That means mostly fewer crowds, less cookie cutter operations, often cheaper F&B and just better overall customer service.

Where folks live makes a difference too. For the Southern NH skier, it's fantastic. 14 mountains within day trip range for me. 28 days if I want em for $400. And obviously more with overnights.

I'd be curious to know what their volume statistics are by year. Are they growing, flat or declining? Next year is year six for me on Indy. I don't even think about switching back to Epic or pursuing iKon. Though if I still lived in Portland, I'd definitely have Boyne/iKon over Indy. I also would if I still lived in VT.