Killington = FAIL. Dew Tour edition...

[thetrailboss]

Just like threecy (who I see also browsing this thread) when highway star posts, people attack him.
Seems like a timely and valid issue at a popular area, yet even the forum moderators prefer to derail it by hassling the op.

Timely and valid, yes. But it gets old hearing the same complaints and at some point one either needs to accept it or move to another area rather than beat the same drum for years on end.

 

[Rogman]

Pass holders and other regulars have a legitimate gripe. You'd have to be blind not to see the impact that the Dew Tour has on operations. A significant amount of the snow making capacity has been dedicated to both the pipe and the course. Last year, the last remnants of the mammoth amount of snow blown on lower Skyeburst lasted into July. That capacity could well have been used elsewhere.

However, Killington is in the river, and simply complaining accomplishes nothing. Moving forward, I hope that Killington does the following:
1. Keep Bear open longer into April this season, if only as payback to the steady customers that were inconvenienced in January.
2. Improve the half pipe so that it requires far less snow to create the 22' monster.
3. Put (additional) fan guns along lower Skyburst so that at least air capacity is not impacted by the early season Dew Tour.
4. Add a trail off of Dream Maker skiers left of the half pipe to provide an alternate route down, thus alleviating some of the congestion on Lower Wildfire.

Some of these suggestions make no sense if Killington/Dew Tour don't renew their agreement beyond next year. However, if the intention is to continue, it makes sense to renew now, adding another 3 years to the deal, and allowing a 4 year payback for needed infrastructure improvements.

I like the Dew Tour, it is different and exciting. Having Sean White competing will certainly be a draw, and it does showcase Killington. However, Killington needs to recognize that their approach creates the impression that they don't care about the lunch pail crowd that foots much of the bill for their operations.

 

[Highway Star]

Timely and valid, yes. But it gets old hearing the same complaints and at some point one either needs to accept it or move to another area rather than beat the same drum for years on end.

It's called persistance, and it's usually effective.

 

[UVSHTSTRM]

If this was an average snow year, this complaint wouldn't exist. Therefore, this thread is stupid. They're doing what they have to do to to put on a good comp and they should be commended for it.

Not true, the Dew Tour has a been a sore point from day one. If there is snow, then the complaint is that it takes up too much of Bear, creates traffic issues, etc. In all fairness, the complaints haven't been confined to poor snow years.

 

[Highway Star]

Not true, the Dew Tour has a been a sore point from day one. If there is snow, then the complaint is that it takes up too much of Bear, creates traffic issues, etc. In all fairness, the complaints haven't been confined to poor snow years.

Not really even the dew tour either - it's the timing of it and the setup at bear overall which is really just terrible.

Causes of traffic problems in general at bear:

- Locations of parks at dreamaker and the stash. Both trails are too flat for a good park. On opposite sides of skyeburst, thus, people duck the fences and cross skyeburst to go from the stash to dreamaker. Or you have jibbers straightlining upper skyeburst.

- Dreamaker used to be a major cruiser trail and one of three main routes into bear. Park and pipe has entirely ruined it. Did I mention it's a bad park trail?

- Pipe faces south, meaning inconsistant walls/icing on each side. Needs to face east, like OL. (hint: put it between wildfire and ol, below spacewalk)

- Nobody is aware of the "new" lower dreamaker between the pipe and skyeburst, which is great for people who know it, but it doesn't see enough traffic.

- Lower Wildfire and Lower Skyeburst are fed by 4 trails and 7 lifts. See a problem here?

- OL quad sees little use now, while the sky peak quad is mobbed.

So what is the solution here, what would you do Highway star?

- Move the halfpipe over to between Bear Quad and wildfire, below spacewalk. Pipe faces east-southeast, meaning it gets morning sun for consisant thawing. Put in a drag lift to encourage use of the pipe. Put in a mini 12 ft pipe next to it.

- Slightly widen wildfire, move the main park from dreamaker to wildfire. Have 1/3rd the width of the trail for moguls, separated by intermittent fencing. For large events, the whole trail is a park.

- Bottom of OL and the parking lot south of the lodge becomes the venue area.

- Dreamaker has two options at the end now, widen the access from skyeburst, make it more obvious. One can be allowed to bump up - south facing bumps.

- Put a small park on half the width of bear claw.

 

[Stache]

i didn't think Okemo had any expert trails?

+1

 

[mattchuck2]

Not true, the Dew Tour has a been a sore point from day one. If there is snow, then the complaint is that it takes up too much of Bear, creates traffic issues, etc. In all fairness, the complaints haven't been confined to poor snow years.

First of all, I'm pretty sure this thread wouldn't exist if this was a better snow year. If everyone was shredding glades, would anyone really care that a couple of trails on Bear had bad traffic, or took up too much space? Probably not. Did I miss this thread last year?

Besides, do you think another mountain would be better equipped to handle the event? Stratton, maybe? Mount Snow? Don't you think the people who go to those mountains would have the same complaints as you ?

 

[oakapple]

Besides, do you think another mountain would be better equipped to handle the event? Stratton, maybe? Mount Snow? Don't you think the people who go to those mountains would have the same complaints as you ?

I believe Mount Snow has hosted similar events in the past. Unlike Killington, it has a dedicated terrain park area (Carinthia), so I doubt there would be the same kind of complaints if it were there.

 

[Newpylong]

Yes the Dew Tour was at Mount Snow last but they could not (or didn't want to) give them the half pipe wall height that they wanted and Killington could, so they left.

 

[thetrailboss]

It's called persistance, and it's usually effective.

True, but Einstein said, "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." In this case, spending at least five years buying season passes to Killington and repeatedly bashing the place and threatening to go to Stowe instead. I've heard your gospel every season for the past five years. That's not saying your points are invalid, it's just saying that they are winning because they are doing what they want and you're still paying them. If I was that upset I'd go some place else.

​

 

[Black Phantom]

True, but Einstein said, "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." In this case, spending at least five years buying season passes to Killington and repeatedly bashing the place and threatening to go to Stowe instead. I've heard your gospel every season for the past five years. That's not saying your points are invalid, it's just saying that they are winning because they are doing what they want and you're still paying them. If I was that upset I'd go some place else.

​

And you still come after him. And he still vents. Get over it.

 

[JimG.]

I love Killington threads.

I believe there is validity to the passholders argument here. Especially this season so far.

 

[thetrailboss]

Just like threecy (who I see also browsing this thread) when highway star posts, people attack him.
Seems like a timely and valid issue at a popular area, yet even the forum moderators prefer to derail it by hassling the op.

And you still come after him. And he still vents. Get over it.

Nobody is going after anyone and no, my comments are not attacks. My comments are about the round-and-round nature of the complaints and that at some point folks need to move on. But as Jim says, they are just never ending which can be amusing but also get old.

 

[steamboat1]

First of all, I'm pretty sure this thread wouldn't exist if this was a better snow year. If everyone was shredding glades, would anyone really care that a couple of trails on Bear had bad traffic, or took up too much space? Probably not. Did I miss this thread last year?

Besides, do you think another mountain would be better equipped to handle the event? Stratton, maybe? Mount Snow? Don't you think the people who go to those mountains would have the same complaints as you ?

Stratton has been hosting the U.S. Open for several years over on the Sun Bowl side of the mountain. The U.S. Open is as big or bigger event than the Dew Tour. I've skied there on the day the event was being held & the way they have it set up it's no problem on the slopes except for a little congestion down by the lift line.

Like I said in an earlier post last year was a good early snow year & you heard the same complaints about the way K has the event set up as you do this year..

 

[Highway Star]

True, but Einstein said, "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." In this case, spending at least five years buying season passes to Killington and repeatedly bashing the place and threatening to go to Stowe instead. I've heard your gospel every season for the past five years. That's not saying your points are invalid, it's just saying that they are winning because they are doing what they want and you're still paying them. If I was that upset I'd go some place else.

I'm not the only passholder who complains on the internet, and we have been listened to. You can point to several things that came about by people pushing for it on the internet:

- Peak walkway was suggested by k-zone poster

- Early opening

- Closing the snowshed crossover

- Fixing the Great Northern/Killink mess

- At the very least staying open until the first weekend in May (lame, but better than closing in april)

- Snowmaking on Devil's Fiddle

I ski 60 days a year on a $730 pass, and refuse to spend any other money there if they are currently annoying me with their decisions. At $12.16 a day, you decide who is winning. Others have also downgraded passes and cut spending in protest.

 

[steamboat1]

I'm not the only passholder who complains on the internet, and we have been listened to. You can point to several things that came about by people pushing for it on the internet:

- Peak walkway was suggested by k-zone poster

- Early opening

- Closing the snowshed crossover

- Fixing the Great Northern/Killink mess

- At the very least staying open until the first weekend in May (lame, but better than closing in april)

- Snowmaking on Devil's Fiddle

I ski 60 days a year on a $730 pass, and refuse to spend any other money there if they are currently annoying me with their decisions. At $12.16 a day, you decide who is winning. Others have also downgraded passes and cut spending in protest.

I'm a pass holder & have been for years. I never spend any money at the mountain & it has nothing to do with the Dew Tour or any other decisions the mountain makes. I think I bought one round of beers for my friends last year otherwise they get zip out of me besides the cost of the pass. And yes I pride myself on this fact.

 

[Ski the Moguls]

I'm a pass holder & have been for years. I never spend any money at the mountain & it has nothing to do with the Dew Tour or any other decisions the mountain makes. I think I bought one round of beers for my friends last year otherwise they get zip out of me besides the cost of the pass. And yes I pride myself on this fact.

I do not quite understand. Why do you not spend any money at the mountain?

 

[Black Phantom]

I do not quite understand. Why do you not spend any money at the mountain?

He is cheap?

 

[drjeff]

Stratton has been hosting the U.S. Open for several years over on the Sun Bowl side of the mountain. The U.S. Open is as big or bigger event than the Dew Tour. I've skied there on the day the event was being held & the way they have it set up it's no problem on the slopes except for a little congestion down by the lift line.

Like I said in an earlier post last year was a good early snow year & you heard the same complaints about the way K has the event set up as you do this year..

The biggest difference (and hence complaints) with say the US Open at Stratton, or when the Dew Tour did its 2 year stint at Mount Snow, seems to have more to do with the layout of the competition sites with respect to the other 98% of the population on the mountain being able to access the non competiton trails. At K with where the sites are, especially this year with not very many other access points to the base of Bear, it sure sounds like a total clusterf%^& Stratton with the US Open, especially with its late March dates, has plenty of other acres of non competition trails open in/around the base of the Sunbowl to allow regular traffic flow. Mount Snow was quite similar to Stratton in that respect in that there was plenty of non competiton site acreage available for the general population to get around the competition sites. Was/is it crowded at Stratton and Mount Snow during the competiton, no doubt about it, you one can move around the competiton sites easier than with the layout at Killington for the Dew Tour.

Snowmaking wise. Non issue for Stratton, since the snowmaking they do for the US Open is done essentially after their done making snow for the season for the rest of the mountain. Mount Snow, with they way they set Carinthia up, reallly hasn't changed too much how they make and how much snow they make on those locations even now that the Dew Tour is no longer there. K on the other hand, does change how they go about making snow at Bear for the Dew Tour.

Bottomline i'm sure is that the way the Alli Sports/NBC produces the Dew Tour, K will look GREAT on national TV next weekend, (i'm sure that they'll be an Irene recovery story and some pictures both outside and inside of the new Umbrella bar) which will hopefully bring more folks to K in the coming months. Whether or not this is a good thing from a passholders perspective?? Not sure.

 

[SIKSKIER]

It looks like your snowmaking issues are over.According to Killingtons snow report this morning:
Thursday, January 12, 2012Happy Thursday and happy new SNOW! Mother Nature brought Killington an inch and a half to 2 new inches last night!


An inch and a half deserves exclamation marks.