Searching for and choosing a college

[severine]

I don't have a lot of advice as far as selecting because in the end, despite being in the top of my class, I went the slow and painful route--4 years to get my Associate's degree at a local Community College and I'm still working on my B.A. at UCONN at the age of nearly-32. I will say that ultimately, cost is what determined that I would stay close to home and do things the way I did. I toured Northeastern and WNEC (two very different schools). Even stayed at Ithaca one weekend while my cousin attended there. I did get into WNEC and probably would have gotten into the others but I didn't apply. My parents weren't paying anything, wouldn't get loans, and their income severely held me back from being able to finance school myself (even though they wouldn't pay since I was under a certain age, their income counted for financial aid). It's AWESOME that you're willing to help your boy out because that opens a lot more doors for him.

Urban-vs-suburban, big-vs-small are good places to start. Don't worry about prestige too much--it's really not that important in the end. Be aware that many schools are facing budgetary issues right now and cutting back on aid + raising tuition. I'm pretty lucky that I got the grants I did this year because it wasn't looking too good for it initially. Apply early for financial aid--get your income tax done ASAP and get that FAFSA in by March 1st. The earlier you apply, the more likely your kid will get aid. I would recommend your son looking into scholarships and applying for any he might qualify--that's where your extra-curricular activities come in. Many require certain activities/backgrounds in order to qualify. I didn't do many activities so I didn't apply for any scholarships when I was in high school--and now, I qualify even less. But they do make a difference.

Once you've narrowed down the basics, start those tours and get the applications in! If your son has a good idea of what he's looking for, he has the grades that he shouldn't have to apply to 10-12 schools. Pick a few he likes and apply ASAP. No need in multiplying work that isn't necessary.

Good luck!

 

[ckofer]

My son is starting his senior year now. We did some tours this summer. He favors downtown Boston so far (Wentworth, architecture). One thing he should know right now: the folks who come visit you at high school college fairs are the ones who actually approve/review applications. They should be respected accordingly. If possible, secure interviews with those folks during campus tours. Send thank you notes.

I agree that it's worth viewing different campuses just to see his reflections on campus size and feel. Money is an important issue and the aid packages vary. Don't be shy with the questions there. SAT scores are very important in general.

Good luck!

 

[madskier6]

My daughter is also going to be a senior this year. She has a few schools in mind but needs to identify a few more target schools. She has done a few campus visits but we will be doing much more of that this fall.

I'm somewhat intimidated by the expected cost of tuition but I've been told it can all be financed through scholarships, grants & loans. Looks like I'll be paying off loans for years. Someone told me, however, that it doesn't make sense to save money for college at the expense of saving for retirement. You can borrow money for college tuition. You can't borrow money for retirement!

 

[severine]

I'm somewhat intimidated by the expected cost of tuition but I've been told it can all be financed through scholarships, grants & loans. Looks like I'll be paying off loans for years. Someone told me, however, that it doesn't make sense to save money for college at the expense of saving for retirement. You can borrow money for college tuition. You can't borrow money for retirement!

Just remember that if your child will be financing any of this, they are limited as to how much they can borrow each year--and usually it's less than the cost of tuition+housing. They can borrow more as they move up (juniors & seniors can borrow more than fresh/sophomores and graduate level work is allowed more) but they really need their parents' help these days, unless they're going to state school and commuting. I highly recommend it as it saves A LOT of money but many will not find this a desirable option and you do miss out on the "other" stuff that way.

 

[madskier6]

Just remember that if your child will be financing any of this, they are limited as to how much they can borrow each year--and usually it's less than the cost of tuition+housing. They can borrow more as they move up (juniors & seniors can borrow more than fresh/sophomores and graduate level work is allowed more) but they really need their parents' help these days, unless they're going to state school and commuting. I highly recommend it as it saves A LOT of money but many will not find this a desirable option and you do miss out on the "other" stuff that way.

Can both the parents & the child take out student loans to pay for the whole cost? Or can only the student do the borrowing?

 

[severine]

Can both the parents & the child take out student loans to pay for the whole cost? Or can only the student do the borrowing?

Both can. Many parents aren't aware of the limitations on how much students can borrow though, which is why I'm mentioning it.

 

[4aprice]

Just wondering what the current approaches are to picking a college...it's been over 20 years since I graduated so I'm sure a lot has changed.

My son's entering his junior year in HS...he's looking at Biology/Pre-Med programs. Grades are OK (mostly As and Bs) and he's taking higher level courses (2 AP classes this year). While he's not Harvard or MIT material (neither was I), I believe he should be able to get into a decent school.

Any thoughts on state schools (in out case UMass) vs. private? Larger or smaller?

When do people usually start the campus tours? I'm thinking this fall will be the time...

We're in the same boat and just discussed this. This fall we are going to visit some schools in the Boston area with our daughter. She wants to go into early child education and developement. She currently works in the Childrens programs at Camelback and according to all feed back did quite well.

I want her to go away to school for the experience. My wife would probably prefer she stay local. Boston seems like a good compromise. My son has his eyes on the Rockies but he's still got aways to go. I'm going to suggest that he go into some sort of recreational (maybe ski area) management.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

 

[Warp Daddy]

the single most important aspect is the "goodness of fit " aspect of higher education . The young person should be in the RIGHT environment which translates into programmatic quality AND the social ambiance in which they are at a peer levelotherwise problems will ensue . If the student is NOT comfortable in BOTH dimensions SLIPPAGE CAN OFTEN OCCUR which can cost both time and $$$

As a retired college president /.dean /professor with over 35 years in the business my other advice is to PUT YOUR $$$$ ON YOUR HIGHEST DEGREE . A good student will thrive WHERE they FEEL most comfortable .

Good luck these are often stressful times but with adequete and accurate knowledge of SELF and a realistic attitude when evaluating FA pkgs ( ratio of gift to payback aid) things work out .

Final note : read this twice ----------DO NOT BE HELICOPTER PARENTS , its the kids experience and responsibility to stretch and grow toward both intellectual and emotional maturity

 

[madskier6]

As a retired college president /.dean /professor with over 35 years in the business my other advice is to PUT YOUR $$$$ ON YOUR HIGHEST DEGREE . A good student will thrive WHERE they FEEL most comfortable .

Great post & advice. What exactly do you mean by "Put your $ on your highest degree"? Please elaborate.

 

[Warp Daddy]

Great post & advice. What exactly do you mean by "Put your $ on your highest degree"? Please elaborate.

Specifically : If the the student has the aspiration / ability and committment to earn an ADVANCED degree (masters , doctorate, JD whatever , MD ) thAT IS WHERE YOU SHOULD INVEST . The world is becoming increasingly a credentialized society requiring advanced study in order to accede to full professional potential , thus that is where one should put the greatest effort /resources etc . The good news is that there is often help too .

To further illustrate my point ABOUT THE NEED FOR ADVANCED DEGREES , within the last 3 generations the sheer numbers of HS grads accessing higher education has risen from 10 % in my dAD'S GENERATION TO 30 % IN MY GENERATION TO TODAY >70%

 

[madskier6]

Thanks for the explanation, Warp Daddy. Makes sense to me.

 

[riverc0il]

Warp has a good point on increasing demand of advanced degrees. Bachelors is the new high school diploma and Masters is the new Bachelors. It is total crap because (IMNSHO) the education system is dumbing down a bit and there are a lot of fools who graduate with various degrees and get jobs because of a degree versus an equally if not better candidate that had fewer paper credentials. My dad dealt with this at his place of employment before he retired when he reached a ceiling but didn't want to get the advanced degree to get a higher placed job even though he knew significantly more practical knowledge than the folks managing his department. Crazy world but I won't digress by sharing my thoughts on how typical hiring and interviewing practices are severely flawed.

Suffice to say that it is a lot easier to move around and eventually up with a fancy looking piece of paper, especially advanced degrees. In many fields, especially the hard sciences, those advanced degrees are absolute because of the knowledge. Though even in soft sciences such as Psychology, you won't even be considered without an advanced degree regardless of experience or knowledge because Bachelors degrees in those fields are a dime a dozen.

Any ways, always a good idea to look at programs that offer a five year Bachelors/Masters combo if there is even the remotest thought of going on for further education. It is very popular for institutions to offer five year programs for a BA/MA combo.

My generation was the first of many that won't do as well as their parents did. An advanced degree will certainly help level the playing field, especially for those in the up and coming generations in which professional positions are declining as servicing positions are increasing, even for the college educated. Though I say all this with only a BA, the ability to get a MA, and declining the option at the moment. Nothing wrong with only getting a BA but I think the point Warp was making is if the desire is there, then don't hold them back!

 

[Warp Daddy]

Warp has a good point on increasing demand of advanced degrees. Bachelors is the new high school diploma and Masters is the new Bachelors. It is total crap because (IMNSHO) the education system is dumbing down a bit and there are a lot of fools who graduate with various degrees and get jobs because of a degree versus an equally if not better candidate that had fewer paper credentials. My dad dealt with this at his place of employment before he retired when he reached a ceiling but didn't want to get the advanced degree to get a higher placed job even though he knew significantly more practical knowledge than the folks managing his department. Crazy world but I won't digress by sharing my thoughts on how typical hiring and interviewing practices are severely flawed.

Suffice to say that it is a lot easier to move around and eventually up with a fancy looking piece of paper, especially advanced degrees. In many fields, especially the hard sciences, those advanced degrees are absolute because of the knowledge. Though even in soft sciences such as Psychology, you won't even be considered without an advanced degree regardless of experience or knowledge because Bachelors degrees in those fields are a dime a dozen.

Any ways, always a good idea to look at programs that offer a five year Bachelors/Masters combo if there is even the remotest thought of going on for further education. It is very popular for institutions to offer five year programs for a BA/MA combo.

My generation was the first of many that won't do as well as their parents did. An advanced degree will certainly help level the playing field, especially for those in the up and coming generations in which professional positions are declining as servicing positions are increasing, even for the college educated. Though I say all this with only a BA, the ability to get a MA, and declining the option at the moment. Nothing wrong with only getting a BA but I think the point Warp was making is if the desire is there, then don't hold them back!

SPOT ON STEVE !! One of the facts is that one should DO what they like BUT LIKE what they do or no amt of $$$$$ or so called prestige will make them happy . For those seeking further evidence read Hertzberg's Theory of Motivational Hygene it explains why materialism and keeping up with the Jones will never make one happy and frankly the Jones don't give a damn either

 

[hammer]

Lots of good advice and discussion here...thanks to all. :beer:

Any biology majors here? Advice on good schools in the area for biology? My son wants to take up biology as a major, which I think will mean graduate school even if he decides not to go into med school afterward.

 

[mondeo]

How grad work is approached varies massively based on what you're going for, though. Engineering and science masters tend to be paid through grants, where you're actually paid a living wage to get your masters/doctorate because you're either a TA or a research assistant. Docs and lawyers, on the other hand, get the pleasure of massive loans. If it's a degree that you can get a job with a B.S., there's a decent chance the employer will pick up the tab for the masters. I'm not paying a cent for my M.Eng, and won't for my MBA when I start working on that.

 

[Philpug]

Scholarships are negotiable, we got an extra $4K a year by just asking. If a college wants your kid, they will find a way to get them there. Be open on your choices, where a college used to mean everything on a resume, it is now where you get your masters that carries more weight.

 

[mondeo]

My generation was the first of many that won't do as well as their parents did. An advanced degree will certainly help level the playing field, especially for those in the up and coming generations in which professional positions are declining as servicing positions are increasing, even for the college educated. Though I say all this with only a BA, the ability to get a MA, and declining the option at the moment. Nothing wrong with only getting a BA but I think the point Warp was making is if the desire is there, then don't hold them back!

And you hit on one of the issues without even realizing it. The more recent generations have had their heads fill with a "do what makes you happy" philosophy. Not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that, but when there's probably as many history majors as engineering majors graduating each year, wages are bound to drop. Part of the reason engineering jobs are being sent overseas is because of a fairly significant shortage of engineers in the US.

 

[riverc0il]

And you hit on one of the issues without even realizing it. The more recent generations have had their heads fill with a "do what makes you happy" philosophy. Not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that, but when there's probably as many history majors as engineering majors graduating each year, wages are bound to drop. Part of the reason engineering jobs are being sent overseas is because of a fairly significant shortage of engineers in the US.

Indeed, I did not realize it. That is definitely a huge factor. I think I was going in the direction of increased percent of the population having access to higher education and getting more advanced degrees while simultaneously the floor is being cut out from underneath where those degrees could be applied to in the job market. The educational industry has done a great job in furthering higher education amongst more people with more diverse backgrounds and financial situations. It is a great thing that you don't need to be a white middle to upper classer to get a quality education. The unintended ramification is that as education has increased, qualifications for jobs have increased as well, while total number of jobs have decreased. A nasty inverse proportion in terms of ensuring everyone has access to a high quality good paying professional job.

But as mentioned, there are a LOT of fields out there where jobs are in high demand. Engineering of course is one and nursing and the heath care fields. These fields definitely require more effort and application and time investment to succeed at the Bachelor level than your typical liberal arts and business programs. And folks are rewarded for their efforts when they get out and are some of the few graduates that actually have jobs waiting for them. But it is true that these jobs have become less desirable in the "do what you want" generation.

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

My daughter is also going to be a senior this year. She has a few schools in mind but needs to identify a few more target schools. She has done a few campus visits but we will be doing much more of that this fall.

I'm somewhat intimidated by the expected cost of tuition but I've been told it can all be financed through scholarships, grants & loans. Looks like I'll be paying off loans for years. Someone told me, however, that it doesn't make sense to save money for college at the expense of saving for retirement. You can borrow money for college tuition. You can't borrow money for retirement!

Future earnings still surpass the expense by a large margin...plus chicks dig edumacated dudes..

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

SPOT ON STEVE !! One of the facts is that one should DO what they like BUT LIKE what they do or no amt of $$$$$ or so called prestige will make them happy . For those seeking further evidence read Hertzberg's Theory of Motivational Hygene it explains why materialism and keeping up with the Jones will never make one happy and frankly the Jones don't give a damn either

I definitely want to read that..maybe it will explain why I'm lazy..