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Skier traffic patterns at "crowded" ski areas

Geoff

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As a Killington regular, I'd like to respond to the locked thread. No flames.... just a somewhat different point of view....

The Killington I ski is usually fairly uncrowded. I know the mountain so I know the rythm of the mountain. I boot up in my condo and drive to the pay lot where I always have a slopeside parking spot. At $239 for the season, that parking spot defuses all the morning hassle. The lifts start turning before 8:00 on weekends and you have the mountain to yourself until at least 10:00. At that point, there are plenty of off-the-beaten-track places to ski where you don't risk getting clobbered by tourists. Most of them are natural snow trails that never get groomed. That self-selects the low skill people and you have the benefit that you're not skiing on machine groomed porcelain.

Last weekend, we spent a lot of time on the Snowdon lifts skiing Northstar, Great Bear, and Vagabond. It was cold so nobody was using that part of the mountain at all. There was 6" of fresh snow over edgeable little crusty natural snow bumps. We also spent quite a bit of time on the Southridge triple... also cold and completely ignored. Breakaway was in great shape. Pipe Dream under the lift was a fun puzzle negotiating the pucker brush.

When there's a little more snow, there are hundreds of acres of tree skiing that are completely ignored by 95% of the clientel. At that point, I can go entire weekends without ever skiing on the crowded groomed snowmaking trails other than the runouts back to the lift.


If you don't know the resort, Killington is terrible on weekends. The gondolas and high speed lifts get very crowded. There are choke points all over the mountain that create human pinball. They have far too much uphill capacity so the main snowmaking trails are skied off to a bullet-proof skiing surface by 11:00. Because of all the crowding and dangerous trail intersections, you see the worst of the ugly convergence of aggressive New Yorkers and Bostonians. That's the Killington the occasional visitor sees but it's only one of several possible experiences.
 

Greg

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Re: The Dangers of skiing on Killington's Slopes

Geoff said:
I'd like to respond to the locked thread.
We don't usually allow the re-opening of locked threads, but I'll let this go as you make a valid and unrelated point: knowing the skier traffic patterns at any ski area can change the experience greatly. I could argue the same point for Loon. The original thread was locked because (1) it was started by a problem user under a new alias (2) included unfounded snowboarder bashing and (3) advocated physical violence as an acceptable way to settle an on-slope dispute. Let's all please try to be respectful of differing opinions here.
 

thetrailboss

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Certainly knowing how to ski a mountain helps. Many in this room have provided me with much assistance when I've traveled to other places. I can be of assistance as well for the following areas with a simple PM:


  • Burke (no crowds actually :lol: )
    Jay
    Sugarbush
    Sunapee
    Cannon
    Pats Peak
 

dmc

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JimG and I feel the same way about Hunter...
 

Vortex

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Geoff,

You put together excellent points. Knowledge of the mountain makes every day easier. Avoid situations and areas that are going to effect your day in a negitive manor.
Getting out early allows for more runs and less crowds and better snow. The reward for dragging ones body out of bed.
 

Talisman

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Geoff makes some excellent points, but the sound crowd avoidance plan he generously shared relys on natural snow trail pods like South Ridge and the trails off of Snowdon. I lack Geoff's intimate knowledge of the Killington crowd dynamics and do fine up until 11:00 AM then get stuck trying to migrate to an under used lift. What to do at 10:40 AM when the throngs hit Killington and those trail pods aren't open? I end up skiing Pico or Sugarbush instead.
 

SkiDork

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Re: The Dangers of skiing on Killington's Slopes

Greg said:
Geoff said:
I'd like to respond to the locked thread.
We don't usually allow the re-opening of locked threads, but I'll let this go as you make a valid and unrelated point: knowing the skier traffic patterns at any ski area can change the experience greatly. I could argue the same point for Loon. The original thread was locked because (1) it was started by a problem user under a new alias (2) included unfounded snowboarder bashing and (3) advocated physical violence as an acceptable way to settle an on-slope dispute. Let's all please try to be respectful of differing opinions here.

Which thread was locked? I'd like to read it...
 

tekweezle

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my advice-stay off of Great Northern, Great Eastern and Snowshed as much as you can. These 3 trails tend have the greatest amount of traffic. not surprisingly, they are green trails and usually full of people going way to fast.
 

ski_adk

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Sometimes you can't avoid these high-traffic areas. In that case, use "defensive skiing" tactics...much like defensive driving. Overtake only when you can do so safely, try to communicate to those following behind you by using signals (a wave of the hand in the direction you're going works well) and always look uphill at trail intersections. Remember, there are a lot of inexperienced skiers and riders out there who really don't know any better. You have to take care of you.
 

Marc

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tekweezle said:
my advice-stay off of Great Northern, Great Eastern and Snowshed as much as you can. These 3 trails tend have the greatest amount of traffic. not surprisingly, they are green trails and usually full of people going way to fast.

There are only a few spots on Great Eastern and Great Norther where I actually feel I could get up enough speed to be considered goign "too fast."

Although I'll agree with you, a lot of people ski like idiots in thick crowds on those trails you mentioned.
 

Geoff

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Talisman said:
Geoff makes some excellent points, but the sound crowd avoidance plan he generously shared relys on natural snow trail pods like South Ridge and the trails off of Snowdon. I lack Geoff's intimate knowledge of the Killington crowd dynamics and do fine up until 11:00 AM then get stuck trying to migrate to an under used lift. What to do at 10:40 AM when the throngs hit Killington and those trail pods aren't open? I end up skiing Pico or Sugarbush instead.

When the natural snow terrain isn't open, I'm usually off the mountain by 10:30 or 11:00 and doing something else. I'm OK with crowded trails since I've been a Killington regular for 25 years but my wife can't stand it. For example, on Thanksgiving Saturday when it's always stupid-busy, we skied a few hours and then drove down to Rutland for the noon Harry Potter movie.
 

Geoff

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ski_adk said:
Sometimes you can't avoid these high-traffic areas. In that case, use "defensive skiing" tactics...much like defensive driving. Overtake only when you can do so safely, try to communicate to those following behind you by using signals (a wave of the hand in the direction you're going works well) and always look uphill at trail intersections. Remember, there are a lot of inexperienced skiers and riders out there who really don't know any better. You have to take care of you.

Those tactics don't prevent you from getting run down from behind like a dog. At the notorious KMart choke points and high traffic connecting trails, I prefer to keep my speed up and find some other place farther downhill to stop.
 

tekweezle

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true. I got clobbered by a snowboarder on lower great eastern. we were both booking it on the flat area by the bridge and i guess he was tailgating me, trying to drag off of me to keep his momentum up. before I knew it, he hit me from behind.

There are only a few spots on Great Eastern and Great Norther where I actually feel I could get up enough speed to be considered goign "too fast."

those 2 trails usually have speed demons flying down them. it can be narrow in places, especially where trails converge and groups of people gather to figure out where to go next. i have seen some crazy crashes on snowshed crossover.

funny thing is that even in the designated "slow skiing" and family zones like rams head, there;s always some crazies making wide GS style turns and using the kids as slalom flags.
 

hammer

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thetrailboss said:
Certainly knowing how to ski a mountain helps. Many in this room have provided me with much assistance when I've traveled to other places. I can be of assistance as well for the following areas with a simple PM:


  • Burke (no crowds actually :lol: )
    Jay
    Sugarbush
    Sunapee
    Cannon
    Pats Peak
PMs sent and received -- thanks for the thorough response! :beer:
 

Greg

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I think this is worth a bump. Feel free to discuss traffic patterns at other ski areas. One place that is always considered crowded is Jiminy. I don't usually ski there on Saturdays, but I've found a good approach on Sundays is to start off the six first thing in tha am. Work skier's left to right on the mountain. By 10:00 am you should have hit all the runs on the West side of the mountain. I usually then concentrate on Whitetail, Jericho and Turkey until the six backs up - usually around 10:30. I'll then ski off the Q1 (if it's open) or Widow White's quad until 11:15 or so. Then on to Christiansen's for lunch. It's usually dead in there until 11:30/11:45. I usually get back out before noon and then either ride the triple to the summit or wait for the six. If the the six is crowded, head back over to the Q1 or WW quad. Ride those until after the post-lunch rush when the six lightens up (around 1:30) usually for the rest of the day.
 

Skifastsailfast

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Sometimes you can't avoid these high-traffic areas. In that case, use "defensive skiing" tactics...much like defensive driving. Overtake only when you can do so safely, try to communicate to those following behind you by using signals (a wave of the hand in the direction you're going works well) and always look uphill at trail intersections. Remember, there are a lot of inexperienced skiers and riders out there who really don't know any better. You have to take care of you.

Am I the only one here who skis by these practices ALL THE TIME?

For example, looking uphill at trail intesections seems to me to be a wise move all the time. It only takes one other skier/rider to create a collision.

Also, are my hubby and I the only people who look up before we push off to make sure we're not pushing off right in front of someone who has more momentum than us? IOW, if we look up and see someone skiing down, we wait until they're down hill from us before we push off? I can't tell you how many times I've been skiing down a nice line and had someone push off right into my path without even looking up. There are some who even look up and look you right in the eye, then push off right into your path.

Skiing defensively is something to do even when you don't think you have to. It only takes one idiot to ruin your day.
 
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