Talk to me about Cross-Country Skiing

[RootDKJ]

I'm thinking about picking up some cross-country skis for next winter. There's some pretty good trails in the local woods near my home, that I know get some (but not much) use.

What do I need to know? I'm guessing that any outerwear I use for alpine would be acceptable for cross-country but what else?

Boots - Bootfitter - yes/no?
Skis - I'm guessing lighter = better, but that's all I know. What's the latest trend?
Poles - length? (I'm 5' 11")
Helmet & Goggles - Necessary? Can I use my alpine?

When is the best time to go? Right after a dump or wait a few days? How much effort is it to make the 1st tracks? There's some hills to climb. How does that work?

I took some pics of the trails I'm thinking about cross country skiing on, I'll post them up in a little while.

 

[marcski]

Not sure if you read this thread from earlier this winter. I believe it answers a lot of your questions. I LOVE my BC XC setup. Amazing, amazing....so fun!

http://forums.alpinezone.com/showthread.php?t=90240&highlight=backcountry

 

[RootDKJ]

Looks good marcski...what's the rule of thumb on ski length/width?

 

[wa-loaf]

Looks good marcski...what's the rule of thumb on ski length/width?

Depends on what you are going to use them for. Groomed trails and you want skinny (faster), breaking your own trail wider for more float.

 

[Angus]

I actually xc ski more than downhill. Great way to maintain & build fitness and enjoy the outdoors in the winter. Had been migrating to almost exclusively skate skiing over recent winters but have gone back to doing a fair amount classic nordic style skiing over past two winters.

Don't buy skate skis unless you have a place that grooms nearby. Purchase a pair of waxless skis with a ski boot that runs higher up the ankle for going out in woods and cutting your own trails. Wider ski if you aren't skiing on groomed tracks. Skis used to be dependent upon the skier's height but now everything seems to be based on weight.

I wear sport glasses when I ski to protect my eyes from other skiers' poles and goggles might be a good idea in the woods to protect eyes from branches, etc. You generate a ton of heat so a helmet is a non-starter IMO just from a heat management perspective.

Probably some good deals available right now.

 

[RootDKJ]

I'm guessing that I'd be breaking a new trail at least 50% of the time.

 

[drjeff]

I've got an onsite 8K maintained network of XC trails where my place in VT is, so I hop onto the skinny skis a few times a year when for some reason I feel like getting in a GOOD cardio workout (and it sure is!)

The couple things I can tell you, is #1 - technique wise, SMOOTH is key for maximizing the glide and #2 start off by wearing about 1/2 of what you would for downhill layer/warmth wise, since QUICKLY you work up a sweat!! #3 to be really smooth and efficient on the groomed, it's not quite as easy as it looks #4 when you get going downhill, you'll very often really miss not having your heel locked in and having a relatively rigid, calf length plastic shell around your foot/ankle/lower leg

 

[abc]

I'm thinking about picking up some cross-country skis for next winter. There's some pretty good trails in the local woods near my home, that I know get some (but not much) use.[\QUOTE]
Think again if you're being spoiled by this winter's snow. It's not always the case..

If you're not planning to go into this a big way (travel to ski), forget about groomed trails. There're none where you are. So you're either making your own trail or in tracks made by other skiers. This points in the direction of waxless BC skis. I'd advice going straight to metal edged skis. It handles icy descend a lot better. (you'll be surprised at how little control you have when your heels are not fixed)

Specifics:

What do I need to know? I'm guessing that any outerwear I use for alpine would be acceptable for cross-country but what else?

The majority of the alpine gears DON'T work. They're all too hot.

But if you spring ski a lot and have some lighter weight (but waterproof/resistant) gear, they'll be perfect.

You want gaiters for going into the woods.

Boots - Bootfitter - NO
Skis - I'm guessing lighter = better, but that's all I know. What's the latest trend? Weight is over rated. For backwood skiing, you want a wide plank.
Poles - length? (I'm 5' 11"): Up to your shoulder (or armpit -- individual view defers).
Helmet & Goggles - Necessary? Can I use my alpine? NO

When is the best time to go? Right after a dump or wait a few days? How much effort is it to make the 1st tracks? There's some hills to climb. How does that work?

There's no best or worst time. Right after a dump, you get powder but you'll need to break your own trail. Wait half a day, someone else might do it for you.

Generally, you don't want to wait too long.

x-c skiing is more like running than skiing. Dress accordingly.

 

[Warp Daddy]

Angus is right on TARGET !! The Queen and I have XC'ed since the 70's . No helemt necessary Root - you'l be amazed at how much HEAT you 'l generate from XC that's why good technical wear that WICKS is necessary a compression style layer under some good quality fleece , and unless it 's bitter just some XC gloves similar to spring weight DH gloves . I wear a Baseball cap sometimes if its above 25 degrees otherwise a good wicking toque . I have Rudy Project Shades with interchangeable lens that i use for XC , Biking , tennis , golf .

I stay away from skate skis and get a good pr of waxless touring skis . BUT here's my bias i always hit them baby's with silicone and let 'em run . We love the the herringbone / and the reward of nice long DH sections . Give yourself a real treat sometime and do a combo in Lake Placid : DH @ Whiteface , then on your off day ski the Olympic trails at Van Hoevenberg -- they are awesome --- great dh sections .

Another great trail up there in Placid but not the Olympic trail system is the Jackrabbit trail -- great BC .


XC is an awesome conditioner . lots of fun and when i was still in the college business i kept a pr in my office and often hit the 15 k system right on our campus woods and meadows . I especially used this a method to THINK thru some thorny issues BEFORE decision making occured. Moreover when you get "peopled- out" there is NO better stress reliever .

Have fun Partner -- you;'ll get hooked

 

[RootDKJ]

Awesome start. I really don't plan to travel to ski. I want an option to go play in the snow on days I can't make it to Blue. I've got a really good selection of spring skiing stuff now.

What's considered WIDE for XC? What length?

 

[thetrailboss]

I agree with waxless skis and higher boots for more versatility. I also wear much lighter gear when I XC ski.

 

[Warp Daddy]

Root : I'm 6'1" and my gear is NOT current variety but works very well for both tracked and UNTRACKED trails

I mostly use 210's also have some 215's with step in bindings that i bought in the 80's . These have a heel device that always freedom of movement BUT holds the heel SOMEWHAT stable during downhill.sections making snowplowing easier .

They are NOT BC bindings, but seem to function fine for me whenever we ski steeper stuff. I also have a pr of 205's for speed . Poles are longer than any DH pole remember your striding and " pushing off " and or double poling when you're up to speed. You're also supporting yourself on any steeper herringbone style ascents with poles

 

[Warp Daddy]

Root: i just checked my pole lengths . I use 150 cm's for deep soft pow and 145's that i modified if it hasn't snowed in awhile.

 

[marcski]

Root:

1) Lots of good info and selection here: http://www.orscrosscountryskisdirect.com/

2) Get a pair of adjustable poles.

3) I wear my winter biking clothing. Works great. You can see my breathable jacket in the pics in the link I sent you and all I had under was one thin wickable base layer.

4) I think you want something similar to my skis. Metal edge, waxless base (meaning it has scales). There are many routes you can go. The ors site has links to some helpful videos that will answer some more of your questions.

 

[tjf67]

Some observations from touring around. I use the 10th mountain ski. Classic touring set up. The scales stick out which is better for climbing but you have less glide. Fischer makes a ski where the scales go into the ski. They glide a lot better. I have the low end garmont boot with a T3 binding. I like the set up a lot I can make alpine turns when I get up to speed. The bindings with the bar in front seem popular areound here but I don't think they are as stable. Poles I use the adjustable ones from EMS. They R a little heavy compared to CC poles but it works.
I get out 4 days a week, keep them in the car wherever I go. I have about 40 days on my downhill skiis and around 80 on my touring set up.
I have a pair of stretch hiking pants I wear and a light puffy jacket when its cold. Jeans work to.

 

[abc]

What's considered WIDE for XC? What length?

Width:

"normal" width is 40+mm, strictly in track, for speed. "wide" is anything 60mm or up.

There's the in between, 50~60 are "touring" width, meaning in track and occasional off-trace.

Once you go over 60mm. you'll start seeing metal edges also.

Length:

Look here: http://www.skinnyskis.com/sizing_info.aspx

Half way down the page, you'll see the touring catagory

 

[marcski]

If you are going to be bushwhacking in your local woods of Jersey, IMHO, you want a BC XC ski. Nothing like your Daddy's old XC skis from back in the day. The sidecut of my ski is like a 1st generation shape ski and it has a full metal edge. Also, I have a 3-pin binding as opposed to the NNN or NTN type and a soft 75 mm std boot.

 

[gorgonzola]

root - nestors is clearing all ther xc stuff out at 30% off - may go even deeper. if i had the squila i'd be picking up the alpina discovery's 68-60-65'ish metal edges 190's with 1550 bc boots and either 75mm 3 pins or bc magnum bindings. this is basically what i'm looking to bunp up to - about the widest you can go for in track skiing and will let you dick around with some tele turns in the wild nj/pa "backcountry" give me call if you have any questions

hey if you want i'll sell you my current set up for $100 to put towards my upgrade!! haha 68-60-65 190's (no metal edges), whitewoods size46 boots (12-1/2 usa), NNN binders

 

[RootDKJ]

Awesome stuff so far everyone! Thanks.

root - nestors is clearing all ther xc stuff out at 30% off - may go even deeper. if i had the squila i'd be picking up the alpina discovery's 65-68-65'ish metal edges 190's with 1550 bc boots and either 75mm 3 pins or bc magnum bindings. this is basically what i'm looking to bunp up to - about the widest you can go for in track skiing and will let you dick around with some tele turns in the wild nj/pa "backcountry" give me call if you have any questions

Solid! I'll hit up KT and Justo, maybe one of them can scope around shop out for me again so I don't have to ride over there.

I was looking at that same ski...$110 shipped.

 

[gorgonzola]

Awesome stuff so far everyone! Thanks.



Solid! I'll hit up KT and Justo, maybe one of them can scope around shop out for me again so I don't have to ride over there.

I was looking at that same ski...$110 shipped.

yea stp right? nestors want $175 with the 30% off tsk! but if you pick up the whole pkg at 30%+ it would offset the diffference