Smellytele
Well-known member
please everyone stop fighting with this person - let it go PLEASE!!!!
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The Dismantling Begins
- Thread starter Johnskiismore
- Start date
Folks argue that this slackcountry destination has been lost, but almost coincidentally another one is opened. The universe is now balanced. All is well. 
Puck it
Well-known member
I agree. He has his mind made up and won't change it. So do not waste any bytes on him.
bobbutts
New member
I think Threecy, tb, and dhs all have some valid points here.
When it involves govt/politics it usually gets much uglier than this, so why not just let it run it's course? I personally am interested in reading people's diverse opinions on the state of NH, it's ski areas, and it's parks.
I'll let my side of it go. It's clear Threecy and I have two entirely different views and neither of us are going to change our opinion. I'm against a lease. It goes against what State Parks are about......for people's enjoyment, not profit centers. Sometimes those parks run at a loss and tax payers need to pick up the bill. I'm perfectly fine having my tax dollars go towards that.
that is all
bobbutts
New member
I agree with all of that and also think that a healthy park system returns $ indirectly by making NH more attractive for tourism.
I also agree that the budget is in trouble and we can expect the state to look closely Cannon however unpleasant that may be.
Puck it
Well-known member
Lynch will never lease Cannon!!!
bobbutts
New member
Puck it
Well-known member
bobbutts
New member
yeah I would be too, I don't think it's 100% safe tho
While respecting the no-politics rule, I think that some of Threecy's concerns stem from the fact that some feel that the state should not be competing with private industry in certain areas. I know that threecy has worked for private ski areas and he can tell you how difficult it is to operate such a business and when the state enters the scene, operates a ski area that many feel is a very good area, and is allowed to deficit spend where private resorts would go under is not fair. I get that. But I agree with DHS that at some point the state, through its citizens, felt that it was a public benefit to have a ski area that was publicly owned and maintained. Why are we not upset about Whiteface, Gore, or Gunstock? They are all publicly run and owned. But on the other hand, look at Blue Hills and Wachusett...which are public land that are leased by private operations.
Gunstock is owned by Belknap county. I wonder if they've considered leasing it.
I also think that some of the concern is that Cannon is a viable competitor to the larger private ski areas. If memory serves me right, it has the largest vertical drop in New Hampshire, beaten only by Wildcat, which is hampered by the fact that it is surrounded by federal land that can't be developed. That is another key fact--there is not much mountani terrain in NH not controlled by the feds for ski area development. That only works to ratchet up the pressure on the "private" ski area competitors.
SIKSKIER
New member
Cannon will not be leased
Repeat....Cannon will not be leased.Get over it.
Repeat....Cannon will not be leased.Get over it.
billski
Active member
Come to the October ACE Ski and Board meeting in Westford MA, we'll have a rep from Cannon on hand to give us a general update on happenin's in the notch.
http://www.aceskiandboardclub.org/
No admission fee, anyone can attend.
http://www.aceskiandboardclub.org/
No admission fee, anyone can attend.
threecy
New member
I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who thinks Sunapee's product now is inferior to when it was state run. From an ski industry perspective, I don't see how Cannon would be damaged if it were stated-owned, yet operated privately. Again, any critical things can be written into the lease, such as trail width, minimum operations, pricing, state discounts, etc.
Here's something interesting - it would cost me MORE to ski at my state-owned ski area than at Wildcat. Weekend/Holiday at Cannon: $66. Weekend/Holiday at Wildcat: $65.
I work Monday-Friday. What am I getting in exchange for the millions of tax dollars invested at Cannon? This is a question many taxpayers may be asking in the near future.
Without getting political, Lynch has been known to change his mind on bigger political issues (which won't be mentioned here, as to adhere to no-politics guidelines) in the past. It's not out of the question for him to approve a lease, especially if November changes the makeup of the General Court in Concord.
Do note that Franconia does not recieve a dime from Cannon's land or facilities today. If the area were leased, private investment would be taxed. With towns struggling to balance their budgets, there may be additional attention from the north country. The Sunapee lease has resulted in a significant amount of direct local tax revenue, where previously there was none.
Puck it
Well-known member
this.
riverc0il
New member
Not sure I would call the Loaf slackcountry. It remains to be seen how much hiking is involved or whether this would just be a Muleskinner like traverse. I look forward to finding out in person and can only hope that at least part will require up hill travel involving ski removal. You might see me at the Loaf more than Cannon next season if the skiing over there is as fabulous as it sounds. On the flip side, I bet there are a lot of disappointed locals over there both with the short term and especially the long term plans.Folks argue that this slackcountry destination has been lost, but almost coincidentally another one is opened. The universe is now balanced. All is well.
riverc0il
New member
Fair enough. There was a time, however, that Cannon was 10-15% cheaper than Wildcat. And I am honestly surprised that Cannon has finally inched a buck higher than Wildcat. I often criticized Wildcat that there were a fair bit more expensive than Cannon for what I would consider not as good of a product (in my opinion). And it is very true that Cannon offers no deals on the weekends. But in state weekend crowd is likely its biggest revenue source and what ski area offers deals on the weekends? I doubt other government run areas offer weekend deals.
All that said... let's talk Sunapee since we are comparing these two operations which are frequently compared. What weekend/holiday discounts do you get as a NH resident at state owned but leased out Sunapee? And how much does it cost to ski at Sunapee on a weekend? Last year, it was $64. Sunapee is a significantly inferior mountain (IMO) than Cannon but it still is essentially the same lift ticket price. Perhaps you as a NH resident get inherently discounted weekend lift tickets because of state operation. A private operator could be charging $70+ for Cannon for all we know. I am sure you will reply that that could be controlled in the lease. But if you keep putting in controls to make the leasor not change anything, it will not be an attractive offer....
I don't think this is worth discussing from a right/wrong perspective. The arguments are on the table. But it essentially comes down to what is accepted as the most widely held preference on how the government should run the state. It all comes down to preference and values and no argument pro or con is going to change that.
