What if Super Combined was say.....Moguls and GS or Super G.....

[Nick]

i would have thought overall a mogul skier is a more diverse skier than a racer.

 

[deadheadskier]

I agree that many bump skiers (not all) aren't that adept at carving. In this format they would probably do a bit better with the Super G than the GS for sure.

 

[Domeskier]

Sundown's "King of the Mountain" race includes gates, big air and bumps. Usually they seed the bumps the night before, so they are more like gates than actual bumps, however.

 

[Abubob]

My feeling is that a racer that excels at Giant Slalom doesn't do as well in the tighter Slalom courses and visa versa. I mean could you see Bode Miller in the bumps? Not likely.

 

[Abubob]

Which racers have converted to big mountain free riding?

Darren Ralves

There was also a former US Alpine Race Team member who dominated skiercross for a bit

Case in point. Darren Ralves is an awesome skier but not your tight slalom type. Big big lines is what he is all about.

 

[Domeskier]

I mean could you see Bode Miller in the bumps?

Would he be sporting the spandex suit? With feet shoulder-width apart? And body-conforming poles tucked pointlessly beneath his arms? I can see it all too clearly.

 

[deadheadskier]

I mean could you see Bode Miller in the bumps? Not likely.

maybe

He throws a pretty good helicopter

 

[MadMadWorld]

maybe

He throws a pretty good helicopter

I could see it. He is just an athletic dude with amazing balance. Have you guys seen the video where he loses a ski at the beginning of the race and skis the whole thing on 1 ski. He was consistently skiing the 30 mph the whole time while staying on course. Amazing

 

[from_the_NEK]

I bet he never skied any bumps growing up at Cannon either :razz:

 

[Savemeasammy]

Bump skiers can't carve to save their lives....and then try to make it through gates...? HAHAHHAAA.

As an ex racer, I don't really like to ski bumps, but I certainly can ski them pretty well.

Bump SKIS aren't much for carving, but I don't see why bump SKIERS can't carve?!

Who cares about carving, anyway?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[drjeff]

My feeling is that a racer that excels at Giant Slalom doesn't do as well in the tighter Slalom courses and visa versa. I mean could you see Bode Miller in the bumps? Not likely.

Most racers, even speed event specialists, have spent a bunch of time also training slalom. Case in point, Julia Mancuso in her Bronze medal winning super combined effort earlier this week. Did she have the greatest slalom technique? Compared to some of the other women who train/race a bunch more slalom, no. But was she still able to make some good short radius turns on a course that was quite rutted and covered in a mix of variable firmness/frozenness/softness, yup.

I agree with Highwaystar's statement. From the racer perspective, may a racer's bump technique be as smooth and fluid as a bump specialists in the bumps? Nope But I bet that the racer would have an easier adaptation to bumps (as they've spent tons on hours training in rutted, nasty courses over the years) than the bump skier adapting to a WC level, prepared race course

 

[Domeskier]

Nope But I bet that the racer would have an easier adaptation to bumps (as they've spent tons on hours training in rutted, nasty courses over the years) than the bump skier adapting to a WC level, prepared race course

I think a groomer is a lot closed to a WC level race course than a rutted slalom run is to a WC bump run.

 

[Abubob]

I think a groomer is a lot closed to a WC level race course than a rutted slalom run is to a WC bump run.

WC runs are salted to produce hard as nails runs are they not? Not like most groomers ... some ... not most. :wink:

 

[Domeskier]

WC runs are salted to produce hard as nails runs are they not? Not like most groomers ... some ... not most. :wink:

The technique for skiing both is pretty much the same, though. The technique for skiing a WC bump run is radically different from the technique for skiing a rutted up slalom course. If you can carve up an icy, skied-off expert groomer, which I assume most WC bump skiers can do, the switch to a WC race course is not going to be as extreme as the swtich from a rutted up slalom course to an icy WC bump run.

 

[gmcunni]

ski-off!! bumpers vs. racers!

 

[KevinF]

The only ski racing discipline that I know of that involves intentional air time is downhill. This is what DH'er did during this training run:


This is a picture of the men's DH course:


Most people would immediately fall on their ass on ice like that and slide to the bottom.

A racer who makes all the gates wouldn't have to to ski the bump run very quickly, because I'm guessing no bumper could finish the race course.

Now, if you want to talk about racers vs. bumpers on "normal" groomers vs. "normal" bump runs -- then you have an interesting debate.

 

[Savemeasammy]

You also need to consider the equipment. My mogul skis have beveled edges, and are soft in the tips to boot. If I tried to set an edge on that course, I would almost certainly wipe out. It is also likely that I would crash into the woods. I might even sustain a life-threatening injury!

The downhiller might suffer a similar fate if he/she ventured into the bumps with their long, stiff skis and razor-sharp edges!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[andrec10]

I'd say the opposite. I've skied with a lot of elite level former Division 1 collegiate racers that don't ski bumps well at all; can't hold a line a high rate of speed and certainly don't know what to do in the air. On the other hand, I've never skied with an elite level bump skier who can't rip groomers well.

and to your first point Dr. Jeff, skiercross is far closer to racing than it is bumps and I'd be willing to bet a higher percentage of the big mountain skiing competitors come from a bump/freestyle background than they do a race background. I know Darren Ralves did well big mountain skiing post racing career, but I'd say he's more the exception than the norm.

It's an interesting debate and I'd love to see it settled someday at the WC level. I've always tried to excel at both styles of skiing (even though my racing career lasted all of 5 weeks). I'm far more a bumper / off piste skier at heart, but being able to carve up groomed terrain at a high level has always been something I've strived to do well also.

Put the bumpers on a ICY GS course and watch them SH!T their pants.

 

[Scruffy]

All you people thinking that all mountain carving skills equate to WC GS skills are way out to lunch. As an ex racer I can assure you your all mountain carving - even icy expert terrain - is not even the tip of the ice berg of the skill set needed to excel in a race course.

I don't know who would win in this hypothetical argument, a lot would depend on the participants, I don't think you can generalize. I know excellent racers that can shred a bump run too - so it all depends. It's true that the closer you get from beer league to WC, the more intensely directed the training is toward the disciplines; so each would suffer dearly in their foreign course.

At any rate, I'm sure it would be hilarious to watch.

 

[2knees]

Put the bumpers on a ICY GS course and watch them SH!T their pants.

If they can ski icy bump courses with two huge airs why would a groomed GS run that is icy scare them?