The "Sugarbush Thread"

[thetrailboss]

From what I've heard the big 200 unit housing project was nixxed by Sugarbush due to cost, ..as was downhill biking. Cost of lift maintenance, lift ops, patrol, bike shop, and food/beverage simply did not cover the limited income. Downhill biking is also much more equipment-specific (expensive) and relatively dangerous compared to trail riding.
The Town of Warren is actively looking at ways to increase affordable housing, including limits to STRs and allowing accessory apartments. Same for Waitsfield, who are also planning a downtown sewer project, at great expense.

So Alterra is not moving forward with the employee housing project?

 

[Plowboy]

So Alterra is not moving forward with the employee housing project?

From what I’ve heard a big part of the problem is the sewer system. The waste water treatment plant is at capacity. Nothing on site available and off site is $$$$$.

 

[thetrailboss]

From what I’ve heard a big part of the problem is the sewer system. The waste water treatment plant is at capacity. Nothing on site available and off site is $$$$$.

Sounds like a shitty deal……







(Thank you, tip your waitstaff well).

 

[machski]

I haven’t followed it that closely but the parts that I remember seem to be coming to fruition. What’s been downplayed?

Well, TL replacement went from this past summer to hopefully next summer, no word on SQ replacement, same with DR out of the base. They have been expanding and increasing pumping capacity of the snowmaking system, but all date targets are gone from the 2030 plan page now. That is a big change.

 

[thetrailboss]

Well, TL replacement went from this past summer to hopefully next summer, no word on SQ replacement, same with DR out of the base. They have been expanding and increasing pumping capacity of the snowmaking system, but all date targets are gone from the 2030 plan page now. That is a big change.

LiftBlog is reporting that the TL Replacement is still on the list for next year.

And no new lifts for SB in 2026 or 2027 (yet).

2026 New Lifts

This is a list of new lifts likely to be built in the United States and Canada during the 2026 construction season. Last updated 10/18/2025. Have an addition or correction? Comment below or email …

liftblog.com

 

[machski]

LiftBlog is reporting that the TL Replacement is still on the list for next year.

And no new lifts for SB in 2026 or 2027 (yet).

2026 New Lifts

This is a list of new lifts likely to be built in the United States and Canada during the 2026 construction season. Last updated 10/18/2025. Have an addition or correction? Comment below or email …

liftblog.com

I get that, but it was originally expected for this season and then they pushed it to a two year deal. And while SL is getting new or upgraded lifts, they are all refurbs so far (for the last HSQ and next HSS). Make of that what you will, but doesn't sound like the return is there to install all new machines.

 

[thetrailboss]

I get that, but it was originally expected for this season and then they pushed it to a two year deal. And while SL is getting new or upgraded lifts, they are all refurbs so far (for the last HSQ and next HSS). Make of that what you will, but doesn't sound like the return is there to install all new machines.

Yeah, I completely hear you about the "refurbs" versus "new" issue. Honestly, the refurbished lifts that I have ridden (Shedhorn at Big Sky) and seen (the HSQs at Pleasant and SL) are really nice, but there is something to be said about getting a new, new lift with completely new components. Boyne had big ambitions for Sugarloaf when they purchased it in 2007. I remember folks saying that Boyne wanted to make it the Big Sky of the east and, well, it has been a slow and painful few decades with two very bad lift incidents that really gave Boyne a black eye--especially since Boyne prides itself on being a leader in lift technology.

I am curious why they are not replacing SuperQuad FIRST before Timberline. When we visited in 2023 SuperQuad was showing its age. Timberline is slow, but it's a fixed grip and can go forever. Yes, it is a Borvig lift and probably getting parts is a pain, but I'd think that upgrading what is arguably the single most important lift at the resort should be a higher priority.

I will say that when we visited in January 2023 we were BLOWN AWAY by the amount of snowmaking they had done and how much they had open when pretty much everywhere else completely sucked. Burke was glare ice.

And I am pretty sure that LiftBlog was reporting that Timberline was going to be a two-year project. Such refurbs have been. They need time to remove the lift, evaluate what can be reused, and then manufacture the new equipment. IIRC Pleasant Mountain's HSQ required two years from removal to install. Same with Bucksaw Express. Perhaps Boyne was being bullish and said it would be one year?

I have a special place in my heart for Sugarloaf. My wife learned to ski there. We love going back. I want to visit this winter at least once. I was happy to see that Boyne had maintained things pretty well, but it could use some new lifts and similar upgrades.

/End thread highjack.

 

[MrGlen]

I pretty much agree with all of this. I've been a devoted SB skier for 15 or so years. For the first 10 years of that it was more often than not, family trips to SB. Now it's mostly just me. I think that the terrain is great and I love that they keep plenty of stuff ungroomed. Early on I was looking at buying a place up there. I never pulled the trigger and then the covid RE bump hit which made things that much more expensive. Now I'm glad that I didn't do it. Other than really fun skiing, there's simply not enough for my family and I to do up there, especially at night. I can count on one hand how many times I've stayed in the Valley. We stay in or around Burlington as there's more nightlife. Frankly Burlington has plenty of challenges, but that's probably best for another topic.

Agree on the fact that Burlington certainly has more to offer. That hour drive up there is killer though after a long day.

It’s sad to say this, but with how things are trending around the valley, seems like it’s progressing towards something similar to Burke, while Killington and Stowe are flourishing.

 

[mikec142]

Agree on the fact that Burlington certainly has more to offer. That hour drive up there is killer though after a long day.

It’s sad to say this, but with how things are trending around the valley, seems like it’s progressing towards something similar to Burke, while Killington and Stowe are flourishing.

It's all weather dependent. The ride home rarely bothered me. Even in bad weather, I could just take my time (or leave the mountain at the right time). I've had some drives from burlingotn to the mountain where I had to turn around and punt on the day which is alway super frustrating. Snow tires and an unwavering confidence that I can drive slowly in the right lane (or not care if traffic is stacked up behind me on 100 has made things easier.

 

[cdskier]

Agree on the fact that Burlington certainly has more to offer. That hour drive up there is killer though after a long day.

It’s sad to say this, but with how things are trending around the valley, seems like it’s progressing towards something similar to Burke, while Killington and Stowe are flourishing.

I have no desire to drive to Waterbury from the mountain, never-mind Burlington. This is an interesting topic. Part of the appeal of Sugarbush to me vs K or Stowe was the fact that it was more remote and "quaint". Even though I don't want a big party scene, I do think we've lost quite a few restaurants over the past few years and that's not good. My desire to leave my condo to go out to dinner now is very low. I'm at a point where I'd rather just cook most weekends as there just aren't a ton of appealing options to me right now.

 

[Terry]

Yeah, I completely hear you about the "refurbs" versus "new" issue. Honestly, the refurbished lifts that I have ridden (Shedhorn at Big Sky) and seen (the HSQs at Pleasant and SL) are really nice, but there is something to be said about getting a new, new lift with completely new components. Boyne had big ambitions for Sugarloaf when they purchased it in 2007. I remember folks saying that Boyne wanted to make it the Big Sky of the east and, well, it has been a slow and painful few decades with two very bad lift incidents that really gave Boyne a black eye--especially since Boyne prides itself on being a leader in lift technology.

I am curious why they are not replacing SuperQuad FIRST before Timberline. When we visited in 2023 SuperQuad was showing its age. Timberline is slow, but it's a fixed grip and can go forever. Yes, it is a Borvig lift and probably getting parts is a pain, but I'd think that upgrading what is arguably the single most important lift at the resort should be a higher priority.

I will say that when we visited in January 2023 we were BLOWN AWAY by the amount of snowmaking they had done and how much they had open when pretty much everywhere else completely sucked. Burke was glare ice.

And I am pretty sure that LiftBlog was reporting that Timberline was going to be a two-year project. Such refurbs have been. They need time to remove the lift, evaluate what can be reused, and then manufacture the new equipment. IIRC Pleasant Mountain's HSQ required two years from removal to install. Same with Bucksaw Express. Perhaps Boyne was being bullish and said it would be one year?

I have a special place in my heart for Sugarloaf. My wife learned to ski there. We love going back. I want to visit this winter at least once. I was happy to see that Boyne had maintained things pretty well, but it could use some new lifts and similar upgrades.

/End thread highjack.

The Pleasant Mt HSQ was done in 1 summer. The lift was taken out at Sunday River two summers before then.