Lift bar....up or down?

[roark]

I prefer the bar down but it sounds like I'm the only one who doesn't like footrests. I find it more 'restful' for my feet the dangle (different pressure on my foot). The legs however, appreciate the use of footrests.

 

[2knees]

I never really gave it much thought till i went out west. Kirkwood has a double chair called sunrise. (i think)
it seemed like an older double chair and it had no bar. i was skiing with a pack and with a guy who was a little bit on the heavy side. It was real windy and i honestly felt like i had one cheek hanging over the edge the whole time.

 

[millerm277]

I almost always leave it up, unless it's a lift that's very high up/windy. I don't really like the footrests either, I find the "dangle" as roark said more restful on my feet. If I'm with someone else, I let them make the choice, with little kids, always down.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

I'm certainly not trying to justify the CO Tramway Board's stance. Just sharing the info that I have.

I think the idea is that, jumping onto snow will give you a better survival rate than crashing down stuck in a metal chair.

 

[thebigo]

Lets see, most lifts are maybe 50 feet in the air, a sudden line/grip failure resulting in the chair plunging to the ground at 9.8meters/second - that will give most folks maybe 2 seconds to say "oh sh*&" and make the mental descision to jump.

Thanks for that it made me think about the equations of motion for the first time in a decade.

I leave the bar up more often than not. I figure skiing between trees is signifigantly more dangerous than sitting on a lift. A number of years ago I was in Alta staying at the P-Dog and we had dinner with the 'Mayor'. This was back when the place only had center pole double chairs with no bars. Some lady told the 'Mayor' they should install safety bars, he replied that x number of millions of skiers had skied alta over the years and they never had a single injury resulting from a fall off a chairlift.

With this said I will admit to looking for a bar on the old milly lift at brighton, finding nothing and wrapping my arm around the back of the chair.

 

[Kerovick]

I generally leave it up but sometimes put it down to rest my legs.

 

[drjeff]

The other failed logic that drives me up the wall is seeing a person riding a MC with no helmet, wearing short sleeve shirt, wearing shorts or no leathers and in sneakers..

I'll second that!

A frankly, if someone DOES survive a helmetless MC accident and sustain facial trauma, it's typically a multi-thousand dollar payday for me to fix up their smile, and that's something that I've done all too much and would love if I NEVER had to do again. Bottom line, as good as modern medicine/dentistry is at fixing things/ "replacment parts" - mother nature's original equipment is still better, so take the steps to protect it!

 

[mattchuck2]

Up . . .

Unless I'm teaching . . . then down, but reluctantly.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

Lets see, most lifts are maybe 50 feet in the air, a sudden line/grip failure resulting in the chair plunging to the ground at 9.8meters/second - that will give most folks maybe 2 seconds to say "oh sh*&" and make the mental descision to jump.

Sounds alot like the logic that some folks use to justify NOT wearing a seatbelt for that 0.1% crash where they'll end up with a jammed seatbelt underwater and the initial decelleration of the crash didn't kill them in the first place

Lift towers will range (on average) from 25 to 50 feet. And yup... gravity is 9.8m/s. So for the first chair to fall, those folks have 2 seconds. They're probably not going to make it. perhaps I should have been more clear, but the hypothetical I posed assumes that there is an obstruction on the line, be it on a sheave train or some sort of debris that has fallen on the haul rope. It would be a visible problem where you could see the chairs falling. In this case, you'd have more than 2 seconds to jump. Not much more, because it would likely only affect a handful of chairs before the E-brake is engaged. But enough that it could mean the difference of dying or being severely injured.

You may think that a lift would never drop more than one chair before stopping. But there have been multiple instances (Vail gondola incident, for example) where several carriers have fallen off the line before an operator was alerted. Newer chairs are equipped with sensors that would most likely stop the lift if the problem was on a sheave train. But if the obstruction was between towers in the middle of the line, it may still require operator intervention to stop the lift.

Again... I'm not agreeing with the CO law. I'm just giving you their side of the story, FWIW.

 

[sledhaulingmedic]

For example, given a scenario where there are chairs falling of the lift (for whatever reason... be creative)...

I don't need to be. One word: Yan.

 

[MarkC]

Up unless I am on duty.

 

[koreshot]

Most people have completely unrealistic expectations of how they will behave in emergency situations. This is particularly the case with men.

Jumping off a chair is not going to work. Yes there is a slight chance that one might save themselves by jumping off the chair but that same person is also 100 times more likely to either not react at all due to lack of attention or not enough time or panic and freeze.

This has been proven over and over and over again by the automobile industry. There are reasons why ABS, EBD, CBC and dynamic stability control and other active safety features have been such life savers on the road. They take over and do the driver's job during an emergency situation cause an average driver panics and does all the wrong things in those situations.

You are better off assuming that a scenario where you will have to jump off a lift to save your life is too unlikely to risk not having the bar down and do what statistically gives you the highest probability of safely getting to the top of the hill - sit back and keep the bar down until the last lift pole.

 

[ski_resort_observer]

I grew up with no safety bar so I guess I never really thought about and left it up but as time went on, chairlifts got safety bars and enough ski patrolman yelled at me I now put it down.

That last really steep section going dowhill into the landing zone at Mt Ellen on Slidebrook at the Bush, I'm holding on the back of the chair for dear life. That lift's a Disney ride.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

I don't need to be. One word: Yan.

:lol:

C'mon... be nice! Although there were some blatant failures, you have to recognize that Yan pioneered many of the concepts we see in use today. It just took some other companies to make them work.

It's too bad all of the failures overshadowed the good ideas that came out of poor Mr. Yan.

 

[kbroderick]

Down, unless I'm out West and trying very hard to pretend I'm not scared. I got used to not using safety bars while ski racing in Maine (where it's not state law and ski racers don't use the bar because (a) it's not cool and (b) it's much easier to carry a bundle of gates without putting the bar down), got in the habit of using 'em when I moved to Vermont...and got quite nervous when I was riding the quads at Alta that don't have bars. Quite frankly, though, I fail to see how Alta could get away with putting in new lifts without bars if there was a significant safety improvement in having them--wouldn't their insurance company force the issue?

 

[Greg]

Down here too. Always.

If I am on the lift with others who keep the bar up, I pretend to be cool and take one arm and wrap it around the back of the seat, like I'm cruisin or something. In reality I am clenching the metal bar that runs the length of the seat back with every last ounce of forearm energy. I can only go 5 to 10 minutes before my hand starts freezing and I need to swap.

Not sure if you're serious here, but why don't you just pull the bar down anyway? The others can deal....

 

[tjf67]

which bring up another question why the hell dont we get parachutes when we board planes. haha

 

[threecy]

A good portion of the people who leave the bar up in my observation are trying to be cool. Big whoop! Even with the foot rests in place, you can still let your legs hang (if you're doing a real sport).

 

[eatskisleep]

As a ski racer, it is very difficult to put down the bar when carrying gates. When not carrying gates, I typically leave it up, unless someone else wants it down. When skiing with a backpack, I tend to put the bar down.

 

[koreshot]

Down here too. Always.



Not sure if you're serious here, but why don't you just pull the bar down anyway? The others can deal....

I was only semi serious. I would rather have the bar down and I do sometimes wrap my arm around the back of the seat cause it makes me feel safer.