Fatal fall from Canyons chairlift

[drjeff]

Huh?

What about people driving around with no prior history of seizure? Not only can they die from the crash, they can kill other people too!

We can't live our life as though we'll have a seizure at any moment without any prior knowledge about it. Nor do we need to do so while skiing. What if it happens when actually skiing? Might hit a tree and die...

That's kind of the point I was trying to make. You never know when or if it will happen. So in some circumstances there are things that one can do very easily to help reduce risk, such as close a safety bar. Is it fool proof, no, but might it help keep one in the chair as opposed to falling to the ground, yes.

As for the driving one, yup, hardly a week goes by where you don't hear or read of something like that happening in the news, and that's just life. There are certain things that one can easily do to help decrease risk, but until you're dead, one will always be dealing with risk

 

[abc]

As for the driving one, yup, hardly a week goes by where you don't hear or read of something like that happening in the news, and that's just life.

I think that's it, "just life".

Not to bring up the most contentious topic. But when people argue about wearing a helmet on the slope, it always comes up to my mind why don't people wear helmet while in the car? After all, it's no more hassle than lowering the safety bar on the chair!

The real reason is, if the risk is small enough, people will not do even "easy" things to prevent it. Example of that is long: padding doors (so people entering in a rush don't crash into it and get a head injury); putting railing on internal stairs; padding bathtub in case of falls...

I spend a lot more hours driving everyday of the week, way more than the hours I spend sitting on chair lifts. Compare to that, the risk of seizure while on a lift is so small that yes, it's a risk I won't bother "preventing" by lowering the safety bar.

 

[vcunning]

The problem is that not everyone that suffers a seizure has a history of seizures and/or can always sense when one might be coming on

Much better to "plan for the worst" and get a better than expected outcome IMHO

Yep . . . my wife had one with zero warning, no symptoms three years ago. Fortunately, she wasn't on the lift, but we were on our way to VT.

 

[drjeff]

Yep . . . my wife had one with zero warning, no symptoms three years ago. Fortunately, she wasn't on the lift, but we were on our way to VT.

And fortunately your lovely wife had some great medical care and a great support network and is just a blast to be around today! (And she's pretty good at helping find the bottom of a bottle of pinot grigio or champagne too ;-) )

 

[Morwax]

My car has brakes but I dont like using them...

 

[drjeff]

I think that's it, "just life".

Not to bring up the most contentious topic. But when people argue about wearing a helmet on the slope, it always comes up to my mind why don't people wear helmet while in the car? After all, it's no more hassle than lowering the safety bar on the chair!

The real reason is, if the risk is small enough, people will not do even "easy" things to prevent it. Example of that is long: padding doors (so people entering in a rush don't crash into it and get a head injury); putting railing on internal stairs; padding bathtub in case of falls...

I spend a lot more hours driving everyday of the week, way more than the hours I spend sitting on chair lifts. Compare to that, the risk of seizure while on a lift is so small that yes, it's a risk I won't bother "preventing" by lowering the safety bar.

? For you ABC - Do you take the couple seconds it takes to buckle your seat belt when you get in your car?? If so, is that action so different from a risk standpoint than taking a couple of seconds to lower the safety bar on a chairlift??

 

[snoseek]

You're gonna love them....

Agree, those new bars are ridiculous!

I actually use the safety bar but skipped that one. There is nut busting potential!

 

[legalskier]

 

[abc]

? For you ABC - Do you take the couple seconds it takes to buckle your seat belt when you get in your car??

Let's see, a typical chair ride is what, 5-10 minutes? No, I don't always buckle up if the drive is only 5 minutes. (my average drive is more like 30 minute to multiple hours)

I do buckle up if the EXPECTED drive is more than 15 minutes. In between 5-15', depends on where I'm going. In my complex with little traffic and few cross street. I don't. But 10 minutes in New York City gunning for every light? I do.

I feel the danger of falling off the chair lift to be even smaller than a high speed accident in my complex, which is highly UN-likely to begin with.

More over, compare to seatbelt, safety bar has a long way to go:

• Even a child can pull on a seatbelt and buckle it up.
  
  The safety bar? not so much. On a quad, especially those with "footrest", the bars are extremely heavy. So if I'm on a quad by myself, I don't feel like wasting my energy to pull it down and then push it up. I'm more worry about falling off DURING those two operation than actually falling off without the bar!
  
  
• Seatbelts are quite comfortable.
  
  The safety bar? Not always. Those silly "footrest", are probably meant only for the average guy at 5'8. My feet got less rest on those "footrest" than just hanging about.

So, even though I buckle up in a car 90% of the time, I use the chair lift bar less than 10% by myself. If there're no seatmates lowering it, I won't. About the only exception is on a windy day, or on a very long ride.

As for my chance of having a seizure? Considering I drive minimum 10 hours a week to work and 10 additional hour to the ski hill, but only ride the chair lift less an hr or two a week, my chance of having that un-expected seizure happen while driving is 10-20 times more likely than while sitting on a chair lift!

I made my decision based on those odds.

 

[drjeff]

Let's see, a typical chair ride is what, 5-10 minutes? No, I don't always buckle up if the drive is only 5 minutes. (my average drive is more like 30 minute to multiple hours)

I do buckle up if the EXPECTED drive is more than 15 minutes. In between 5-15', depends on where I'm going. In my complex with little traffic and few cross street. I don't. But 10 minutes in New York City gunning for every light? I do.

I feel the danger of falling off the chair lift to be even smaller than a high speed accident in my complex, which is highly UN-likely to begin with.

More over, compare to seatbelt, safety bar has a long way to go:

• Even a child can pull on a seatbelt and buckle it up.
  
  The safety bar? not so much. On a quad, especially those with "footrest", the bars are extremely heavy. So if I'm on a quad by myself, I don't feel like wasting my energy to pull it down and then push it up. I'm more worry about falling off DURING those two operation than actually falling off without the bar!
  
  
• Seatbelts are quite comfortable.
  
  The safety bar? Not always. Those silly "footrest", are probably meant only for the average guy at 5'8. My feet got less rest on those "footrest" than just hanging about.

So, even though I buckle up in a car 90% of the time, I use the chair lift bar less than 10% by myself. If there're no seatmates lowering it, I won't. About the only exception is on a windy day, or on a very long ride.

As for my chance of having a seizure? Considering I drive minimum 10 hours a week to work and 10 additional hour to the ski hill, but only ride the chair lift less an hr or two a week, my chance of having that un-expected seizure happen while driving is 10-20 times more likely than while sitting on a chair lift!

I made my decision based on those odds.

You do realize that per insurance industry statistics that 70% of all auto accidents happen WITHIN 10 miles of one's home, don't you??

http://www.carinsurance.com/Articles/content31.aspx

Reason being that since one is presumed to be more familiar with their local area that they're more likely to be a bit more relaxed and "let their guard down" compared to when they're driving in an area not familiar to them.

Maybe you should consider adjusting your seat belt use, so that you increase your long term chances ats on the hill!

 

[abc]

You do realize that per insurance industry statistics that 70% of all auto accidents happen WITHIN 10 miles of one's home, don't you??

http://www.carinsurance.com/Articles/content31.aspx

Reason being...

Statistic can mislead just as much: what percentage of overall driving is within 10 minutes of people's home? When the first time that report came out, I looked. They didn't re-adjust that factor!

(why? because it's not easy to get accurate number of what percentage of everyone's driving within 10 mile of their own home)

If you look at the driving pattern for most people, almost 90% of their driving is within 10 miles of their home: dropping the kids off to school, getting grocery, going to the doctors, etc... Why is it any wonder 60% of accidents happen within 10 mile of their own home?

In other words, it's no more likely to have accident in short drive. Only most people do more short drives. Besides, 10 mile is usually 15 minute anywhere there's light or traffic. 5 minutes' driving, I'm still inside my subdivision.

For the same reason I don't drop the safety bar of chair lift because I simply don't spend enough time on the chair, statistically, there's little motivation to bother with seat belt on short drives, especially when there's little traffic or cross street.

 

[Nick]

You do realize that per insurance industry statistics that 70% of all auto accidents happen WITHIN 10 miles of one's home, don't you??

Reason being that since one is presumed to be more familiar with their local area that they're more likely to be a bit more relaxed and "let their guard down" compared to when they're driving in an area not familiar to them.

Not debating it but I've always been skeptical of that statistic. I've always kind of figured that no matter where you go or what you do, you are always driving from your house (unless you are on vacation). So the first 10 miles are always in that statistic. Most likely, most of your non work trips (grocery store, shopping, walking the dog) are all within 10 miles of your house as well.

In other words, it makes sense that most accidents are withing 10 miles of the home since the majority of your driving is within 10 miles of the home. Is the actual RATE per mile of accidents higher when within a radius of your house? Somehow, I doubt it.

 

[driven777]

So sad. Use your safety bar!