Planned day after Thanksgiving opening too. Very nice
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Big Burke announcement
- Thread starter the original trailboss
- Start date
I am pretty certain this means the HKD dumb towers that are on the upper section of Warren's get replaced by big expensive fan guns. The HKD's get moved around the top of the mountain to various spots. Seems like a commitment to the training hill.
The folks I know have said that last year would have been MUCH better if
a) they had more compressor horsepower early (i.e RENT DIESELS)
b) they had not frozen up the line over at the base of little dipper
c) gotten more done earlier so they had a better base when the extreme cold killed the water flow in the river and made it so they could not restock the pond.
A lack of guns was not really even on the list. There were many, many guns sitting idle at any time all winter.
The folks I know have said that last year would have been MUCH better if
a) they had more compressor horsepower early (i.e RENT DIESELS)
b) they had not frozen up the line over at the base of little dipper
c) gotten more done earlier so they had a better base when the extreme cold killed the water flow in the river and made it so they could not restock the pond.
A lack of guns was not really even on the list. There were many, many guns sitting idle at any time all winter.
Exactly. Throwing money at the wrong things.
Well in theory they will require less air by having the fan guns. Hopefully they still rent compressors too.
I would have preferred to hear that they WILL rent compressors in order to have the maximum capacity rather than throwing in some fan guns on one trail that is reserved largely for one major constituency. I'd be willing to bet that that "constituency" probably paid for those fan guns too.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
VERY disappointed that there is no mention of adding compressor capacity.
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Tough crowd. They announce a November opening and $1.1M in upgrades with two more upgrades planned and people are still upset? Not sure if they would announce compressor rentals in a capital improvement announcement anyways. Never seen another mountain announce what equipment they will be renting for the season.
I'd suggest you all vote with your wallets and ski elsewhere for a season. That's what I did this year after last year's snowmaking problems at Wildcat. Turns out their investment worked, so they won my business back.
I'd suggest you all vote with your wallets and ski elsewhere for a season. That's what I did this year after last year's snowmaking problems at Wildcat. Turns out their investment worked, so they won my business back.
from_the_NEK
Active member
There may be more compressor capacity in one of the next phases.
The upper mountain booster pump will actually fix the biggest bottleneck for making snow on the upper mountain. It doesn't matter how much air you have up there if there is no water. The combination of the new water booster pump and the fan guns (that don't need air) on the upper mountain. Should allow them to make snow on Upper Warrens and one of the other major upper mtn trails at the same time.
Here is the way I see them approaching the trail rollout next year.
1. The typical intermediate route of Upper Willoughby-Lower Bear Den-Lower Warrens Way AND an expert route consisting of Shoot-Upper Bear Den-Upper Warren's Way. Maybe throw Lower Fox's Folly into the mix as well. This will provide both an intermediate and an expert set of trails on the upper mountain.
2. Carriage Rd-Big Dipper-Open Slope AND Upper Warren's Way with the fan guns (That trail takes A LOT of snow to cover thoroughly).
3. Upper Dipper (this would be easier if they ever go through with the rock/stump removal/smoothing process that would allow them to open this trail with 1 foot of snow rather than 4 feet (in some places).
4. Little Dipper, The Gap, Ledges
VTKilarney
Well-known member
Good information about the pump. It sounds like it's at least a start, which makes sense if the entire plan is going to take three years to implement.
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fbrissette
Well-known member
When people get burnt, they tend to be cautious.
+1
These guys have lost credibility and now have to re-earn it. That is not going to be easy. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
Sure, folks can vote with their wallets and A LOT are. Me included to some limited degree. I am not recommending them on this site to folks like I used to.
I think that the bigger point is that the $1.1 m sounds great until you dig into the details and see that they are only partially fixing the problem. Fan guns are not going to help that much. And they will help the racing crowd. I still think that BMA and their "angels" are providing those guns. And then there is the question as to WHO will be using the training hill. Q threatened to increase fees on the school using the hill. Has that happened?
Right, but like I said, who announces compressor rentals with a capital improvements notice? No one I've ever seen. I tend to see things like fromtheNEK does. If I were a Burke pass holders I'd be thrilled that concrete plans are in place, not just lip service. Those fan guns will bury the training hill FAST. That's going to enable much faster terrain expansion elsewhere, especially if they're aiming for a Thanksgiving weekend opening.
I would have been more excited about the future of Burke if they announced they were spending $1.1M on an executive search committee to fill the position after Jr. is released as well as on re-branding and signing updates to remove the Q.
But maybe that is just me.
But maybe that is just me.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
It would have been wise to announce that they are "increasing compressor capacity" even if it is by renting them. Right now we don't know if they are actually going to rent them even though everyone agrees that they need to.
Unlike other resorts there is a huge trust issue on top of the operational issues. Hopefully this project will help reduce the problem if people see results.
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Unlike other resorts there is a huge trust issue on top of the operational issues. Hopefully this project will help reduce the problem if people see results.
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But see, again, context here is huge. They advertised a November opening back the first season that Q owned the place and they missed that. Granted it was weather related, but still they missed it.
As I understand it, the fan guns are going to be on Warren's Way, and it sounds like Upper Warren's Way. They don't even TRY to cover that portion until after Christmas in a normal year. So the fan guns don't help you open early there.
The biggest concern is the compressor capacity. That is the undisputed issue with why all of the sudden they can't do jack. Sure the water pumping issue will be helped, but before Q they were able to do a lot with what they had.
So yes, saying "we're renting compressors" is not something one would normally see from a resort, but considering the history here a single line about "we're increasing our air capacity" would have been appropriate and showed that they understood the problem.
The other factor that is lurking is that Q cannot find anyone to work for him. I know that the snowmaking crew last year was pretty small. Burke's system requires labor and if they don't have labor they are not going to be as efficient and fast.
:lol:
Only message board geeks know about the air pressure issue, so basically no one. You don't market to the lowest common denominator.
This is likely the single largest off season investment in snowmaking Burke has ever made yet you all still bitch. It's like reading Highwaystar in a Killington thread.
This is likely the single largest off season investment in snowmaking Burke has ever made yet you all still bitch. It's like reading Highwaystar in a Killington thread.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
I think caution is very warranted after their last "big improvement" announcement: http://www.skiburke.com/assets/Uploads/Articles/2012-Snowmaking-PR2-2.pdf
Actually, it was pretty widely known by the passholders that was the issue.
And bitching? No. Not at all. Looking at this critically, absolutely. That's what we've done here for over a decade, DHS.
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