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Big Burke announcement
- Thread starter the original trailboss
- Start date
Smellytele
Well-known member
and waterville
Yep, good one there!
Les Otten did briefly consider Burke back in the day...
mbedle
Well-known member
I was just reading a transcript from the SEC testimony before the Committee on Judiciary. It noted that the February 2013 fraud case was their first EB-5 fraud case. This was the EB-5 project involving a hotel and conference center in Chicago. That was settled by March 2014, with a return to investors of 145 million out of the 250 million. Given that timeframe, we may be looking at these places being sold rather quickly. Which may be a good thing for Q Burke if it does sell.
Assuming that there is a good competent buyer.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
I've been doing some back of the envelope calculations, and I'm definitely thinking that the investors are going to take a serious haircut.
One problem for the mountain is that there is already quite a bit of condo inventory. If the hotel units get sold off as condos, how many more condos can Burke really sell? I'm not saying that it can't be done. I'm just saying that it will take some effort if it is going to happen.
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I'm wondering how many will truly care about the money. My impression has always been that to at least some of them, the green card is more important than the money itself.
Of course if they don't get a green card, then I'm sure they would all be pissed about losing any money.
The investors will be bald. They are not going to go through the time and expense of trying to condo the hotel for individual sales to pay back investors. It will be sold as is. Someone else will condo it to get a return- see other thread for my thoughts. I dont know the condo market at Burke, but new product always seems to sell as opposed to old and tired.
I know there is not a lot to go on but comparing Chicago real estate and NEK is not realistic. Those investors got 58% back, there is no way Jay and Burke are going to bring in 116M (200M EB-5?) in sales.
fbrissette
Well-known member
Some of them got a green card out of it. The newer investors will likely be out of cash with no green cards.
VTKilarney
Well-known member
It's a myth that all of these investors only care about a green card. Many of them will feel a LOT of pain. However, the Receiver has gone on record saying that their primary concern is getting their green card. I can see why since many of them may not have enough money left to try EB-5 again.
mbedle
Well-known member
This guy must be friends with Quiros:
http://www.seattletimes.com/busines...defrauded-investors-in-eb-5-visa-fundraising/
http://www.seattletimes.com/busines...rgey-case-says-path-americas-finances-a-mess/
And an example of how they may go forth with a recovery plan:
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/2695883-Receiver-Report-Dargey.html
http://www.seattletimes.com/busines...defrauded-investors-in-eb-5-visa-fundraising/
http://www.seattletimes.com/busines...rgey-case-says-path-americas-finances-a-mess/
And an example of how they may go forth with a recovery plan:
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/2695883-Receiver-Report-Dargey.html
So what is it about the EB-5 program that attracts scammers? Taking advantage of foreigners?
trackbiker
Active member
I'm surprised that there is not an annual independent audit required for these projects.....but then again I'm not. I think the developers felt that no one was watching when they put their hands in the cookie jar. I think you will also find that the cost of these projects were greatly inflated with the developers getting kickbacks or owning the construction and service companies with no competitive bids.
I think the scammers realize that the people investing in the program are more interested in the green card than in the investment return and, therefore, will not scrutinize the proposals as closely as someone who just wants to profit. They will also be less likely to pull their money out when the promised returns fail to materialize if that means they have to give up the green card. It's the government subsidies (i.e., the added value of the green cards) that make the program so irresistible to scammers and crooks.
freeski
New member
I think I read there was a $720M plan by Q&S for the Jay expansion. This covered 2 hotels a lift and 12 trails. When I saw this number I was thinking the same thing with an emphasis on "greatly".
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
ROTFLMAO.
Serious question, does anybody know what Jay Peak's finance department looks like? Do they just have a CFO and maybe 1 financial analyst and that's it? Is accounting outsourced or something? I'm genuinely curious how such massive and obvious problems weren't being caught by.......well.....someone. Even a 22 year old junior accountant fresh out of UVM should have looked at a JE like this and been suspicious (or at least wondered what the hell's going on).
2012.
Let me repeat that; 2012.
Nobody told these guys people dont wear suit & tie in Vermont? Commence culture shock.
BenedictGomez
Well-known member
About $700 an hour? And here I thought Stenger & Quiros were the crooks. This guy's Gansta!
At some of the passholder meetings there was a guy there name George Gulisano, self-introduced as "just a bean counter". He was (is?) the CFO for Q Resorts and was essentially Ari Sr's employee. On the BOD for Burke as the CFO as well. Spends half of his time in VT and the other half in Miami (shuffling money?). I think he came on board when the other CFO at Jay Peak grew a conscience. It's likely only a matter of time before his name floats to the surface in the SEC defendants lists. He was mentioned by Q Sr in the '14 SEC interview, where he tried to throw him under the bus saying something along the lines of 'if any money was moved around, it was probably by George Gulisano at Jay Peak' <that's not a direct quote, but close>. Probably then followed by 'I don't know, I don't know - but I'll get the answers for you. We'll get to the bottom of this. We'll make the NEK Great Again!'
fbrissette
Well-known member
My understanding is the same as KingdomBC.
George Gulisano is the CFO, and AFAIK, is only surrounded by nice ladies doing the basic paper work. As a condo board member, I can tell you they have always been disorganized and especially so this past year. We haven't been getting any financial reports since last summer. Since they do our accounting and are our main service provider, it's been frustrating working with them.
George Gulisano is the CFO, and AFAIK, is only surrounded by nice ladies doing the basic paper work. As a condo board member, I can tell you they have always been disorganized and especially so this past year. We haven't been getting any financial reports since last summer. Since they do our accounting and are our main service provider, it's been frustrating working with them.
DoublePlanker
Member
The lawyers will get paid first. I hope there is enough money to keep the mountains open. Jay shouldn't be a problem. But QB could get rough if the receiver needs to operate at a profit.
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