Big Burke announcement

[thetrailboss]

Here is a re-post from Burke's HSQ construction thread ( http://forums.alpinezone.com/showth...-and-Other-Improvements/page4?highlight=burke ). It is a little dated but I haven't had time to rebuild everything in Google Earth since my computer crashed while back:

I've also been messing around in Google Earth with what Burke would look like at full lift buildout (assuming the West Bowl is built out 50 years from now ).
The Purple lines are exisiting lifts.
Green and white polygons are where I would put trails (if I had too). Ignore the skinny white one that cuts across the East Bowl lift, it's the current East Bowl runout trail.

The Red lines are lifts that haven't been built yet. From left to right they are:

East Bowl lift (planned) - 1400 ft vert

Mid-Burke Express (under construction) - 1565 ft vert

West Peak lift (theoretical) - 1565 ft vert (the top 700 ft avg 48% slope [compare to the top 700 ft section of the Castlerock liftline is 44% :grin:]).

----Discuss-----

Thumbs up. This has been the plan for several decades.

 

[from_the_NEK]

Not too many resorts around with 3 1400'+vert terrain pods. Each served by one lift.

 

[Big Wave Dave]

this thread is hilarious.

the sky was falling until ONE person sends in a post, now we are planning development out 50 years

either way, good stuff here and some good info.

 

[from_the_NEK]

this thread is hilarious.

Whatever I can do to help

 

[VTKilarney]

now we are planning development out 50 years

Yeah, but it's 2% funded, so now is the time to line up contractors!

 

[ChicoKat]

From what I've been hearing Q wants to compete with KT for whatever reason (?)

Thanks trailboss. That is shear lunacy if they are going down that path. I guess they have pissed off the people that have a direct interest in the mountain now they want to expand to the KT land owner cooperative.

 

[thetrailboss]

Thanks trailboss. That is shear lunacy if they are going down that path. I guess they have pissed off the people that have a direct interest in the mountain now they want to expand to the KT land owner cooperative.

To be specific, I've heard from reliable sources that he wants to expand lift served biking at the mountain and run the Mid-Burke Express. Some of the trails on the mountain were built gratis by KT volunteers.

In December Q-2 made some pretty inciteful comments about KT going so far as accusing former management as having a conflict of interest with KT and KT "taking advantage" of the mountain. As many of us recall, he lashed out at a particular biker who put that Email up online. The Email expressed the same sentiment.

I know that lately we have not seen any more outbursts, but that was a pretty irrational action that flies in the face of all business sense. So I just don't understand it.

I understand if they need to cut costs and if they would need to renegotiate the arrangement. But I think that the benefits of the deal went both ways. Now KT is shifting folks away from the mountain to the Wildflower.

United we stand; divided we fall (?)

 

[WWF-VT]

Not too many resorts around with 3 1400'+vert terrain pods. Each served by one lift.

Doesn't Sunday River already have like six or seven ?

 

[from_the_NEK]

Doesn't Sunday River already have like six or seven ?

Most of their pods are shorter. Only the Locke Mtn and Barker Mtn lifts cover at least 1400' of vert and they are right on the 1400' cutoff.

 

[DJAK]

Andrew,

What is the meaning of life and how will it impact EB5 funding?

 

[from_the_NEK]

It is all answered here:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085959/

 

[thetrailboss]

Andrew,

What is the meaning of life and how will it impact EB5 funding?

Boy I don't think we have time for that one. :lol:

 

[Andrew]

Man, this thread moves fast.....

@xlr8r, at the moment there aren't any concrete plans involving the Willoughby. Some ideas floating around, but to my knowledge, nothing that's set in stone. And that's ok, while it doesn't get used very often it still is a reliable back-up to the Mid Burke in case that were to go down.

@From_The_NEK, I like where your head's at. And now I will spend the next week dreaming about lift served runs in West Bowl....

@VTKilarney, 25% applies to the whole project, not just the hotel. East Bowl is a pretty awesome trail in any condition, but it's definitely fun every once in awhile as a groomer. Glad you enjoyed it. There's been some discussion about the area between Sherburne and Mid-Burke, I don't have anything solid I can offer on that but I'll certainly look into it and see what I can dig up.

Regarding the KT relationship, no doubt some feathers were ruffled early on, but I think now everyone involved realizes that a relationship, however that ends up being defined, between the mountain and KT is a good thing for both entities and for the region as a whole. There are discussions currently going on to finalize what that relationship looks like (and as such I can't get too specific), but there will be a relationship and we'll complement each other, not compete with each other. NEMBAFest is going to be a great event, I highly suggest anyone thinking about going to head over to Darling Hill and check it out. They've got some great stuff lined up and some real good music that I know I'm going to check out.

@DJAK ....... such important questions should only be discussed with a sufficient supply of Heady Topper close by.

Hope you guys get the chance to get out and get some spring skiing/riding in, should be awesome out there.

 

[Quietman]

Most of their pods are shorter. Only the Locke Mtn and Barker Mtn lifts cover at least 1400' of vert and they are right on the 1400' cutoff.

Jordan is about 1360' so it almost counts.

 

[VTKilarney]

I had a chance to look at the topo map for Burke last night. You can pull one up here: http://www.mytopo.com/maps/

Based on the topo map, I'm having a hard time seeing how a pod off of a truncated Willoughby Quad would provide decent intermediate terrain. The intermediate pitch seems to end not far from the top of the Sherburne Express. It looks like there would only be about 400 vertical feet of intermediate terrain that could realistically be opened up above the Sherburne chair.

On the other hand, the East Bowl looks like prime intermediate terrain. You can easily get about 1,000 vertical feet of consistent intermediate pitch there.

 

[from_the_NEK]

The point of serving upper level beginners/lower intermediates was brought up at Burke's "Envisioning Session" last Spring. http://forums.alpinezone.com/showth...ble-discussion?p=774881&viewfull=1#post774881 There is a pretty big leap going from the green terrain of the lower mountain to the difficult Blue terrain of the upper mountain. Who knows if a trailpod like this created off of a shortened Willoughby chair will ever happen, but it would be a really good addition to helping progress the skills of Burke skiers.

Topo maps are good but they have to be too generalized to really show accurate slope. Google Earth (not Google Maps) has really revolutionized terrain reading since you can look at things from different angles a pick out nuances of the terrain.

In the design above, the shortened Willoughby is supposed serve a pod of lower intermediate terrain that is a stepping stone to the rest of the mountain. As drawn the Willoughby chair covers about 800’ of vertical. After the traverse across slope, the new trails on skiers left of Lower Willoughby would cover 550’ of vertical before cutting back above the top of the Sherburne trail, but then they still have the last pitch of Lower Willoughby (100+’ ) to ski down to get back to the Willoughby lift. The trail far skier’s left that connects into Bunker Hill covers over 900’ from the top of the Willoughby chair.
If you go any higher on the mountain, you start to get into the band of fairly steep terrain and begin to negate the purpose of the pod. This is especially true in East Bowl. The upper 1/3 of the East Bowl is very steep in most places. To build intermediate terrain over there would require A LOT of blasting to build wide smooth trails, then you would also have to add snowmaking. A project like that would destroy the tree skiing in the East Bowl.

 

[burski]

its been too long since we have heard from Burke! not sure if there is anything new here or not?
http://vtdigger.org/2014/04/20/special-project-nek-projects-slowed-stalled-eb-5-approvals/

 

[thetrailboss]

its been too long since we have heard from Burke! not sure if there is anything new here or not?
http://vtdigger.org/2014/04/20/special-project-nek-projects-slowed-stalled-eb-5-approvals/

I think this is all you need to know:

Jay Peak Resort’s multimillion dollar side projects in Newport and Burke are delayed due to a slowdown in investor recruitment.

I don't think it's anyone's fault, per se, but more a reflection of more competition for these dollars.

They're still saying this:

Jay Peak president and partial owner Bill Stenger and majority owner Ariel Quiros say they’re confident construction will begin this summer at AnC Bio, their planned biotechnology research park in Newport, and at Q Burke Mountain, Jay Peak’s newly acquired sister ski area in Burke.

Not good.....

Before they access the money they’ve already raised, the developers are waiting for the EB-5 projects’ early investors to receive visa approvals from U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, which administers the EB-5 program.

In the meantime, other potential investors whose capital is needed to complete the financing plans are wary of placing their money in a project until they see that job creation and business plans have gotten a green light. A few investors who placed their money behind the AnC project have asked for a refund. Data is not available on the nationwide incidence of EB-5 refunds.

“We have refunded a handful of investor funds due to the delay, but those spots have been taken up quickly by others,” Stenger said by email from Shanghai on April 15. He was in Asia for investor recruitment events, two of which were attended by Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., and Rep. Peter Welch, D-Vt., as part of a trip to Asia for a broader diplomatic mission.

 

[SkiRaceParent]

It sounds to me like, barring a 360, the hotel project is, once red tape is broken, a go. They seem to be putting their credibility (at least that which still exists) on the line on making that claim. To me, just getting the hotel done, for Burke, is most important. I've viewed everything else as something in between a questionable investment and a pipe dream.

 

[thetrailboss]

It sounds to me like, barring a 360, the hotel project is, once red tape is broken, a go. They seem to be putting their credibility (at least that which still exists) on the line on making that claim. To me, just getting the hotel done, for Burke, is most important. I've viewed everything else as something in between a questionable investment and a pipe dream.

The hotel is key for Burke. It was what Northern Star realized right before it was too late.

The hope from folks I've talked with is that it be personalized for Burke rather than just a "cut and paste" of the Tram Haus.