How to ski powder

[cbcbd]

Figured this would be useful, especially after the "too much powder" thread.

No, I don't have the answer and would like to learn more tips, especially with this weekend coming up.

So, what are some deep powder tips?

 

[riverc0il]

hate to say it, but you won't need to worry about skiing deep powder this weekend. that said, stay centered and keep the tips up. the mentality of skiing groomers and packed powder is your edge controls your turn. try to edge in powder and you'll be falling down a lot. the turn is done more with the base of the ski rather than the edge. you can hop back and forth to make the turn, sinking down at the end of your turn and popping up and over the snow in transition during certain powder consistency. that is another thing, powder skiing technique varies by consistency. this storm dropped very dense snow which requires a vastly different technique than blower powder and there are many variants in between. taking a lesson on a powder day wouldn't be a bad idea. once you have that "ah ha!!" moment you will be all set. just getting to that moment seems difficult at first. i didn't like powder when i didn't have the technique, now there is nothing i would rather ski.

 

[RIDEr]

Snowboard and you'll float on the powder... :lol::lol::lol:

 

[Birdman829]

Fore-aft balance becomes even more important than it normally is.

 

[rob56789]

Heres a link to a thread earlier this year on skiing powder http://forums.alpinezone.com/10378-skiing-powder-vs-skiing-groomed-runs.html

 

[SkiDork]

hate to say it, but you won't need to worry about skiing deep powder this weekend. that said, stay centered and keep the tips up. the mentality of skiing groomers and packed powder is your edge controls your turn. try to edge in powder and you'll be falling down a lot. the turn is done more with the base of the ski rather than the edge. you can hop back and forth to make the turn, sinking down at the end of your turn and popping up and over the snow in transition during certain powder consistency. that is another thing, powder skiing technique varies by consistency. this storm dropped very dense snow which requires a vastly different technique than blower powder and there are many variants in between. taking a lesson on a powder day wouldn't be a bad idea. once you have that "ah ha!!" moment you will be all set. just getting to that moment seems difficult at first. i didn't like powder when i didn't have the technique, now there is nothing i would rather ski.

The trees will have pow this weekend, no doubt.

BTW - for me the trick was to get fat skis. It came naturally after that. I sucked on skinny skis in the pow.

 

[ts01]

As long as you keep your speed up no matter how bad the leg burn gets .. I found that out yesterday.. :roll:

True. Two things that really eased powder skiing for me were:

1 - keeping your speed up in pow means giving in to gravity; point em downhill, don't try to crank out the turns as on groomed.

2 think about lifting UP your outside (downhill) arm in turns. Helps to shift a little weight from the outside/downhill ski to the inside/uphill ski.

 

[goldsbar]

It's really very similar. You just need to make some small changes.

1. Perfect your short turns on groomers. There are many good books on this - I like the ones by Harald Harb. Instructors can also help, of course, but are more $ and make sure you get a good one.

2. Skis close for maximum floatation, poles wide for balance.

3. Tipping still works. The difference is, unlike carving groomers, you don't want nearly 100% of your weight on the outside ski. Your weight needs to be more balanced over both skis. The movements are also less subtle. You'll still want to transfer weight between skis, just not as much.

4. Body should always face down the fall line - same as your short turns on groomers.

5. Powder, cuttup and crud really like to push you back on your skis. I need to constantly think about pulling my feet back in these situations (pulling your feet back puts your weight forward - I'll save you years of suffering by shouting NEVER LEAN FORWARD to achieve this purpose ). You want to remain balanced fore-aft. Don't believe the old saying about leaning back in powder, it's not true.

6. Cheat and buy some nice wide skis for powder days. Really does make a big difference.

7. Keep up your speed and don't be afraid - the powder will slow you down.

8. Steeper is better and much easier.

9. You won't get to use it much around here! At least in the Catskills, that storm we just got would barely be considered powder at Alta.

 

[Puck it]

Keeping the tips up by leaning back is an urban myth. You want to be balanced on skis with forward pressure on your boots to keep the tips from getting away from you. The skis should be togehter on moderate slopes but can get wider as the slope steepens. It is all about balance and knowing where your tips are.

 

[Birdman829]

3. Tipping still works. The difference is, unlike carving groomers, you don't want nearly 100% of your weight on the outside ski. Your weight needs to be more balanced over both skis. The movements are also less subtle. You'll still want to transfer weight between skis, just not as much.

My only issue with this has nothing to do with powder technique, but rather with groomer technique. On modern shaped skis your weight should be much closer to 50/50 downhill/uphill. Keeping all your weight on your downhill ski is an old school straight ski technique that hasn't gone away. Although I do still pressure my downhill ski almost 100% when I'm making a really hard turn on ice or something. Old habits die hard.

 

[goldsbar]

My only issue with this has nothing to do with powder technique, but rather with groomer technique. On modern shaped skis your weight should be much closer to 50/50 downhill/uphill. Keeping all your weight on your downhill ski is an old school straight ski technique that hasn't gone away. Although I do still pressure my downhill ski almost 100% when I'm making a really hard turn on ice or something. Old habits die hard.

100% disagree but this debate could go on forever! I have no old school left in me and completely embrace the modern technique. Probably becuase I wasn't much into technique in the old school days.

If you're making modern tip and rip rr track turns your weight will naturally go to the outside ski. If you're making complete high g turns where your skis end up essentially perpendicular to the fall line at completion you'd have to try very hard not to end up with most of your weight on the outside ski (100%, 90%, 80% is debatable). This also results, as you indicated, in the best grip on hard surfaces since you're putting the most pressure in a small area (think ice skates). The 50/50 thing is more for very soft snow such as powder and mush. Even here, it's more like 70/30 than 50/50.

Sorry, I get a little pasionate when I here 50/50!

 

[SIKSKIER]

I'm in total agreement with goldspar in both posts.Good pointers in almost all other posts.

 

[bigbog]

powder.............

Agreeing with everything....$.01....said in different manner previous....*Narrow-up your turn-width! ....as said, "point em' down the fall-line". There isn't as much resistance from powder, thus...if you start carving a wide arc....unless you can press em' down into denser snow(risking bottom-out = faceplant) to shrink turn-size, you're gonna be in for a slightly longer trip than anticipated... Of course the newer sidecuts now help a great deal, but don't expect them to make up 100% for the softer snow. Get some angulation started during transition, just like on hardpack..imo!??(JimG/riverc0il..Y/N)..and the sidecut will work its magic.. It may not be sound instruction, but it sure allows me to do whatever I want lots easier than waiting. Do I sound paranoid?:lol: Durin my last trip down CantDog Glade(@Loaf) last season, I went into my la-la_mode...and had much too much excitement with trees.

the_other_Steve

 

[riverc0il]

The trees will have pow this weekend, no doubt.

BTW - for me the trick was to get fat skis. It came naturally after that. I sucked on skinny skis in the pow.

fat skis help. i would be surprised if you find pow any where in bounds this weekend. except where lifts were on hold at least speaking of skinny skis, i decided this week i need to step up to 100 under foot, 80 & 90 get the job done but just weren't where i wanted to be this week.

 

[awf170]

fat skis help. i would be surprised if you find pow any where in bounds this weekend. except where lifts were on hold at least speaking of skinny skis, i decided this week i need to step up to 100 under foot, 80 & 90 get the job done but just weren't where i wanted to be this week.

I really think that someone needs to make a small reverse camber, reverse side cut ski for the east. Make it super light weight and have dimensions around 105-115-95. Have it come in a 170 and a 180. For some reason I just think that would be sweet.

 

[ckofer]

I've got these bitchin Atomic race bindings that allow the fore/aft position of the binding to be adjusted about 1.5" or so. Send them back for powder & you won't be sitting back. On the icy stuff, you set them forward to a setting called extrem

 

[John84]

I really think that someone needs to make a small reverse camber, reverse side cut ski for the east. Make it super light weight and have dimensions around 105-115-95. Have it come in a 170 and a 180. For some reason I just think that would be sweet.

I've heard of people talk of reverse camber and reverse sidecut skis before, but never understood how that would benefit. Care to explain?

 

[Birdman829]

I've heard of people talk of reverse camber and reverse sidecut skis before, but never understood how that would benefit. Care to explain?

Basically the concept is that most skis are designed to perform on a hard surface. They have camber and sidecut to carve turns on groomers. The mechanics of turning in powder are very different than turning on groomers (powder is sort of fluid like rather than a hard surface). Waterskis have reverse camber and reverse sidecut, why not powder skis? That is the basic concept behind Volant Spatulas, K2 Pontoons, Praxis Powders, Goode Scoops, and any other ski like that.

I've never skied any of them but my understanding is that the concept works in reality as well.

The problem I think Austin has is that these skis are usually made only in longer lengths (the Spat AFAIK was only ever available in a 186). This is ideal for open bowls and such, but not for tight eastern trees and such. Most would argue that the reverse camber makes the ski have very little effective edge and thus are easier to swing around if you're in a tight spot so the ski skis shorter so it may be a moot point.

 

[awf170]

The problem I think Austin has is that these skis are usually made only in longer lengths (the Spat AFAIK was only ever available in a 186). This is ideal for open bowls and such, but not for tight eastern trees and such. Most would argue that the reverse camber makes the ski have very little effective edge and thus are easier to swing around if you're in a tight spot so the ski skis shorter so it may be a moot point.

Basically. Also, the weight sucks. Also, like I pointed out with my dimensions it wouldn't be as fat as other reverse camber/side cut skis.

JD: You have a pair of Spatulas, right?

 

[JD]

Nope. No spats. My skis started as a Rossi Axiome. We've done some work.
they are 165cm, soft tip, set back almost toe on center of the side cut, stiff short tail with mild rocker in the front. Not really reverse camber like a spat, just bow rocker, like a creek boat. In soft snow they are a dream. Great low to medium speed noodlers. they are 112mm under foot, not much side cut at all, but some.

With a ski that has reverse camber, they are ready to turn, just roll 'em over. Not so much energy needed to flex the ski into a curve.

For me, I want a ski where the tip will not dive in powder. I have the "Fish" of skis now. If you are skiing from the back of your boot you're asking for an ACL injuruy, and you're not really using the ski properly. You HAVE to be able to weight the tip or your turn are bullshit IMO.

A friend of mine reps for Drake, formerly Drake Binary. This basic premis is the reason for the Tabla Rosa, And now that they have their construction technique dialed in, we will have tortionally still, light, fat as a muther skis that you can actually ski from the front of your boot, even in that 4 percent Utah Pow. My buddy was on some Stormriders for our tour in the notch today, he had the perfect ski for the density. 121-91-117 and stiff.