Information Privacy

[hammer]

What I find interesting is that I'm sure the NSA or some other government organization has the capability to unlock it, but it's probably classified Top Secret/SCI so they can't help out the FBI.

That's right...FBI agents can't get clearances or access...:roll:

 

[Funky_Catskills]

I once had to figure out the combo to an old 4 digit (0-9) combination lock I found in my house. Took 2 hours with a brute force attack of trying every combo, and that was due to the misfortune of the combination starting with the number "9" and trying 95% of the wrong combos before getting the right one. So it's not hard to brute force it at all (just incredibly tedious) and would probably only take an hour on average.

I use 8 digits.. safer from the Govt spying on my personal stuff...

 

[skiNEwhere]

That's right...FBI agents can't get clearances or access...:roll:

Not sure if you've worked with clearances before. Just because you have a top secret doesn't mean you can access everything that's Top Secret. There's SCI, or Sensitive Compartmented Information. Which means if you're designing fail-safe systems for nuclear reactors, you can't access the technical details of the B-52 bomber to find out its radar capabilities (unless you've been granted access to that compartment, which would require a separate investigation and polygraph). The whole system is setup like this because to limit the damage caused by people like hansen, snowden, aimes, etc...

This incident, while tragic, may not be large enough on the NSA and DHS radar for them to reveal that they can crack an iphone, as those departments seem to be focused on stopping large scale, orchestrated attacks.

 

[Funky_Catskills]

That's right...FBI agents can't get clearances or access...:roll:

The FBI has possession of the iPhone..

 

[hammer]

Not sure if you've worked with clearances before. Just because you have a top secret doesn't mean you can access everything that's Top Secret. There's SCI, or Sensitive Compartmented Information. Which means if you're designing fail-safe systems for nuclear reactors, you can't access the technical details of the B-52 bomber to find out its radar capabilities (unless you've been granted access to that compartment, which would require a separate investigation and polygraph). The whole system is setup like this because to limit the damage caused by people like hansen, snowden, aimes, etc...

This incident, while tragic, may not be large enough on the NSA and DHS radar for them to reveal that they can crack an iphone, as those departments seem to be focused on stopping large scale, orchestrated attacks.

Yup, got it...need to know and all that stuff. Still think that where there's a will there's a way...or that no one really knows how to crack the phone and that the FBI is trying to force Apple to come up with a way to do it.

 

[Funky_Catskills]

I Apple complies - I'm dumping my iPhone..
I'll switch to Droid and encrypt it myself..

 

[hammer]

I Apple complies - I'm dumping my iPhone..
I'll switch to Droid and encrypt it myself..

Do Android phones have a limited number of password attempts? I've never encrypted data on my phone (have nothing on it worth hiding) so I don't know much about the feature...

 

[Funky_Catskills]

Do Android phones have a limited number of password attempts? I've never encrypted data on my phone (have nothing on it worth hiding) so I don't know much about the feature...

Not sure.. Doubtful

I have a ton of personal stuff on my phone.. Secret work stuff.. and even data thats security level authorized.
It needs to be encrypted...

 

[180]

this is a tough question, but lets see Apple has used our country's, laws to make billions and hide billions as well. They should comply with the law or appeal. The knew this issue would come up one day.

 

[Funky_Catskills]

Set a horribly bad precedent..

Make a law that every tech company has to make a back door..
But to make them create a new OS to get around this after all of us use Apple for it's security - among other things..
Is just wrong and intrusive..

 

[prsboogie]

Do Android phones have a limited number of password attempts? I've never encrypted data on my phone (have nothing on it worth hiding) so I don't know much about the feature...

You can set a numeric or password lock which after 10 attempts, resets to factory including your SD card if you have one. Problem is you don't have to set one

 

[darent]

seems this should never have gone public,by the government going public and taking it to court in put apple on a spot.seems they could have quietly worked something out that wouldn't have opened pandoras box.

 

[prsboogie]

^^this

 

[ctenidae]

seems this should never have gone public,by the government going public and taking it to court in put apple on a spot.seems they could have quietly worked something out that wouldn't have opened pandoras box.

Agree, sort of, but imagine the shitstorm against both Apple and the government if word got out.

Part of me says there should be no expectation of privacy for criminal activity, but to enact that creates a vulnerability that is easily exploited (as all are, eventually). Plus I'm not all for giving the government easier access to snooping tools. It is a thorny problem.

 

[prsboogie]

Agree, sort of, but imagine the shitstorm against both Apple and the government if word got out.

Part of me says there should be no expectation of privacy for criminal activity, but to enact that creates a vulnerability that is easily exploited (as all are, eventually). Plus I'm not all for giving the government easier access to snooping tools. It is a thorny problem.

You know there used to be a time in this country when things didn't "get out" and we were no worse off for it. Actually I believe we are given way too much information about everything.

 

[Funky_Catskills]

Why does the dispute matter?

Simply put, the government contends that cooperation in cases like this could help prevent future terrorist attacks against Americans.

Privacy advocates and Apple supporters say they worry that if the F.B.I. succeeds in getting access to the software overriding Apple’s encryption, it would create easy access for the government in many future investigations.

Apple senior executives, for their part, have said their defiance was not a business choice. But cooperating with the government now could quickly lead to murkier situations internationally, especially in China, where officials have been pushing for greater control over the encryption and security of technology sold there.

China has become Apple’s second-largest market after the United States. People there spent $59 billion on Apple products in the last fiscal year.

Saying yes to the United States government could make it hard for Apple to later say no to China, and saying no could significantly affect the company’s bottom line.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/03/03/technology/apple-iphone-fbi-fight-explained.html?_r=0

 

[Funky_Catskills]

You know there used to be a time in this country when things didn't "get out" and we were no worse off for it. Actually I believe we are given way too much information about everything.

That cause things used to be physically locked up in files..
And stuff happened behind closed doors...

I think the information firehose is good - there just needs to be some balance.. But as a people - we now feel entitled to just about everything because it's easy to get..

 

[ctenidae]

I think the information firehose is good - there just needs to be some balance.. But as a people - we now feel entitled to just about everything because it's easy to get..

The trouble is that we, as a society, don't know how to handle the information, in either direction. We put far to much information out there ourselves, and don't know how to control that. We also don't have anything approaching critical thinking skills (exhibit 1, the current political landscape), so we don't know what to do with, or think about, the information we do have access to.

I can't imagine there's a good historical precedent for the information revolution we're in now. Guttenberg? The Enlightenment? The end of the Dark Ages? Information isn't limited to those who have the resources to access it, so knowledge is no longer power. If everyone has the information, maybe it doesn't matter what information they have. What matters is how they decide to use it.

I have the utmost confidence in people's ability to misuse it.

 

[prsboogie]

This

 

[SkiFanE]

This +100. I don't trust anyone. The companies that store the data, those that own it. I'm a nut about this stuff .

I thought apple was asked to allow brute force so they can use machines to break in - but they can't do that with 10 tries before its wiped. I thought that was an Apple setting - not something you have a choice about (?).

I applaud Apple. What cracks me up is the hypocrisy of people. "I need guns to protect myself from the government, tyranny!" Bwahahahaha... Govt doesn't need guns anymore. They can destroy you quickly if they have all your personal information. The fact that people think that the govt needs this backdoor to keep us safe is so fucking ridiculous - it proves people are clueless about tech. You use waze? Read what info they store about you. Way beyond anything that they need for traffic. Someone subpoenas waze... Yeah yeah yeah I'm paranoid - the fact that trump has gotten as far as he has is reason enough to think the unthinkable could happen!

today our most personal everything is captured and stored somewhere. And the govt wants the right to get at it. Its like allowing them to have a guy in your house observing your life and listening in on all your calls and doctors appts. 40 years ago we'd have thought that was intrusion....No thanks. I minimize my digital footprint as much as possible nowadays without being a complete ludite lol.

(or Feds are pulling our leg and really have a way but don't want to let that out - lmao....I can only hope they're that smart)