Jay Peak Conceptual Development Plan (2011-2016)

[Steve@jpr]

Affordablity

I think we do a pretty fair job of keeping pricing as low as possible-both for downcountry folks and locals. While $16 may feel prohibitive for 5 and under (and, actually, reloads are $11), they can get a season pass for $30 (as identified previously). For local kids, we have more than a dozen local schools (and more than 500 kids) who participate in our Straight A program whereby honor roll kids ski and ride for free all year. More than a dozen schools participate in our Foundation Program where kids get $12 lift tickets ($15 includes rentals) and free instruction season passes for these same kids are $219. We're also the only major resort, (and have been since I've been in VT) that offers a daily discount for Vermonters and doesn't limit reduced pass prices to frozen January Tuesdays. And for vacationers, I would love to hear of a better deal than $299 for a night in a ski-in/out brand new hotel, 4 lifts tickets and 4 waterpark passes. We can agree to bang on Jay Peak for lots of things including/not limited to, selling out, silly marketing, and even those extra 10 lbs we've been trying to drop, but maligning us for not making the sport comparably affordable is a difficult platform to support imo.

Hey, I'm jealous that day rates at Jay could even be a problem - meaning, I wish I had jay in my back yard, and had to juggle between a bunch of good mountains.

You know, even living up there, maybe take a look at there stateside hotel promo - don't know where you live exactly, but if you had a hankering for a night at the hotel, it seems basically like staying over night for free - or skiing for free,, how ever you want to look at it. Might make a nice mid week getaway.... I think it was, family of four for $249/night, ski and stay.....

 

[kingdom-tele]

All sounds good Steve. J certainly does a great job with the school programs as my niece will attest to.

Its not a platform though. Spending $40 instead of $100+ to ski is pretty easy math. I think maybe we are just not major resort skiers at this point in our family ski lives.

 

[tnt]

Heh. I don't know...the selling out argument can go on for days, but I like the fact that Jay seems to be handling it with a certain sense of humor, and kind of...edge. Don't really get the fairly combative tones sometimes found over on facebook. I mean, I get it, trying to keep this raw kind of local flair, say what we mean, thing going I guess, but it reads pretty rough sometimes. Not that you were asking!

And you know, there were other minor glitches, which I would be happy to share privately, but over all, enjoyed it and thought it was a very nice value for a Jersey family of four looking for four days on a large mountain. In the running again this year, but will most likely try some place closer to home for our x-mas trip.

Any way - seems like it's all been said...

Maybe I'll find our pics from last year and do a trip report thing over in that other forum....

 

[Steve@jpr]

Hey, I got lots of unsolicited feedback no worries. I guess we just respond in the manner and tone we're addressed. It's probably not guest service 101 but when someone goes on a social platform an shoots before aiming, they're going to get some tone back. Like I said, probably not the most artful approach but it is what it is and will likely continue to be.

Enjoy your trips wherever they take you.

Heh. I don't know...the selling out argument can go on for days, but I like the fact that Jay seems to be handling it with a certain sense of humor, and kind of...edge. Don't really get the fairly combative tones sometimes found over on facebook. I mean, I get it, trying to keep this raw kind of local flair, say what we mean, thing going I guess, but it reads pretty rough sometimes. Not that you were asking!

And you know, there were other minor glitches, which I would be happy to share privately, but over all, enjoyed it and thought it was a very nice value for a Jersey family of four looking for four days on a large mountain. In the running again this year, but will most likely try some place closer to home for our x-mas trip.

Any way - seems like it's all been said...

Maybe I'll find our pics from last year and do a trip report thing over in that other forum....

 

[Steve@jpr]

Makes sense, I get it.

 

[steamboat1]

If it's such a great business model why do you need foreign funds to finance it?

 

[Edd]

If it's such a great business model why do you need foreign funds to finance it?

Running ski areas is extremely difficult (weather dependent) business. You'd be out of your mind to pass up funds of that magnitude.

If making money is the only thing someone wants to do, there are at least a thousand better ways than the ski business.

 

[thetrailboss]

If it's such a great business model why do you need foreign funds to finance it?

It's a sad fact that there aren't too many domestic investors/sources of capital for projects like this. That's just the reality of it.

 

[dlague]

There are some things that I do not agree with ($16 for 5 and under - should be free) at Jay but I am a spectator. Those who seem to shit on Jay are doing it because they have some kind of beef! Hell, Killington has haters, Smuggs has haters, etc. Pick a resort and post a positive remark on this forum and someone will find something negative to write!

On another note - I think there are ways to make skiing affordable at Jay - we generally use The Ride and Ski Card and ski there in 2 for 1 days (most Sunday-Friday dates and the tour stop). As you can see from my signature, we are well traveled in NE and Jay is always a favorite for my whole family. The food there is affordable, plenty of entertainment for the kids and adults apres ski and if not staying at my parents home up there - it is single day round trip ski and drive!

QUOTE]

I think we do a pretty fair job of keeping pricing as low as possible-both for downcountry folks and locals. While $16 may feel prohibitive for 5 and under (and, actually, reloads are $11), they can get a season pass for $30 (as identified previously). For local kids, we have more than a dozen local schools (and more than 500 kids) who participate in our Straight A program whereby honor roll kids ski and ride for free all year. More than a dozen schools participate in our Foundation Program where kids get $12 lift tickets ($15 includes rentals) and free instruction season passes for these same kids are $219. We're also the only major resort, (and have been since I've been in VT) that offers a daily discount for Vermonters and doesn't limit reduced pass prices to frozen January Tuesdays. And for vacationers, I would love to hear of a better deal than $299 for a night in a ski-in/out brand new hotel, 4 lifts tickets and 4 waterpark passes. We can agree to bang on Jay Peak for lots of things including/not limited to, selling out, silly marketing, and even those extra 10 lbs we've been trying to drop, but maligning us for not making the sport comparably affordable is a difficult platform to support imo.

Steve@jpr I hope you were not thinking that I was complaining about cost at Jay Peak - Considering the terrain and other offerings your rates are really good! I unfairly pointed out the $16 thing. My boys are all teens or adults now so it really is not something for me to complain about.

Running ski areas is extremely difficult (weather dependent) business. You'd be out of your mind to pass up funds of that magnitude.

If making money is the only thing someone wants to do, there are at least a thousand better ways than the ski business.

thousand better ways than the ski business - this maybe true, but thankfully resorts are getting creative enough to make it viable for all to enjoy! Some even operate to stay afloat!

 

[EPB]

thousand better ways than the ski business - this maybe true, but thankfully resorts are getting creative enough to make it viable for all to enjoy! Some even operate to stay afloat!

This was my read on the situation. I would be very curious to see exactly how wealthy the typical foreign investor is and to what extent they see the $500K as an expense or an investment.

 

[dlague]

My guess it is a means to an end! Spend $1,000,000 on a new enterprise, or $500,000 in a rural area the has high unemployment that creates at least 10 jobs and the reward is a green card.

 

[thetrailboss]

My guess it is a means to an end! Spend $1,000,000 on a new enterprise, or $500,000 in a rural area the has high unemployment that creates at least 10 jobs and the reward is a green card.

That's exactly right. It is a means to cut the line with the benefit of providing capital for domestic projects. JPR is a leader and utilizing this model to raise capital. You can't blame them for using the rules for the game that they are given.

 

[dlague]

That's exactly right. It is a means to cut the line with the benefit of providing capital for domestic projects. JPR is a leader and utilizing this model to raise capital. You can't blame them for using the rules for the game that they are given.

Right on brother! More power to JPR!

 

[Sick Bird Rider]

Moving right along, here is a two-year old blog post I stumbled upon today. Pretty sure that it has not been referenced in this thread before. Interesting and ultimately positive analysis from an EB-5 immigration lawyer about some criticisms regarding JPR's relationship with the EB5 program:
http://www.eb5fullservice.com/blog/2232/

Edit to add this: in the same search, I also found an opinion from the other side of the fence, raising concerns from the contractor's point of view -
http://www.nerccblog.com/2011/11/bouchard-responds-to-jay-peak-article.html

 

[Smellytele]

Moving right along, here is a two-year old blog post I stumbled upon today. Pretty sure that it has not been referenced in this thread before. Interesting and ultimately positive analysis from an EB-5 immigration lawyer about some criticisms regarding JPR's relationship with the EB5 program:
http://www.eb5fullservice.com/blog/2232/

Edit to add this: in the same search, I also found an opinion from the other side of the fence, raising concerns from the contractor's point of view -
http://www.nerccblog.com/2011/11/bouchard-responds-to-jay-peak-article.html

The second article sounds more like the union is angry that non-union contractors are being used. Every large project that uses nonunion workers has articles by the union written so it should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[thetrailboss]

Things are moving forward.....

http://caledonianrecord.com/main.asp?SectionID=180&SubSectionID=778&ArticleID=101549

 

[thetrailboss]

This video might be of interest:

http://www.wcax.com/story/23885482/...art=true&topVideoCatNo=default&clipId=9494681

 

[thetrailboss]

Part II of that series explaining who is investing in the projects:

http://www.wcax.com/story/23895536/bu

 

[JPTracker]

Jay Peak's new trail map

http://www.jaypeakresort.com/skiing-riding/the-mountain/trail-map/

no longer includes the West Bowl.

What does this say about the time line for it? Did they just get tired of people asking about it for the last ten years? It first appeared on a trail map in 2003.

 

[Sick Bird Rider]

Jay Peak's new trail map

http://www.jaypeakresort.com/skiing-riding/the-mountain/trail-map/

no longer includes the West Bowl.

What does this say about the time line for it? Did they just get tired of people asking about it for the last ten years? It first appeared on a trail map in 2003.

I think you hit the nail on the head, JPT. They have so many other stories to tell now!

Also intersting that there is no lodge (old or new) shown at Stateside. Nor any condos anywhere (were they on previous maps?).