Ski Shop Expertise

[crank]

I take what the shops say with a grain of salt and will research, never buy on the spot unless they have a deal on something I know I want. took a damaged ski to my local shop and the tech manager took one look at it and said these skis are done, can't be fixed. Their interest is to sell you something. I am sure there are shops you can totally trust and rely on, but be skeptical.

Edit: I did not complete my damaged ski story...I later took it to an on mountain shop where they cut out a bit of damaged edge and replaced it along with patching the ski's bottom and for $40 they were fine for long, long time.

 

[billski]

I dont know if that is necessarily true. I was an 11.5 shoe for 20 years and then a few years ago I noticed new shoes I bought online seemed tight.

many people's arches collapse as they get older. Mine did. I gained a whole size, mostly for width.

 

[gmcunni]

Shops exist for a reason.

so we can try stuff on and check it out before buying online cheaper?

 

[billski]

so we can try stuff on and check it out before buying online cheaper?

When Amazon started coming strong, BestBuy got sick of being Amazon's showroom. So they went to the manufacturers and requested a special model just for them.

 

[dlague]

so we can try stuff on and check it out before buying online cheaper?

Not condoning this! Might get my head chewed off!


Sent from my iPad using AlpineZone

 

[Savemeasammy]

Whether people want to admit it or not, a quality salesperson's time and knowledge has value. I am willing to pay a reasonable percentage for that value.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[gmcunni]

Whether people want to admit it or not, a quality salesperson's time and knowledge has value. I am willing to pay a reasonable percentage for that value.

i am too if/when they can provide value. i joked (mostly) about the trying on then buying online. can't say i've never done it but i do try to buy local when i can and it makes sense (and cents -- won't pay a premium but doesn't have to be cheapest either)

similar to bill's initial comment, i don't like being "sold" what they want me to have vs what i want/need.. .and trust is an issue for me, i'm skeptical of sales people.

 

[C-Rex]

I do my research online and then go to stores get some hands on before I buy. Boots I always buy in a store, of course. I'll try on every pair they have and walk around in them for a while before I buy. I know it's a pain in the ass for them so I'm happy to give them the sale. With other gear, I'll try to give the local guy the sale if I think the shop is worthy. If I'm being treated as a valued customer, and the people stand buy their products I'll usually give them the sale. If the prices are way higher than online, I'll give them the chance to match it or at least find a reasonable middle ground. I'm OK paying the local guy a bit more, especially if I know he'll take care of me if I have a problem with something I bought from him.

A few friends and I have been impressed with Colorado Ski and Bike in West Springfield, MA. (they also have a smaller store in Enfield, CT) I got my board there last year. They are knowledgeable, have a good selection, and are always willing to haggle. That last one is important and smart of them. Most people will feel much better buying something expensive if they think they are getting a deal, even if it's just a small percentage.

 

[gmcunni]

i want new boots this year, need to find a shop close by i can trust. place i use for other ski stuff doesn't instill confidence in me for boot fittings.

 

[Savemeasammy]

i joked (mostly) about the trying on then buying online.

I didn't mean to sound like I was calling you out...! If a shop has priced something outrageously high and they aren't willing to negotiate, then I wouldn't have an issue buying elsewhere - I have done this. That's why I qualified my statement by saying I would pay a "reasonable" percentage.

IMO, if you are looking to buy boots, and intend to buy online, then I don't think it's cool to waste someone's time (and knowledge) at a shop. Perhaps the best tactic would be to state up front that you are interested in a particular boot(s), and that you have found them for "x amount", and is the shop willing to come close to that price? If so, then I think it's fair to take that sales persons' time. Otherwise you should just roll the dice online - and hope for a good fitting boot...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[dlague]

I didn't mean to sound like I was calling you out...! If a shop has priced something outrageously high and they aren't willing to negotiate, then I wouldn't have an issue buying elsewhere - I have done this. That's why I qualified my statement by saying I would pay a "reasonable" percentage.

IMO, if you are looking to buy boots, and intend to buy online, then I don't think it's cool to waste someone's time (and knowledge) at a shop. Perhaps the best tactic would be to state up front that you are interested in a particular boot(s), and that you have found them for "x amount", and is the shop willing to come close to that price? If so, then I think it's fair to take that sales persons' time. Otherwise you should just roll the dice online - and hope for a good fitting boot...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have a great example. I had been researching boots online for my wife and came up with a few choices. Having the mentality that many have "by boots from a shop - not online", we headed to Zimmermanns in Nashua. So they started with the whole type of skier blah blah blah spiel and wanted to put her in a softer boot. I expressed interest in targeted boots which they thought would be relatively stiff. My thinking is progression, not status quo. Finally, we started looking at boots that I felt were better suited for her and we actually all agreed on a specific boot and size. So we decided to buy the boot (price was not on display). When he told me the price I was caught off guard. The price for the boot was $525 - some may think that is not big deal. I told the guy that we will need to think about it and walked away. In the interest of time and mileage, I bought the same boot on Evo for $234. Was that persons time worth more than twice the price - I think not.

That was my one time doing this. I will not go through that process again. This was about 9 years ago. I now stick to the same brand mondo size and last for her and we have had no problems. Even if we did, I buy during the summer so retuning if the fit is not right is not a big deal since it is all done from my home. Her skiing has progressed nicely in my favor.

 

[wa-loaf]

That was my one time doing this. I will not go through that process again. This was about 9 years ago. I now stick to the same brand mondo size and last for her and we have had no problems. Even if we did, I buy during the summer so retuning if the fit is not right is not a big deal since it is all done from my home. Her skiing has progressed nicely in my favor.

That's like going skiing once, having a bad time and saying you won't ever ski again.

 

[Savemeasammy]

I have a great example. I had been researching boots online for my wife and came up with a few choices. Having the mentality that many have "by boots from a shop - not online", we headed to Zimmermanns in Nashua. So they started with the whole type of skier blah blah blah spiel and wanted to put her in a softer boot. I expressed interest in targeted boots which they thought would be relatively stiff. My thinking is progression, not status quo. Finally, we started looking at boots that I felt were better suited for her and we actually all agreed on a specific boot and size. So we decided to buy the boot (price was not on display). When he told me the price I was caught off guard. The price for the boot was $525 - some may think that is not big deal. I told the guy that we will need to think about it and walked away. In the interest of time and mileage, I bought the same boot on Evo for $234. Was that persons time worth more than twice the price - I think not.

That was my one time doing this. I will not go through that process again. This was about 9 years ago. I now stick to the same brand mondo size and last for her and we have had no problems. Even if we did, I buy during the summer so retuning if the fit is not right is not a big deal since it is all done from my home. Her skiing has progressed nicely in my favor.

This is an example of when you could have tried to negotiate. To me, if they don't have the price listed (which, for the record, I do not like...), it seems like they would be willing to negotiate...

To your credit, at least you buy online WITHOUT wasting someone's time in a shop first...!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[deadheadskier]

I have a great example. I had been researching boots online for my wife and came up with a few choices. Having the mentality that many have "by boots from a shop - not online", we headed to Zimmermanns in Nashua. So they started with the whole type of skier blah blah blah spiel and wanted to put her in a softer boot. I expressed interest in targeted boots which they thought would be relatively stiff. My thinking is progression, not status quo. Finally, we started looking at boots that I felt were better suited for her and we actually all agreed on a specific boot and size. So we decided to buy the boot (price was not on display). When he told me the price I was caught off guard. The price for the boot was $525 - some may think that is not big deal. I told the guy that we will need to think about it and walked away. In the interest of time and mileage, I bought the same boot on Evo for $234. Was that persons time worth more than twice the price - I think not.

​That was my one time doing this. I will not go through that process again. This was about 9 years ago. I now stick to the same brand mondo size and last for her and we have had no problems. Even if we did, I buy during the summer so retuning if the fit is not right is not a big deal since it is all done from my home. Her skiing has progressed nicely in my favor.

I don't think it's wise to make decisions based upon a single experience, especially when that experience occurred 9 years ago.

An example to the contrary of your experience is that, I went into a shop two weekends ago with a couple of this years model boots in mind. I wear a 26.5 mondo size, which is a quite popular size and it's rare to see a leftover from last year in a shop in that size for an advanced level boot.

The boots I targeted all had similar prices at the store as to what I was seeing online; within $50 or so. None of them fit quite right. I tried on a boot I hadn't targeted, the Tecnica Mach 1 and it felt great. Tecnicas have never fit me well before, but apparently they changed a lot since I last tried them about 9 years ago . Price on those was $699; exactly as advertised on EVO right now.

I said, that was about $150-$200 more than what I had budgeted. I would've walked out. He points me out a pair of last years model Nordicas that fit even better than the Tecnicas. They were $350, sitting on the floor mixed in with a bunch of crappy boots from last year or even older. I bought them, got a Sunday River lift ticket in the deal as well and then he spent a good half hour with me a few days later dialing in the fit for me.

That's an experience you can't get online and as good of a value as you'll find online. FTR - the shop (Fire on the Mountain in Dover, NH) also had some crazy good deals on leftover ski models from last year; just as good as the price online.

 

[Ragman]

What everyone seems to be forgetting here is that OUR time is worth something too. I dont blame dlague for doing what he did. I do think he shouldnt base every shop or even that particular one on that one experience. But again many people here talk about wasting the salespersons time. What about MY time? the only shop near me is an hour away from my house and 15 min from my work so I would go on my lunch hour. If the salesperson just tries to push me to the most expensive boot because he/she will make the most commission then they are wasting my time too.

Understandably, the shop needs to make a profit or we will never have a local place to go to try on boots or get our skis. But I dont go to a ski shop to try to chew down an elevated price tag. We arent buying a car here, they should put the sticker on the boot and there should be no haggling - IMHO.

 

[Hawkshot99]

So we decided to buy the boot (price was not on display). When he told me the price I was caught off guard. The price for the boot was $525 - some may think that is not big deal. I told the guy that we will need to think about it and walked away. In the interest of time and mileage, I bought the same boot on Evo for $234. Was that persons time worth more than twice the price - I think not.

Were you comparing the exact same boots? Including model year? Comparing a current boot to a leftover is jot a fair comparison. A car dealer would never sell that years car for the leftover on the lots price.

 

[BenedictGomez]

This is an example of when you could have tried to negotiate.

In the example he gave, the spread is 124%! That's tough to believe, but if it's the case I don't think "negotiating" is going to even get you remotely close to the price he found online.

 

[gmcunni]

I didn't mean to sound like I was calling you out...!

nope.. 99% of what i type here should be read with a sarcastic tone or assumed to be a joke....

 

[thetrailboss]

I've always felt uncomfortable buying equipment from a ski shop. Why? Mostly because it feels like they are just trying to sell "what's on the truck" rather than to meet my needs. It gets worse, later in the season once they start having sales.

Once I have described my skiing intent, almost all of them are quick to grab one pair and say "these are perfect for you." They tend to be high priced. Classic selling technique. It's only when I push that s/he pulls out any other comparable models. Sometimes they are not comparable. Again, back to "sell what's on the truck."

I also just can't be sure they have the breadth of inventory to meet everyone's needs.

It all comes down to the competency of the salesperson and developing a relationship with them.. And it's still really hard for me to tell, even after all these years, since I don't go in anymore.

It's easy to say "go research it on the web" and buy it from the web. I'd much rather "buy local".

I also hate brick and mortar store shopping. I like buying local, but I don't want to spend 100 gallons of gasoline to go from store to store and figuring out for myself who has the best ski for me. I know, that's the way it is, like buying a pair of shoes, but with the myriad of skis for sales, it's a complex combination of variables that meet to make the ski for me.

There ARE excellent sales people, knowledgeable and helpful, but they are hard to find.

What do you think?

You're going to the wrong shops if you feel that way....

 

[billski]

I can see pricing boots with gold and diamond trim at MSRP for the shops in Deer Valley, where money is no object. I can see street pricing for those who just don't know better, the guy or gal that comes in and wants to go skiing a couple of times each winter. I can't understand why high end boots are priced as high as they are, since most people in that category "know better", know their materials, flex, fit, etc. Clearly high performance boots cost more to design and manufacture, but is the MSRP or street price justifiable? Is the margin higher?

What kind of gross margins are ski shops seeing on hardgoods like skis and boots? I it must vary by the type of gear. My gut tells me margins are much higher on low-end gear.

Do many shops dicker?
Is buying an al-a carte bundle (i.e., boots and bindings) a better deal for the consumer?