Stenger and Quiros Ousted from Management of Jay Peak and Burke

[LONGBOARDR]

Here's the order.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/...tate-orders-jay-peak-tram-shut-down/85299034/

The final two paragraphs pretty clearly require the work to be completed to the State's satisfaction before opening.

Yes, the order earlier does leave a little bit of wiggle room, and I'm sure Jay will try to negotiate. A handful do share your thoughts that they will get a "work approved", but done later, compromise, but I am skeptical.


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Word here is that the contract is signed.
Load test is in a week (it is done 2x annually normally)
it can run if it passes and the work upgrade will start incrementally with the big work in spring 17.

that tram has been subjected to multiple inspections examinations and testing by engineers-mechanics and inspectors from everywhere. I don't have a problem riding it til the upgrade.

the new management group is getting a lot of work done here. employees are upbeat and things are looking better weekly. Huge sighs of relief, this winter will be good at the Peak

 

[fbrissette]

the new management group is getting a lot of work done here. employees are upbeat and things are looking better weekly. Huge sighs of relief, this winter will be good at the Peak

My feeling from yesterday's homeowner meeting is that indeed things are heading in the right direction. Really looking forward to next winter.

 

[VTKilarney]

I'm glad that the tram message is straightened out and that some positive news is being spread. Go Jay!


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[LONGBOARDR]

I'm glad that the tram message is straightened out and that some positive news is being spread. Go Jay!


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VTK,

the support and good wishes are most appreciated.
Both the trajectory for Burke and Jay are excellent.
the experience of the receiver and the unbelievably greatskills and kindness of the interim management group are quite apparent.
Thank goodness, NEK gets the karma it's earned

 

[BenedictGomez]

If I were the new owners Jay planning long term, I would remove the Tram and demolish the Sky Haus.

This. It's so obvious.

The problem is, there are no "new owners", and the management company is only incentivized to keep the place going, not to upgrade it.

But pouring all these millions of dollars into repairing a 50+ year old technology that is now going to be 25% LESS efficient than even its' prior already inefficient iteration makes absolutely no sense.

 

[MEtoVTSkier]

I can understand why they want to keep it, but it really doesn't make any sense to spend that kind of money for something that only is going to move probably 270 people per hour up the hill.

 

[drjeff]

I think the Tram will be fixed and stay for much of the exact same reasons why Mad River Glen spent the $$ to overhaul the single a few years back.

First it's really one of the few "iconic" lifts in the East and that DOES have some marketing value and helps distinguish Jay from all other Eastern resorts less Cannon. Second, just like what MRG wanted to do with keeping capacity limited for snow quality on terrain that really can't take the kinds of "assaults" that say 1200/1500/1800+ people an hour that either a fixed grip or detachable lift could send up there.

 

[BenedictGomez]

The Tram is not anywhere near as iconic as the Mad River Single chair. Not even close (frankly, I don't even consider the Jay Tram iconic at all).

In terms of marketing value, I've never heard anyone land on Jay Peak as their vacation choice due to the tram. But if it perhaps does admittedly has some slight value in that regard, it certainly costs them more by those of the opinion that it's toxic, and now, remarkably it's going to be "25% worse". I very much doubt if Jay Peak had an acquirer with reasonable funding capabilities, that they would "invest" roughly $5 Million into this aged relic, which will now be 25% poorer than before. It was bad enough running at 100%.

EDIT: It's probably pretty apparent I'm having a hard time fathoming all of this.

 

[oldtimer]

Here is a different way to look at it: The receiver's job is to maximize the SALE PRICE of an asset he is working to sell ASAP. Let us assume that the word that they are spreading is true, i.e. with the $5 million plan they WILL have the tram running for the upcoming season and maybe this summer. To sell the asset he needs to be able to convince someone that there is a viable business model & part of that convincing is clearly happy stakeholders. These include the current property owners, season ticket holders and the locals. Next summer he may be showing potential buyers around and he can say- a) "It is all working, and we have a loyal and happy customer base." OR b) "Well, we didn't feel the tram was worth $5 mil & yea, some people are bitching, but really, this will be better for you the potential buyer in the long term."

Cash is not really his problem today- if he can convince the judge, then they seem to be able to access what cash is available in the Q assets & maybe borrow against whatever equity exists.

This company is not in the ski business, nor even the report improvement business. They are in the business of polishing the chrome, getting smiles on the customers and getting out of dodge w/o doing any damage.

Would I do it under those circumstances? maybe.

 

[VTKilarney]

It looks like the tram won't be operating next week, but next winter is definitely doable:
http://vtdigger.org/2016/06/07/federal-court-approves-4-9m-for-jay-peak-tram/

 

[from_the_NEK]

If Jay ditched the tram, the name of the Tram House Lodge wouldn't make sense anymore and neither would referring to that base area as "tramside".
BG might not think the Tram as iconic. Sure it is not as iconic as the single chair is among skiers but I'm sure there are a lot more non-skiers that can associate the tram with Jay than there are that even know that Mad River has a "single"-chair.

And as others have pointed out, the limited summit terrain can barely support the traffic the tram drops off up there. I say it is worth the investment to preserve it.

 

[fbrissette]

Sure it is not as iconic as the single chair is among skiers but I'm sure there are a lot more non-skiers that can associate the tram with Jay than there are that even know that Mad River has a "single"-chair.

I would say that 99% of people who ski in Quebec (Montreal being the largest urban center close to MRG) have never heard of MRG, let alone that they have a single chair. A single chair is not iconing. It is a remnant of the past. It's not a different experience than a double.

I have had lots of urban skiers (you know, not real skiers) who visited at Jay and the Tram is always one of the highlight of their visit. Does it make financial sense ? I don't know, but it's definitely part of the Jay experience.

 

[deadheadskier]

I messaged Jay. They said a chair would never run on that exposure. A smaller gondola that could tolerate the wind (I assume two cable) was priced out at one point as a potential replacement for the Tram and the cost was double maintaining what they have.

For those people so upset about the lift, ride the Flyer and walk/skin the 10-15 minutes to the top from there. Not that big of a deal

 

[steamboat1]

A single chair is not iconing. It is a remnant of the past. It's not a different experience than a double.

I'll have to disagree with you on that.

 

[tree_skier]

I'll have to disagree with you on that.

Second that... All you need to do is ride sunnyside then the single and see the Difference in the ride

 

[fbrissette]

I'll have to disagree with you on that.

I've ridden the Tremblant single for several years and everybody was happy when they replaced it by a double. It's just me, but freezing your butt alone and doubling the wait time ain't much of an experience.

 

[steamboat1]

I've ridden the Tremblant single for several years and everybody was happy when they replaced it by a double. It's just me, but freezing your butt alone and doubling the wait time ain't much of an experience.

That's not what I was addressing. I was just saying it's a different experience than riding a double. As for wait time it's a trade off. Less people going up the mountain means less people coming down. Makes no difference I'm just as cold on a single, double, triple, quad or six.

 

[tree_skier]

myself Love the peace and solitude the single brings. In all fairness have only been to MRG midweek and the longest line i have stood in is maybe 15 people and half of that was a group i was skiing with.

 

[crank]

MRG single chair is iconic. MRG does not do a lot of marketing so it is not surprising that a lot of folks are not familiar. MRG is not for everyone and they know it and embrace it.

The point is that there are fewer skiers chewing up the snow. I never ski MRG on the weekends because of the lift line.

 

[BenedictGomez]

This company is not in the ski business, nor even the report improvement business. They are in the business of polishing the chrome, getting smiles on the customers and getting out of dodge w/o doing any damage.

Exactly. Which is why that ~$5M will be spent to fix an inefficient tram that will now be (tough to imagine) 25% less efficient.

If Jay ditched the tram, the name of the Tram House Lodge wouldn't make sense anymore and neither would referring to that base area as "tramside".

So you rename the building. LOL. Who the heck cares what the building it called? Call it the "Ponzi Palace". That's fitting.

I'm sure there are a lot more non-skiers that can associate the tram with Jay than there are that even know that Mad River has a "single"-chair.

I highly doubt it to the point I'd put money on it if I could. Down here, for instance, nobody has even heard of Jay Peak. Blank stares. Wouldnt even know what it is. Most people at least know that Mad River Glen is a ski mountain, and many can even recite "Ski It If You Can" due to their multi-decade marketing, tee-shirts, bumper stickers all over.

Second that..

Third.