The Average Skier is the Enemy!

[tekweezle]

well I did my part for spring skiing. was in western ny over the easter holiday and skied 1 hour and 20 minutes at GreekPeak at night and 2 1/2 hours at Song Mountain. got to both places late but the skiing was adequate and crowds were minimal.

both places plan to close up and only offer weekends from here on out. kind of sad because with the way it freezes up overnight out there, conditions were arguably mid winter like, aside from bare and thin patches. the base was a thin layer of hardpack and ice but still skiable. i guess it would take much of a warm up to totally expose the mountain though.....

 

[jarrodski]

Does Sundown tolerate earned turns? Blue mountain PA will call the cops for tresspassing and they should have a few patches until May as well..a shame ..

Sundown does not. no resuce services, amongst a liability dictates that no skiing after we are closed unless there is a private photo shoot organized by Ski Sundown.

Sundown does make a big deal about this, and has to for good reason. Think about what's on the line with poachers and it's obvious that this can not be tolerated, even with record snow depths at this point in the season.

 

[jarrodski]

How do you convince someone not to do their spring chores? play with their kids? Go to soccer? wash their car? . . .

It's a challenge put forth to ski areas and one that no one has nailed yet. Everyone who skis passionatly knows that Spring means less layers, softer "hero" snow and longer sunny days on the mountain. The re-energized feeling that the end is near forces the skiers skier to get out there and make no excuses. Unlike the single digit temps of Jan and Feb, March and April offers the chance to unmask and actaully speak to the chair mate... all in all, spring is great. But how great? Apparently no one wants to learn how while it's nice out. No one wants to sit on a deck, while it's nice out. No one wants to ride a lift with no lines, while it's nice out...

Who knows that the answer is. But when someone gets it, then the seasons can be extended. Snow, for areas who know its worth, is not the problem. Snow making has come light years in it's advancements in just recent history. It's the lack of peoples passion for the sport (recreational or not, Glen Plake is old and smells like Gin I hear)

Anyways, who mountain bikes in CT?

 

[bvibert]

Anyways, who mountain bikes in CT?

I do. Why, are we going to start lift served MTB at Sundown????? :idea:

 

[drjeff]

How do you convince someone not to do their spring chores? play with their kids? Go to soccer? wash their car? . . .

It's a challenge put forth to ski areas and one that no one has nailed yet. Everyone who skis passionatly knows that Spring means less layers, softer "hero" snow and longer sunny days on the mountain. The re-energized feeling that the end is near forces the skiers skier to get out there and make no excuses. Unlike the single digit temps of Jan and Feb, March and April offers the chance to unmask and actaully speak to the chair mate... all in all, spring is great. But how great? Apparently no one wants to learn how while it's nice out. No one wants to sit on a deck, while it's nice out. No one wants to ride a lift with no lines, while it's nice out...

Who knows that the answer is. But when someone gets it, then the seasons can be extended. Snow, for areas who know its worth, is not the problem. Snow making has come light years in it's advancements in just recent history. It's the lack of peoples passion for the sport (recreational or not, Glen Plake is old and smells like Gin I hear)

Anyways, who mountain bikes in CT?

The biggie issue with the masses and spring snow, aside from the other "warm weather" activities that they haven't done in a few months, is that plain and simple, just like the average skier doesn't like powder because it's too tough to ski in, the average skier dislikes the spring daily snow cycle even more than powder. It's "too icy" first thing in the AM, "just right" for an hour or 2 mid/late AM, and then way to soft/mushy/sticky the rest of the day. And that doesn't even get into the fact that the "average" skier would much rather ski a perfectly groomed 8 lane wide corduroy high way than spring bumps.

The reality is that all of New England realistically has enough daily skier/rider business to support atmost 2 to 4 open ski areas after the 2nd weekend of April, and from then on basically subtract 1 ski area per week. After the 1st weekend of May, most of the hard core skiers have sets their sites on earning their spring corn feasts rather than riding a chairlift for their feasts. As much as it's tough to admit, this is afterall the ski BUSINESS and if in low demand times a business isn't making a profit, it's digging into it's reserves which may very well be better spent on new things for the upcoming season which with proper marketing will attract more customers and make the business more $$ which can be used to buy more new things to atttract more new customers. That makes a heck of alot more sense business wise than operating at a loss to cater to a smaller market share of folks who in many instances may very well not frequently goto that ski area in the "high season"

 

[MR. evil]

I do. Why, are we going to start lift served MTB at Sundown????? :idea:

Lift service for Mtn biking would be a waste at Sundown. Anyone should be able to ride up almost anyone of those trails fairly easy. but it would be great if they built some trail features (bridges, log piles, jumps) and cut some sweet single track in the woods and let us ride there for a small fee.

 

[jack97]

I do. Why, are we going to start lift served MTB at Sundown????? :idea:

Lift service for Mtn biking would be a waste at Sundown. Anyone should be able to ride up almost anyone of those trails fairly easy. but it would be great if they built some trail features (bridges, log piles, jumps) and cut some sweet single track in the woods and let us ride there for a small fee.

Put in something like this.

 

[bvibert]

Put in something like this.

Nice bumps!

 

[4aprice]

That's an interesting video. Makes me rethink my feelings on the that hidieous looking ramp in the Jersey Meadowlands that I pass almost everyday. My original feelings were no way I would ski in that thing but if they had a line of bumps I might reconsider. I like the carpet idea too.

Alex

Lake Hopatcong, NJ

 

[jack97]

That's an interesting video. Makes me rethink my feelings on the that hidieous looking ramp in the Jersey Meadowlands that I pass almost everyday. My original feelings were no way I would ski in that thing but if they had a line of bumps I might reconsider. I like the carpet idea too.

Me too. Figure somewhere in late summer/early fall, I usually get the twitch for some bumps. It might get so bad I would make a one way 5 hr drive to Jersey.

Only thing that would save me is that carpet, I figure if every one in AZ convinces Grassi to put that in his backyard he can open it up for business. If he gets a bar setup, he should be able to get back his initial investment in short time. :smash:

 

[bvibert]

Lift service for Mtn biking would be a waste at Sundown. Anyone should be able to ride up almost anyone of those trails fairly easy. but it would be great if they built some trail features (bridges, log piles, jumps) and cut some sweet single track in the woods and let us ride there for a small fee.

I think they'd be able to attract some DHer's if they setup a nice course. DH bikes are pretty heavy, most of those guys wouldn't want to ride them uphill for very long..

 

[drjeff]

I think they'd be able to attract some DHer's if they setup a nice course. DH bikes are pretty heavy, most of those guys wouldn't want to ride them uphill for very long..

Once again, the biggest issue you'd have is the financial aspect of trying to cater to what is a small niche market. True, Sundown could attract a few folks wanting to ride the lift up and let gravity do the rest, especially given the large mtn bike population that is on many of the trails in the greater Hartford area, but, many of those mtn bikers, if they're really into the DH aspect, already are used to traveling up North to VT for their DH biking where they get a longer DH ride.

From having been at Mount Snow many summer weekends, while the mountain bike scene there is pretty good, and their established trail networks and lift operations very good, if there isn't a big contest there, you'll see roughly 100 cars in the parking lots on any given weekend. Now if its something like the US national like they had last summer, then the parking lots are about as full as if it was an "average" mid-winter weekend.

Bottom line, if your in that niche, it seems like a no-brainer for an area to do this, but often the cold hard truth that the accountant provides an area owner after the season tells a different story. I can tell you from the passholders meeting at Mount Snow, when summer mtn biking was brought up, the reply from mgt was "Tim Boyd thinks its fine as long as it doesn't loose money" and then the elaboration was that if its loosing money, thats less to spend on winter on mountain upgrades which is the primary focus of the resort.

 

[bvibert]

Once again, the biggest issue you'd have is the financial aspect of trying to cater to what is a small niche market. True, Sundown could attract a few folks wanting to ride the lift up and let gravity do the rest, especially given the large mtn bike population that is on many of the trails in the greater Hartford area, but, many of those mtn bikers, if they're really into the DH aspect, already are used to traveling up North to VT for their DH biking where they get a longer DH ride.

From having been at Mount Snow many summer weekends, while the mountain bike scene there is pretty good, and their established trail networks and lift operations very good, if there isn't a big contest there, you'll see roughly 100 cars in the parking lots on any given weekend. Now if its something like the US national like they had last summer, then the parking lots are about as full as if it was an "average" mid-winter weekend.

Bottom line, if your in that niche, it seems like a no-brainer for an area to do this, but often the cold hard truth that the accountant provides an area owner after the season tells a different story. I can tell you from the passholders meeting at Mount Snow, when summer mtn biking was brought up, the reply from mgt was "Tim Boyd thinks its fine as long as it doesn't loose money" and then the elaboration was that if its loosing money, thats less to spend on winter on mountain upgrades which is the primary focus of the resort.

Believe me, I realize it's a pipe dream. I'm just looking for some work in the summer.. If Sundown ran the lifts for whatever reason in the off-season then I wouldn't have to look for part-time employment elsewhere... Personally I'd prefer to ride my bike up and down the mountain, but then that doesn't offer me much in the way of a job.

 

[Greg]

Believe me, I realize it's a pipe dream. I'm just looking for some work in the summer.. If Sundown ran the lifts for whatever reason in the off-season then I wouldn't have to look for part-time employment elsewhere... Personally I'd prefer to ride my bike up and down the mountain, but then that doesn't offer me much in the way of a job.

Get them to install a dry slope bump field on Gunny. I'd ski it for sure. :lol:

 

[bvibert]

Get them to install a dry slope bump field on Gunny. I'd ski it for sure. :lol:

You're not the only one...

 

[jaywbigred]

Put in something like this.

If they put a bump line like that in at Xanadu, I might actually, literally, wet myself w excitedment. I would be there everyday I think. Even if it is the evil empire.

 

[hiroto]

Put in something like this.

So where does this locate? I assume it is in Europe?

 

[jack97]

So where does this locate? I assume it is in Europe?

I think the indoor and the carpets are in England. Seem very popular over there.

Here's another from the same subscriber/producer

 

[drjeff]

Believe me, I realize it's a pipe dream. I'm just looking for some work in the summer.. If Sundown ran the lifts for whatever reason in the off-season then I wouldn't have to look for part-time employment elsewhere... Personally I'd prefer to ride my bike up and down the mountain, but then that doesn't offer me much in the way of a job.

I think if they really wanted to do something different that would generate some market buzz(and hence crowds to economically sustain significant summer operations), they'd need to look into something like an alpine coaster (different than an alpine slide in that you can also run the coaster in winter giving it year round income producing potential)

and/or a zipline, which also has year round operation capabilites

Do a little summer cross promotion with the Satan's Kingdom inner tubing on The Farmington River, and at minimum you'd see a bunch of summer camp groups, town parks and recreation groups, church youth group sponsored trips showing up. The biggest issue though that Sundown will often have with summer operations and drawing folks, is that if its a nice day in the summer, a significant portion of the their potential customers for summer activities will be asking themselves the following question "do I goto the beach or Six Flags or do I goto Sundown?" and many will choose the day trip to Hammonassett or Agawam over New Hartford.

 

[hiroto]

I think the indoor and the carpets are in England. Seem very popular over there.

Followed the url http://www.xscape.co.uk seen in the video and it seems the indoor one is SNO!zone Scotland. I would love to know where that outdoor one is. I've seen video of summer skiing slopes but never seen bump slope like that.