The "Sugarbush Thread"

[WinS]

These issues have nothing to do with the equipment being utilized (that every resort uses now with the exception of Killington) but how and where they are being utilized.

Just some background. At Lincoln Peak the snowmaking system can pump a maximum of 3,800-4,000 gallons per minute. There is an 18” pipe fro the snowmaking pond up to the compressor building. Then there are different diameter pipes up the different trails. At marginal temperatures each of the low energy guns or towers might produce only 15 gallons per minute. At colder temperatures they will do 80 GPM. The fans you see can do more. But the most water that can be pumped in any conditions is limited to 3,800-4,000 gallons per minute. The long range plan is to increase the water capacity as has been discussed previously. In the meantime a number of improvements have been made to use the existing capacity more efficient such new pumps like that at mid-station ME, new snowmaking pipe like that installed at the top of ME and on Pushover at LP and new click hydrant towers at both Lincoln Peak and ME which allow the system to get up and down faster. I have been pleased to learn about the capital that Alterra is continuing to give Sugarbush.

Another data point. It takes 180,000 gallons to make an acre foot of snow. Or 540,000 gallons to put down three feet of snow on an acre. A trail like Inverness is 25 acres. So to get the trail covered in three feet of snow takes 13.5 million gallons of water. The water capacity at ME is a bit less than LP. It is around 2,500 gallons per minute. Now you can do the math to calculate the hours it takes.

Everyone always talks about Killington. They have both enormous water and air capacity which was installed decades ago and why they are able to open a trail like Super Star in November And also get some other terrain open higher on the mountain.

 

[Newpylong]

4,000 GPM is certainly undersized for a hill with the required acreage of Lincoln (and 2,500 way undersized for Ellen) but if used wisely can still achieve effective coverage given their location. It would be a much different story in southern VT. Of course, everyone always wants access to more water especially with the advent of Low E. When Les rebuilt both of those systems (with cheap pipe) air was the hot commodity no pun intended.

They should be able to about double that 4,000 GPM through that 18" feed from the Mad River should they ever (be permitted) to build out that big.

 

[djd66]

I skied for about 3 hours yesterday, went to the castlerock and saw many people that I have not seen since last may. The skiing was fine. Skiing the sugar on the skier left was fun. What was more fun was the conversation and laughs with many of my friends. Again the community, the thing that most transient skiers wouldn't understand. djd66 you spend enough time up here. You don't miss your ski friends?

Hawk - I give you a lot credit for all your positivity! Most of my ski friends live in MA,… so I get to see them during the offseason. Part of my issue is I have been driving back and forth for 35+ years,… that’s part of what has grown old for me. Also, when my kids were younger, I must have skied pushover 10,000 times. Lastly, I got Covid on Monday,… that’s kept me in bed up until yesterday.

 

[SteezyRob]

Was out Friday afternoon (one and done) and then most of Saturday morning. Nothing but Jerrys on the hill. I did see, perhaps, one beginner.

the clientele was thankfully more advanced today, at least by the afternoon.

 

[Shredmonkey254]

I saw Colin, Sugarbush’s mountain manager, this morning. By Tuesday or Wednesday the following should be open. Upper Jester, Allyn’s Traverse, Valley Traverse, new Heaven’s Gate Traverse all the way to HG, Murphy’s and Birdland to the HG Traverse, Lower Downspout, Lower Jester, Coffee Run. After that I suspect they will look at finishing Upper Orangrinder and maybe some refresh over at GH. Snowball And Spring Fling is a lot of acreage and needs at least 72 hours in good temps To get open. It is also always nice to get the Welcome Mat open as soon as possible for beginner lessons.

I have a question about this new TTB route: has the lower traverse as it approaches Domino been re graded when they re configured Reverse Traverse? If not, that spot is snow boarder unfriendly and will be a CF with the trail littered by those who didn’t make it up that hill and those trying to carry their speed through there.

 

[doublediamond]

Not Impulses but custom order 4 nuc Phazers. But yeah, even they are slowly figuring out where they can be utilized to save 300 CFM per gun.

The nucleators are the big nozzles right? Sunday River has at least one of those Phazer on a tower with 4 big nozzles and one small nozzle on Grand Ave.

 

[Newpylong]

Yes sir, top 3 nozzles here: https://www.hkdsnowmakers.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/gallery-phazer-img2-hkd-snowmakers.jpg

Killington's have 4 nucleators vs 3 in the standard release.

 

[ducky]

I have a question about this new TTB route: has the lower traverse as it approaches Domino been re graded when they re configured Reverse Traverse? If not, that spot is snow boarder unfriendly and will be a CF with the trail littered by those who didn’t make it up that hill and those trying to carry their speed through there.

Hadn't thought of that. Almost nobody on a board can make it to Domino on the flat (except Streetskier) without a boot out. Only the last 30' or so but there will be a CF indeed as riders unbuckle/shuffle/rebuckle.
Or a slingshot from a ski buddy works too.

On the bright side, unless you have to clear it like I do, there is 6" of wet, heavy snow this morning in the valley. Was not prepared and need to install my plow on the 4-wheeler, usually done before it snows.

As I type, looking outside my window, an 8-pt buck is running across the lawn - first day after hunting season. How do they know?

 

[Hawk]

I was told that they cut the corner at Domino and it is a little better. I personally never had an issue but I hit the traverse with speed because I know it is coming. BTW - Look at the Gatehouse snow stake. Looks like they got about 13" last night.

 

[Hawk]

 

[tumbler]

Just what the Dr. ordered, some heavy wet base snow.

 

[Shredmonkey254]

I was told that they cut the corner at Domino and it is a little better. I personally never had an issue but I hit the traverse with speed because I know it is coming. BTW - Look at the Gatehouse snow stake. Looks like they got about 13" last night.

and that is exactly why this traverse is going to be a problem... snowboarders all over the place and skiers like you trying to rip thru a 15 foot wide trail... I foresee fist to cuffs and patrol should park a sled or two there. Not calling you out in particular, but as a skier, you can't understand the problem getting thru there on a single plank. I just wish that Sugarbush would open real trails like they used to. I don't understand all the chatter about snowmaking stats... isn't new equipment better then the old stuff? They used to open real trails, now we are cutting thru neighborhoods, taking short cuts. Hope they fixed the flat there without wrecking Domino or the woods shots that are right there. Taking this route is not a route I ever dream of doing, that cut over exists just to get one over to HG, not for the pleasure of the run!

 

[tumbler]

Looks like they are opening Bravo this morning

 

[cdskier]

Looks like they are opening Bravo this morning

Interesting...looks like they rushed just within the past hour to groom out the traverses and runout back down to SB.

 

[Shredmonkey254]

Interesting...looks like they rushed just within the past hour to groom out the traverses and runout back down to SB.

20 lucky people there! natural cures all

 

[kingslug]

Might have to go tomorrow...going to be frigid at Stowe

 

[Hawk]

I think for the short term it is not going to be that big a deal. Also by the time the weekend rolls around they might have more open. Again, I not wasting time bitcing anymore about early season. They do what they do. I've learned to to expect a ton.

 

[oldfartrider]

I see gate house lift isn’t running

 

[Smellytele]

I think for the short term it is not going to be that big a deal. Also by the time the weekend rolls around they might have more open. Again, I not wasting time bitcing anymore about early season. They do what they do. I've learned to to expect a ton.

I beaten man drinking the koolaid.
The issue seems to be in the past they had always done better so it seems they could do better than what they have done this year. No one seems to be expecting a ton just what they had done in the past.

 

[Hawk]

Im not drinking the coolaid. I am just facing the facts. I brought my gear home and will stay at my sisters next week and ski Sunday River with my old crew while Sugarbush figures it out. Sunday river should have over 20 trails by then.