The West...and the East

[Kingslug20]

Considering Vail has more money than most resorts combined..shouldnt be an issue...Jay is open..amd they have...money?

 

[deadheadskier]

Well yes, Vail can afford it, but it's not profitable. Again, they're publicly traded. Making as much money as possible is the number one goal.

 

[Kingslug20]

And yet wall st us not happy with them..stick dropped.
Sometimes the product matters first...
Make shitty pizza...go out of business..

 

[cdskier]

Not running Stowe later is something I can't really fault Vail too much for. Stowe often closed around a similar time-frame under previous ownership. Yes there were several years that were exceptions and they went a week or 2 later, but that was not the norm for many years.

Wildcat on the other hand is a different story...they WERE often in the running to be one of the last few resorts open.

Honestly in the late season there really isn't enough demand for too many ski areas to be open. Even right now with so few open, there still aren't exactly crowds at most of them. I wasn't at SB, but looking at the webcams, it was pretty empty. But SB has a reputation for trying to make it to May. So they keep going to show that they still care about the diehard demographic (and luckily Alterra values that demographic so far even though it is a small percentage of their overall passholders).

 

[Kingslug20]

I think vail needs to do some things to get a good rep...then maybe stock price will start climbing...and that's nit going to happen quickly. Paid parking...not helping..early close..not helping.
Anyone think of anything Vail has done to help their reputation?
Crap...im turning this into a vail sux thread...it..just ......goes......there.......

 

[cdskier]

Meh...let's see how many passes they actually sell this year. That will determine what happens to their stock price. Only way they make substantial changes to the way they operate is if their sales drop noticeably. And as much as I hate to say this, I really don't think their overall sales are going to be impacted as much as some people think they will be. Sure they'll lose some of the more dedicated skiers that have flexibility to go elsewhere, but chances are they will also pick up other more "casual" skiers that are clueless about the problems and just see the cheap pass price and are enticed by that. Honestly I would not one bit be surprised to see the sales either be flat or even have a slight increase.

 

[Kingslug20]

True..then we will see where their stock price goes...which is all that seems to really matter...to them and of course..the share holders.

 

[jimmywilson69]

Remember they just purchased the western PA market when they acquired 7 Springs. I have no idea how many pass holders that is, but any drop would have to exceed that if you there is to be a drop realized.

 

[kancamagus]

I read that Tahoe got more snow in April than in jan Feb March combined! They had a massive December that limped them thru the core of the season

It’s even better (worse?) than that. April had more snow than Nov + Jan thru March combined. The only months of notable snow were Oct, Dec, and April. It was a total feast or famine season. Oct storm only delivered enough to open for a weekend, then everything closed until mid December. We didn’t even have any viable snowmaking windows until a few days before the Dec storms.

The April storms enabled Palisades to extend their closing date by two weeks until mid May, and Mammoth is slated to go through Memorial Day. Palisades skied great this weekend.

 

[ss20]

Solitude and their new GM are going to May 1 this year after always having a mid-April close. I think it's been a trend over the last 10 years of skiers wanting to ski later in the season. I think that slowly, more resorts will start going later. This year at Alta we had several sold-out ski school days in April! I remember the longest two days I ever waited in lines at Killington were weekend days with fresh snow in late April after most others had closed. I distinctly remember I believe it was late April 2018... people were walking up the K access road from Snowshed because the K1 and Vale lots were full!

 

[RISkier]

Just don't get why Stowe closes early...enough people would keep going.

The Mansfield side is on either State or Federal Forest service land. I don't recall which. The lease dictates when Stowe can open and when they must close. I'm sure there are contingencies on when weekends and or holiday's fall, but the lease dictates opening and closing dates.

 

[Smellytele]

The Mansfield side is on either State or Federal Forest service land. I don't recall which. The lease dictates when Stowe can open and when they must close. I'm sure there are contingencies on when weekends and or holiday's fall, but the lease dictates opening and closing dates.

Thought this was disproven.

 

[snoseek]

The Mansfield side is on either State or Federal Forest service land. I don't recall which. The lease dictates when Stowe can open and when they must close. I'm sure there are contingencies on when weekends and or holiday's fall, but the lease dictates opening and closing dates.

I e skied stowe way later than the current state.

 

[cdskier]

Thought this was disproven.

It was, yet people continue to love to make that claim...the link to the lease was posted in the Stowe thread for anyone that wants to read it. Interestingly enough, it actually REQUIRES that a lift be run July through September (except in a year where a new lift is being installed) in addition to a lift being run at all times during the winter season (but there are no definitions of "winter season" and no stipulations that they have to close by any particular date).

Actually...here's the link to the lease as well for anyone that wants to read it:

https://auditor.vermont.gov/sites/auditor/files/files/reports/ski-leases/Stowe-Mountain-Resort-Lease.pdf

Someone on Facebook recently tried to claim it was actually their land use permits granted via ACT 250 filings that had the restriction...yet when pressed that person couldn't actually point to any particular ACT 250 permit/project number and when further pressed said that what they saw said "approximately" April 15 (which really is not a firm date at all and they've operated well past that point many times). I tried looking through a bunch of the ACT 250 filings related to Stowe and couldn't find any with dates of operation restrictions...

The more I think about this...the more I think that "restriction" (if it exists at all) was intended more to guarantee that the lease holder didn't try to cut the season too short simply to save money. I don't truly believe the intention (again if it even exists) was to force a closure by a certain point.

 

[Tonyr]

I just got back on Sunday from skiing in Colorado the last 8 days. Aspen Snowmass & Winter Park were both empty while we were there. Even the Saturday we left Winter Park it snowed 6 to 8 inches the night before and the place was still empty the next day. Once April rolls around I'd bet the majority of resorts don't make money which is why they close as early as they do. People must switch to other interests by the time March ends.

 

[deadheadskier]

Wait a second, the lease stipulates only ONE lift needs to run at Stowe during the winter season? Don't threaten Vail with a good time

 

[cdskier]

Wait a second, the lease stipulates only ONE lift needs to run at Stowe during the winter season? Don't threaten Vail with a good time

The wording is a bit vague. It says "at least one chair or gondola lift" from July through September, but for the winter season says "operate the lift or lifts at all times". I suppose you could technically argue running a single lift meets the criteria in the winter, although then in that case it doesn't necessarily make sense to have different wording for the two time-frames.

 

[jaytrem]

Wait a second, the lease stipulates only ONE lift needs to run at Stowe during the winter season? Don't threaten Vail with a good time

Oh crap, now you've done it!

I've heard so many crazy untrue stories over the years. One of the best was about how Mount Snow used so much water from Somerset that the water level dropped 5 feet and Green Mountain Power was all pissed and going to sue them. Nice story, but they don't use any water from the reservoir. No interest in arguing with a stranger, so I was just "Wow, that's crazy!".

 

[jaytrem]

The wording is a bit vague. It says "at least one chair or gondola lift" from July through September, but for the winter season says "operate the lift or lifts at all times". I suppose you could technically argue running a single lift meets the criteria in the winter, although then in that case it doesn't necessarily make sense to have different wording for the two time-frames.

Sounds to me like the should have lifts running 24 hours a day!

 

[Kingslug20]

Im in!