Vechicles

[Vortex]

I have a Montero Sport. 4 door ski racks. Towing package. I like it get about 20 mgh.

I edited this. My bad.

 

[SKIQUATTRO]

lets please get this thread back to what you drive, not your likes and dislikes...facts only please

 

[skibum1321]

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. No matter what you drive, you bought it for a reason...be it kids, cargo, mpg, price, status, ego etc.....I am sure we can all do a better job to protect the environment whether you drive and SUV or not..for example, I am sure the SUV bashing people arent using solar power, wind power, manure power etc...before you throw stones, look at your own life, we can ALL do better..we choose our vechicles like we choose our skis, they fit a need...we dont critize each other if one guy is skiing a GS ski and another a fatty powder ski..we all have our reasons for buying what we buy...leave it at that..and pray for snow...!! Yes, i have a SUV and a A4 Audi wagon..we've had an Audi AllRoad wagon with a box up top but still could not fit everything that we needed to haul (me, wife, 2 kids, gear)...I have a near death experience in a minivan, so an SUV for long trips was a no brainer for me...for around town we drive the AUDI and most days i ride my road bike to work...(30 mi r/t) PRAY FOR SNOW

I would love to use wind power, but if I go any further with that I'd be getting on my political soapbox.

 

[GadgetRick]

I believe that the diesel fuel is cleaner over in Europe, and that's why they can get away with having diesel cars over there. I'm not sure if we're going to change diesel fuel standards here in the US anytime soon...

That is a small part of the problem. The engines are much cleaner as well. And why aren't we gonna change the disel fuel standards? Well, because the oil companies won't let the government. If we did, as we allowed more disels they wouldn't make as much money as they have been.

The hybrid thing is not the answer either. Check the mileage on most of these cars. Not much better than a non-hybrid at the end of the day. I think, eventually, you'll see hydrogen cars being the answer if the government ever really allows it.

'm not saying you have no reason to have an SUV, but height is not a reason. There are plenty of cars out there that a tall person can be comfortable in. I'm 6'2" and drive a Mazda3 and have plenty of room.

Not just a height issue. I've always lifted a lot of weights and I've got a large upper body. Not very comfortable in MOST cars. Besides, I have a 3 year old boy and another on the way. Try squeezing kids into a smaller car with all of their stuff. It can be done but I'm not gonna do it.

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. No matter what you drive, you bought it for a reason...be it kids, cargo, mpg, price, status, ego etc.....I am sure we can all do a better job to protect the environment whether you drive and SUV or not..for example, I am sure the SUV bashing people arent using solar power, wind power, manure power etc...before you throw stones, look at your own life, we can ALL do better..

Amen to that brother...

 

[cdc28p]

My cheapo 2004 Toyota RAV4 AWD is awesome on snow, and better yet, can fit all tiny parallel parking slots in the urban jungle of Boston. Music-wise, it's equipped with my vocal cord. Navigation-wise, I usually have my fiancee reading a map on the passenger seat. I've used it to carry my road bike in the summer and skis in the winter and countless of other big, crazy, too-large-for -a-sedan-trunk stuff around.

I can't wait for the RAV4 to have a hybrid engine. That'll be cool. I don't think I can go back to a sedan again after being spoiled by the utility of this little gem. I guess I could get a station wagon, but wagons are... um, ugly.

 

[Marc]

I can't wait for the RAV4 to have a hybrid engine. That'll be cool. I don't think I can go back to a sedan again after being spoiled by the utility of this little gem. I guess I could get a station wagon, but wagons are... um, ugly.

Right, they're hideous... stay away from those wagons. Why would you want a sports sedan handling vehicle with the utility of an SUV and AWD to boot? That's a dumb idea, ain't it... :dunce:

I suppose this does it for some people, but just not me:

 

[Bumpsis]

I don't think I can go back to a sedan again after being spoiled by the utility of this little gem. I guess I could get a station wagon, but wagons are... um, ugly.

I appreciate this exchange and find it very inetersting. Looks to me like it all boils down to values that we hold dear and whether we can live up them.

You can always come up with a reason (excuse) to justify what you drive.
"I'm too big... sedan's too small... station wagon too ugly...mini-van too effeminite..."

It's all a matter of priorities and perception.
My station wagon (Passat wagon) actually has more cargo space than many SUVs,including the RAV4.

What's wrong with mini-vans? When it comes to cargo capacity, they are the kings and with lower ground celarance, they are significantly safer than any SUV, where, let's face it, physical laws are not in your favor.

With proper rubber (snow tires), they can can cope with most of the adverse driving conditions that majority of the on-road drivers will ever encounter.
If you really insist on 4wd, there are mini-vans that have that too.

As to "ugly", that's REALLY a matter of perspective.

C'mmon, somebody really would have to put some major wool over my eyes to convince me that a big square box on wheels, like majority of SUVs, is a vision of beauty. Most of these things look like small delivery vans. Would you feel sporty driving a bread truck?

The fact that people do find such a big box on wheels desirable, sporty or even sexy is testament to the untold millions of $$$$ that the big 3 spent on marketing, pushing the SUV.

It takes a lot of propaganda to convince so many people that a dressed up truck will make you feel strong, safe, desirable, sporty and will even get you laid - this is the essence of SUV commericials that I've seen over the years. Oh, yeah, it will blast through an avalanche too.

At the same time, a mini van, which in essence is not (at least visually)that different from an SUV, has been painted with perception of being a soft, over the hill, unmanly. A "real man" or even a "sporty", active woman wouldn't be caught dead driving one of those.
And yeah, and staion wagons are "ugly". :blink:

The funny thing is that sooo many people really believe this crap and rather than being true to their values, buy into into the auto industry propaganda.

Finally, some of you objected that I pointed out the obvious conflict of values: cherishing the nature,preserving the outdoors and yet choosing to drive the most poluting personal vehicle you can find. Maybe you did not apprecite the fact that this smacks of being a hipocrite.
Well, too bad, it does.

I'm simply making an observation which you can verify for yourself next time you're at your favorite ski area.

I'm not being "holier than thou" while being a polluter myself. Sure, by just being alive here in the US we polute. So attepmts at abosolutism are just ridiculous. Some of you said, look at yourself first (not using solar, wind or manure) before you cast judgements. I have,I strive to do what I can but I also feel it's my resposibilty to raise awarness where there doesn't seem to be one.

Well, protecting the environment is NOT an all or nothing affair. It's a progressive/cummulative process and every bit helps. As consumers, we have choices. I'm just really appaled at how many of us chose to make a really bad one when it comes to our vehicles.

If this sounds "preachy", well too bad. I think that pointing out something that we clearly see (or should see) is wrong, is a good thing.

Imagine if you will that you take a hike up to Lonsome Lake and find a bunch of people tossing empty cans and beer bottles inot the water. Then they play soccer with the styrofoam cooler that held the beer, until the pieces litter the shoreline. If you saw that would you just shrug it off and walk by or would you intervene?

I really don't seriously expect to change anyone's mind here about their SUV, but only to provoke a spark of an honest though that just may pass your mind.
Anyone who's really inetersted in this issue may find
a book by Keith Bradsher. "High and Mighty".
It's about the false promise of safety that the auto industry has been pounding on when selling these things.

 

[skibum1321]

I've used it to carry my road bike in the summer and skis in the winter and countless of other big, crazy, too-large-for -a-sedan-trunk stuff around.

Actually, with my seat folded down my bike fits in my car. And with just the 40% side folded down I can fit as much ski stuff as I would need.

 

[ALLSKIING]

I don't think I can go back to a sedan again after being spoiled by the utility of this little gem. I guess I could get a station wagon, but wagons are... um, ugly.

I appreciate this exchange and find it very inetersting. Looks to me like it all boils down to values that we hold dear and whether we can live up them.

You can always come up with a reason (excuse) to justify what you drive.
"I'm too big... sedan's too small... station wagon too ugly...mini-van too effeminite..."

It's all a matter of priorities and perception.
My station wagon (Passat wagon) actually has more cargo space than many SUVs,including the RAV4.

What's wrong with mini-vans? When it comes to cargo capacity, they are the kings and with lower ground celarance, they are significantly safer than any SUV, where, let's face it, physical laws are not in your favor.

With proper rubber (snow tires), they can can cope with most of the adverse driving conditions that majority of the on-road drivers will ever encounter.
If you really insist on 4wd, there are mini-vans that have that too.

As to "ugly", that's REALLY a matter of perspective.

C'mmon, somebody really would have to put some major wool over my eyes to convince me that a big square box on wheels, like majority of SUVs, is a vision of beauty. Most of these things look like small delivery vans. Would you feel sporty driving a bread truck?

The fact that people do find such a big box on wheels desirable, sporty or even sexy is testament to the untold millions of $$$$ that the big 3 spent on marketing, pushing the SUV.

It takes a lot of propaganda to convince so many people that a dressed up truck will make you feel strong, safe, desirable, sporty and will even get you laid - this is the essence of SUV commericials that I've seen over the years. Oh, yeah, it will blast through an avalanche too.

At the same time, a mini van, which in essence is not (at least visually)that different from an SUV, has been painted with perception of being a soft, over the hill, unmanly. A "real man" or even a "sporty", active woman wouldn't be caught dead driving one of those.
And yeah, and staion wagons are "ugly". :blink:

The funny thing is that sooo many people really believe this crap and rather than being true to their values, buy into into the auto industry propaganda.

Finally, some of you objected that I pointed out the obvious conflict of values: cherishing the nature,preserving the outdoors and yet choosing to drive the most poluting personal vehicle you can find. Maybe you did not apprecite the fact that this smacks of being a hipocrite.
Well, too bad, it does.

I'm simply making an observation which you can verify for yourself next time you're at your favorite ski area.

I'm not being "holier than thou" while being a polluter myself. Sure, by just being alive here in the US we polute. So attepmts at abosolutism are just ridiculous. Some of you said, look at yourself first (not using solar, wind or manure) before you cast judgements. I have,I strive to do what I can but I also feel it's my resposibilty to raise awarness where there doesn't seem to be one.

Well, protecting the environment is NOT an all or nothing affair. It's a progressive/cummulative process and every bit helps. As consumers, we have choices. I'm just really appaled at how many of us chose to make a really bad one when it comes to our vehicles.

If this sounds "preachy", well too bad. I think that pointing out something that we clearly see (or should see) is wrong, is a good thing.

Imagine if you will that you take a hike up to Lonsome Lake and find a bunch of people tossing empty cans and beer bottles inot the water. Then they play soccer with the styrofoam cooler that held the beer, until the pieces litter the shoreline. If you saw that would you just shrug it off and walk by or would you intervene?

I really don't seriously expect to change anyone's mind here about their SUV, but only to provoke a spark of an honest though that just may pass your mind.
Anyone who's really inetersted in this issue may find
a book by Keith Bradsher. "High and Mighty".
It's about the false promise of safety that the auto industry has been pounding on when selling these things.

:roll:

 

[GadgetRick]

You can always come up with a reason (excuse) to justify what you drive.

I neither feel the need to nor do I care about justifying what I drive to anyone. I explained why I have chosen to drive what I drive. I don't feel you or anyone else should feel the need to justify what you drive either. I will also not pass judgement on you (or anyone else) based on what you drive either.

What's wrong with mini-vans?

They're ugly and I personally don't like them. Doesn't make them bad, I just don't care for them. Do we need to justify why we like or don't like things?

they are significantly safer than any SUV

That is debatable. Define, "safer." Want to try driving a mini van ANY mini van into my 5,000 pound Disco? You talk of physics, well, the last time I checked, 5,000 pounds will win out over the much lighter, "safer," mini van. I'll take my chances in the Disco or my Saab over a mini van any day. Oh, btw, I believe the Saab also weighs more than the average mini van. I haven't checked it to be sure but the 9-5 is a relatively heavy car. Why? Safety is part of that reason...

As to "ugly", that's REALLY a matter of perspective.

Exaclty and, if I'm gonna spend upwards of $30k on a vehicle, I want to like the way it looks amoung other things.

The fact that people do find such a big box on wheels desirable, sporty or even sexy is testament to the untold millions of $$$$ that the big 3 spent on marketing, pushing the SUV.

So now people like/drive SUVs because the media told them/us to? Come on. It's called marketing. Building a brand. They market a product based on the demographics of where they feel the product will do well. Do you think they could make us all want to run out and drive a mini van if they told us they were cool?

The funny thing is that sooo many people really believe this crap and rather than being true to their values, buy into into the auto industry propaganda.

Maybe it's just that people like different things than you do. You find things to look good while others may hate what you like. We're not all supposed to like the same things.

Finally, some of you objected that I pointed out the obvious conflict of values: cherishing the nature,preserving the outdoors and yet choosing to drive the most poluting personal vehicle you can find. Maybe you did not apprecite the fact that this smacks of being a hipocrite.
Well, too bad, it does.

So, since when does being an avid snow sports lover make us all tree-loving hippies (for lack of a better term)??? If you care so much about the environment then great. Have at it. You want to drive a certain kind of car you perceive as being kind to the environment? Go do it. But don't pass judgment on others you know nothing about. That is just plain ignorant.

If this sounds "preachy", well too bad. I think that pointing out something that we clearly see (or should see) is wrong, is a good thing.

And what, exactly, is wrong about what we're doing? Driving a vehicle that doesn't get as good of gas milage as YOURS? Again, why not drive something which gets better mileage than you drive? Forget about all of the other environmental issues which have been brought up. Why not be banging on the auto makers' doors to be first in line to test a hydrogen car? Why AREN'T you driving a hybrid? Why aren't you driving a diesel? Honestly, I don't care what you drive or why you drive it. You know why? I'm not trying to judge YOUR life. How about giving the rest of us the same courtesy?

Imagine if you will that you take a hike up to Lonsome Lake and find a bunch of people tossing empty cans and beer bottles inot the water. Then they play soccer with the styrofoam cooler that held the beer, until the pieces litter the shoreline. If you saw that would you just shrug it off and walk by or would you intervene?

It sort of depends on the situation doesn't it?

I really don't seriously expect to change anyone's mind here about their SUV, but only to provoke a spark of an honest though that just may pass your mind.

Then why chime in the way you have? I don't want to convince anyone else they should be driving what I'm driving. Why should you try to convince us? Call it being inconsiderate to the environment if you want but, trust me, the environment has WAY bigger problems than the number of SUVs on the roads.

Please, come off your high horse.

 

[Greg]

You can always come up with a reason (excuse) to justify what you drive.

I neither feel the need to nor do I care about justifying what I drive to anyone.

Very well said. Last time I checked this was a free country and if I want to make the car payments, pay for the insurance, and shell out the coin to fill the tanks, it's my prerogative how many SUVs I choose to own. Free market, remember?

Finally, some of you objected that I pointed out the obvious conflict of values: cherishing the nature,preserving the outdoors and yet choosing to drive the most poluting personal vehicle you can find. Maybe you did not apprecite the fact that this smacks of being a hipocrite.
Well, too bad, it does.

So, since when does being an avid snow sports lover make us all tree-loving hippies (for lack of a better term)??? If you care so much about the environment then great. Have at it. You want to drive a certain kind of car you perceive as being kind to the environment? Go do it. But don't pass judgment on others you know nothing about. That is just plain ignorant.

And I hate to say it, but operating a ski area is probably not the most environmentally friendly thing one could do...

 

[SkiRacrNut]

Just purchased, awaiting order from factory:
2006 WRX Sportwagon
Limited Package
Roof-Ski rack
Trailer Hitch
Trailer hitch-bike rack
Bumper-cover protector

Past/Current/2ndary vehicle:
1995 Pontiac GrandAM
Nothing Special
Has never left me stuck or hangin, even in deep snow


...now all I gotta do is hope the WRX is good in the snow...and figure out how to drive a stick shift

 

[dmc]

So, since when does being an avid snow sports lover make us all tree-loving hippies (for lack of a better term)??? If you care so much about the environment then great. Have at it. You want to drive a certain kind of car you perceive as being kind to the environment? Go do it. But don't pass judgment on others you know nothing about. That is just plain ignorant.

And I hate to say it, but operating a ski area is probably not the most environmentally friendly thing one could do...

BUUUUUUURN!!!!!

 

[Greg]

Finally, some of you objected that I pointed out the obvious conflict of values: cherishing the nature,preserving the outdoors and yet choosing to drive the most poluting personal vehicle you can find. Maybe you did not apprecite the fact that this smacks of being a hipocrite.
Well, too bad, it does.

So, since when does being an avid snow sports lover make us all tree-loving hippies (for lack of a better term)??? If you care so much about the environment then great. Have at it. You want to drive a certain kind of car you perceive as being kind to the environment? Go do it. But don't pass judgment on others you know nothing about. That is just plain ignorant.

And I hate to say it, but operating a ski area is probably not the most environmentally friendly thing one could do...

And remember that when you purchase a lift ticket this weekend, you are directly supporting an industry that has no problem with cutting down large swaths of trees on some of the Northeast's most pristine mountain areas as well as expending large amounts of energy (half of this country's electricity is generated by burning coal) to turn lifts and run snowmaking systems. So...who's the hypocrite? Meanwhile you're going to lecture those of us that drive vehicles that get 18 MPG vs. yours that gets 25? Let's be reasonable...

 

[hammer]

And remember that when you purchase a lift ticket this weekend, you are directly supporting an industry that has no problem with cutting down large swaths of trees on some of the Northeast's most pristine mountain areas as well as expending large amounts of energy (half of this country's electricity is generated by burning coal) to turn lifts and run snowmaking systems. So...who's the hypocrite? Meanwhile you're going to lecture those of us that drive vehicles that get 18 MPG vs. yours that gets 25? Let's be reasonable...

You have a point, but now I feel guilty about going skiing...

...NOT!

I have nothing of substance to add here...maybe we should throw in a helmet debate? :wink:

 

[Vortex]

Hammer very funny. :beer:

 

[ctenidae]

I have nothing of substance to add here...maybe we should throw in a helmet debate? :wink:

Might as well take care of everything here while we're at it- Snowboarders suck, too.

There's nothing worse than a non-helmet wearing snowboarder in an SUV. Unless they're a <insert political affiliation>, then they're worse. or one of those <insert ethnic/religious/other demographic descriptor>. Those are the absolute worst.

There's too much :argue: leading to a lot of :angry: which makes the baby Jesus . We really should all :beer: more, which makes us all and much more 8) .

 

[Vortex]

The best I have heard is Nuke Gay Whales for Jesus. I have not seen it, but it is a bumper sticker. Covers a few bases.

 

[ctenidae]

That's pretty good- guranteed to offend 80% of any crowd.

My personal favorite is still "Sorry about your daughter"