What the heck is going on at Magic?

[Sorcerer]

The story I heard is the new ownership wanted to invest in snowmaking to make Magic sustainable and the minority owner threw a hissy fit that it'll "destroy Magic's charm" or some bs like that. No need to go Okemo on the place, but you can't get skiers the way the place is now. One trail - possibly nothing - for MLK? Two maybe for Prez week?

People are seeing through their "we have no weather" lies. Both Bromely (20-for-47) and Stratton (53-for-94) are open. Ascutney soon on natural.

This is a fucking joke.

I heard that the minority owner (operator) had agreed to sell after some "discussions" with the majority owner. Then the majority owner pulled something unexpected (not unusual for him) during due diligence that blew the deal. I think that the problems at Magic all resolve around the lack of funds. There was someone who was supposed to supply some funding but after a short time he "disappeared".

 

[mister moose]

Watching this unfold from up the road an hour, I have a question.

First the disclaimer: I haven't been to Magic in years. Decades. I'm sure there's part of the story I'm missing, and even more that hasn't been made public. I get it that there are significant infrastructure obstacles to overcome, and that takes a lot of money.

There have been several efforts to reinvigorate Magic. Mistakes were made. Mistakes are also inevitable amongst mere humans.

Isn't it likely that in spite of all the effort, in spite of a crowd funding gift from Magic's faithful ("The Club") the rent on the place is just too damn high? The asking price on the sale is too high?

That's why Ascutney didn't sell to anyone. Likely why Maple Valley isn't selling to anyone. Sell me Maple Valley for a dollar, and I bet I could turn a profit. In addition, the towns need to value these parcels at a value that allows the taxes to be such to allow an operation to be profitable. So sell me maple Valley for a dollar, tax me on a value of a dollar parcel, and boom, I make money and am viable.

Oh, a dollar is ridiculous you say. Of course. But like the old hooker joke, now we're just talking price.

Do the owners and the town over-value Magic?

 

[Wardrobe]

Watching this unfold from up the road an hour, I have a question.

First the disclaimer: I haven't been to Magic in years. Decades. I'm sure there's part of the story I'm missing, and even more that hasn't been made public. I get it that there are significant infrastructure obstacles to overcome, and that takes a lot of money.

There have been several efforts to reinvigorate Magic. Mistakes were made. Mistakes are also inevitable amongst mere humans.

Isn't it likely that in spite of all the effort, in spite of a crowd funding gift from Magic's faithful ("The Club") the rent on the place is just too damn high? The asking price on the sale is too high?

That's why Ascutney didn't sell to anyone. Likely why Maple Valley isn't selling to anyone. Sell me Maple Valley for a dollar, and I bet I could turn a profit. In addition, the towns need to value these parcels at a value that allows the taxes to be such to allow an operation to be profitable. So sell me maple Valley for a dollar, tax me on a value of a dollar parcel, and boom, I make money and am viable.

Oh, a dollar is ridiculous you say. Of course. But like the old hooker joke, now we're just talking price.

Do the owners and the town over-value Magic?

The ski operation at Magic is a white elephant in its current state. In a good snow season in which snowmaking is not really needed, perhaps Magic can break even. In a bad snow season like we are having now, the snow making system is so antiquated that it cannot make enough snow to attract an adequate number of skiers to cover the costs of running the mountain. One of the main goals of the shareholder plan a few years ago was to raise money to invest in the snowmaking system to make the ski operation sustainable. The shareholder plan failed for a variety of reasons.

One issue that likely spooks potential investors is that even when all of the trails are open, the only days with a significant number of paying customers are powder days. Why invest $1 million + in snowmaking if people won't come to cover your cost?

What Magic needs is deep pocketed investors that love the mountain and do not necessarily care about earning a profit or even losing money. The shareholder plan was a good idea in theory but its execution was its fatal flaw.

 

[BlueTrails]

Watching this unfold from up the road an hour, I have a question.

First the disclaimer: I haven't been to Magic in years. Decades. I'm sure there's part of the story I'm missing, and even more that hasn't been made public. I get it that there are significant infrastructure obstacles to overcome, and that takes a lot of money.

There have been several efforts to reinvigorate Magic. Mistakes were made. Mistakes are also inevitable amongst mere humans.

Isn't it likely that in spite of all the effort, in spite of a crowd funding gift from Magic's faithful ("The Club") the rent on the place is just too damn high? The asking price on the sale is too high?

That's why Ascutney didn't sell to anyone. Likely why Maple Valley isn't selling to anyone. Sell me Maple Valley for a dollar, and I bet I could turn a profit. In addition, the towns need to value these parcels at a value that allows the taxes to be such to allow an operation to be profitable. So sell me maple Valley for a dollar, tax me on a value of a dollar parcel, and boom, I make money and am viable.

Oh, a dollar is ridiculous you say. Of course. But like the old hooker joke, now we're just talking price.

Do the owners and the town over-value Magic?

I drive by Maple Valley all the time. Not sure I'd take it for a dollar. You need a few Mil to open. Groomers cost more than houses. All the lifts would have to be completely replaced. But I would love to see it open, especially for night skiing. Magic used to have night skiing.

Londonderry is dying for Magic to open. All the local businesses thrive on the income stream. I'm sure it's tough all over from the IGA to the UPL.

Rent is not the issue. Right now any rent money would just be moving from the right pocket to the left.

Yeah, the crowding funding gift. That's a good story. Where did that money go?

 

[zoomzoom]

magic needs natural snow, and badly, every year. (duh!)

the aging snowmaking pipes need patching due to corrosion and the snowguns are relatively inefficient compared to what's on the market these days. but i think the real hinderance to s-m performance is the amount of available water in the pond, and the time it needs to regen when emptied. pls, somebody tell me i'm wrong.

with good temps it seems like you can get top-to-bottom or tubing, but not both.

 

[slatham]

My understanding is that the pond is not an issue given current system capacity. I've been told it re-fills very quickly. But you are correct that if the systems output (and budget) were increased then they would need to fix the dam to fully fill the pond.

 

[doublediamond]

The Pond isn't that big of a deal. If it was it would have been fixed.

From Google Earth, it appears it is ~ 325'x 700' and they've said the max with the fixed dam would be only 10M Gal. The pond can easily be dredged to at least double that, possibly 25M gal which would yield ~138 AcreFt of snow. The angle of repose of wet clay is a 1:4 slope. Everything else has a steeper angle of repose. The average refill rate in northeast for snowmaking ponds is 1.2x or about 300 AcreFt of snow from a 25M gal pond. That's enough for more or less a 3 ft base on almost all the imaginable snowmaking terrain (excluding Magician, Slide of Hans, Black Line, Red Line, and Green Line, and unnecessary connectors).

 

[deadheadskier]

What is the water source they draw from to fill it? Do they pump from a local river at high flow like Okemo does out of the Black River to fill their ponds or is it mountain runoff only that fills it?

 

[Sorcerer]

magic needs natural snow, and badly, every year. (duh!)

the aging snowmaking pipes need patching due to corrosion and the snowguns are relatively inefficient compared to what's on the market these days. but i think the real hinderance to s-m performance is the amount of available water in the pond, and the time it needs to regen when emptied. pls, somebody tell me i'm wrong.

with good temps it seems like you can get top-to-bottom or tubing, but not both.

You are wrong. The pond hasn't been an issue for awhile. If they really started making snow continuously for a period of time that could be true. As I understand it, they either have or had a permit to pump water from a pump located in the stream that runs alongside route 11 that comes from Lowell Lake if they need it.They haven't used it for a number of years. It still comes down to having money available to do what is needed. One really, really big problem that the mountain has is that aside from the people who really know the mountain and ski it when the snow is great (or are dedicated season holders) no on else even knows it exists (is open). There is next to no advertising. Locals form Manchester, long time skiers from Stratton and Bromley ...continually ask if Magic is open, do they make snow, do they groom and of course are the lifts running - these are the locals, not the potential skiers from New England, New York and New Jersey. Magic has more snow making potential (given some money) than most people realize. They do have a number of broken pipes but , I believe Do Work or some others can better comment on that better than I can. They can cover a good number of trails (Magic Carpet, Wand, Upper Trick, Lower Trick, Medium, Showoff, Hocus Pocus, Wizard, Talisman, Vertigo(I think), and maybe some others. That is a good selection of beginner, Intermediate and advanced trails (In my opinion more interesting and varied that you can find at Stratton or Bromley).

Too many people making comments here don't know what they are talking about. Some of that, of course, is because the mountain isn't being clear about what is happening. I think this, in big part, is because they often say what they want to do versus what they can really afford to do.

 

[xwhaler]

A couple yrs ago they blew on wizard, talisman and even sorcerer on the west side. In addition to the East Side. I've seen them make snow before (when they want to)

 

[UYSDYP]

"When they can afford to" fify

 

[steamboat1]

You are wrong.

Too many people making comments here don't know what they are talking about.

Yeah I got that line at least 50 pages back. It appears I was right.

How's my buddy Do Work doing? Still cutting trees or is he welding snowmaking pipe that no one uses?

:grin:

 

[UYSDYP]

Yeah I got that line at least 50 pages back. It appears I was right.

How's my buddy Do Work doing? Still cutting trees or is he welding snowmaking pipe that no one uses?

:grin:

Yup he organizes volunteer dayz. the bottom line is they don't have lifts that are inspected. But one day it will happen that we will ski the lines we trimmed this fall. I can't wait.

 

[steamboat1]

Yup he organizes volunteer dayz. the bottom line is they don't have lifts that are inspected.

Don't have snow either (man made or natural), sometimes that helps I've heard.

 

[zoomzoom]

mr sorcerer

am not sure what i'm wrong about? cliff notes from my post:
-- magic needs natural snow
-- s-m pipes are corroded and need patching
-- s-m guns are less efficient than the latest in the market
-- i think the available water in the pond is a hinderance, pls tell me if i'm wrong
-- seems like t2b or tubing, but not both

you didn't clearly rebut any points from my post, and your use of caps shows a lack of courtesy and professionalism. magic's "lack of advertising" diversion was clever but the summary statement irrelevant. your rebuttal failed, but you did hurt my feelings. so you've got that going for you.

 

[UYSDYP]

Yah! everything is buffed out, one storm and its a go. Being optimistic here as I've blown $900 on this bullshit tom Barker situation. But seriously the woods are gonna be so great. Skied okemo today and really miss natural terrain. Sure blowing heaps of snow is great but its like paved highways. Not that much fun.

 

[deadheadskier]

You done?

It's one thing to be critical and frank about the sad state of affairs at Magic. Total comedy of errors. Everyone knows it.

But these comments you're making here aren't directed at the mountain's issue.

You're trying to rile up and piss off the people like Do Work who volunteer and invest massive amounts of their time to make things happen at the mountain they love.

My question for you steamboat is why?

 

[PearlJam09]

You done?

It's one thing to be critical and frank about the sad state of affairs at Magic. Total comedy of errors. Everyone knows it.

But these comments you're making here aren't directed at the mountain's issue.

You're trying to rile up and piss off the people like Do Work who volunteer and invest massive amounts of their time to make things happen at the mountain they love.

My question for you steamboat is why?

Steamboat's panties are on a wee bit too tight.

 

[UYSDYP]

You done?

It's one thing to be critical and frank about the sad state of affairs at Magic. Total comedy of errors. Everyone knows it.

But these comments you're making here aren't directed at the mountain's issue.

You're trying to rile up and piss off the people like Do Work who volunteer and invest massive amounts of their time to make things happen at the mountain they love.

My question for you steamboat is why?

Why take the bait. It's just a stupid meaningless forum. Magic is fucked at the moment but that too will change. Go ski somewhere crowded and bulldozed and you'll remember whats important.

 

[UYSDYP]

Rfid and bubbles did it for me. I hate technology and skiing(kinda). Old school and simple works.