Who represents the Ski Industry Target Market

[dlague]

All the talk about grooming out runs, in particular bump runs got me to start investigating a little

So, keep in mind, all of you in this forum and other skiing forums are not your average skiers and snowboarders. The average skier/snowboarder has about 6 visits per season and are upper beginner to low intermediate. Heck many of us here hit 6 days in November.

Also, the age demographics are changing as well with Skiers and snowboarders age 45+ now making up 40% of the market.

Those ages 45-54 made up 20 percent of skiers last winter, up from 14 percent in the 1997-98 season; the 55-64 age group made up 12 percent, up from nearly 5 percent, and those 65 and older rose to 5.5 percent from 2.5 percent, according to the NSAA study.

To make matters worse the sport is becoming more affluent. Is it getting priced out with more ski areas going over $100 for a lift ticket? Now, those who know where to look can ski on the cheap relatively speaking like all of you on this forum for example. But I found this statistic interesting

But despite the availability of deals, a report commissioned in August 2015 by the National Ski Areas Association found that skiing in the United States has increasingly become a sport for the wealthy. The percentage of people who participate in snow sports with household incomes over $100,000 has risen over the past eight seasons from 45 percent of ski area visitors in the 2006-07 season to 56 percent of visitors in the 2013-14 season, according to the report.

Meanwhile, those with household incomes under $50,000 dropped from 30 percent of ski area visitors to 19 percent over the same period. Visitors who make between $50,000 and $99,999 remained steady over the years at about 25 percent.

So we wonder why the trails are getting groomed out?

 

[SnowRider]

The industry doesn't have a general target market, each mountain does. And even then, each mountain focuses on the specific skier/rider types they actually stand a chance at marketing too.

 

[dlague]

The industry doesn't have a general target market, each mountain does. And even then, each mountain focuses on the specific skier/rider types they actually stand a chance at marketing too.

See you are thinking resorts/mountain AND LOCAL. But there are destinations, gear, outer wear, ETC.

Sure I get that especially of age demographics are getting older or income demographics are going higher, even ability demographics play into it all which all were mentioned above. With all that in mind, I think the markets become localized, however, with cost rising all the time and the 18-25 demographic getting smaller it seems that the 35-44 age group is becoming the target. The demographic is driving the 6-17 year old demographic and they are more than likely established in their careers. And even locally that theory applies.

 

[JimG.]

Also, the age demographics are changing as well with Skiers and snowboarders age 45+ now making up 40% of the market.



To make matters worse the sport is becoming more affluent. Is it getting priced out with more ski areas going over $100 for a lift ticket? Now, those who know where to look can ski on the cheap relatively speaking like all of you on this forum for example. But I found this statistic interesting




So we wonder why the trails are getting groomed out?

OK, I'll bite and admit it. I'm an old (55+) affluent guy. Does this mean it is abnormal for me to expect expert terrain to also have bumps?

There is way too much grooming in my opinion. NEVER should more than 65-70% of a resort's terrain be groomed at any one time. Now it's almost impossible to find bumps anywhere in the NE. I agree with DHS...even if the bumps are frozen I will ski a few bump runs. But now I rarely even have any choice.

When I visited Quebec last season I was so thrilled to see multiple steep long trails covered wall to wall with bumps (not a fan of the "half groom" idea either). Took me back to the days when if you wanted to ski the front four at Stowe you had better be able to ski bumps!

Many US ski areas have gotten just plain BoRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRing!

 

[snoseek]

Millenials have no where near the disposable income that boomers had at the same age. College is much more expensive and buying into homes is getting to be pipe dream for a growing number. Soooo you have a shrinking demographic of young ripper and more groomers. Its that simple


Edit-I know most on here are far from the norm...jimg I'm with you although way poorer and a bit younger.

 

[JimG.]

I know most on here are far from the norm...jimg I'm with you although way poorer and a bit younger.

A good point about millennials but I also know many who are far from destitute. The issue of skiing being expensive is also true but an increasing part of that is because of amenities such as grooming and high speed lifts. Frankly so many costs are being loaded onto the skiing model there is no way it can sustain itself. Skiing isn't about skiing anymore it's about the other attractions as well. Waterparks anybody?

Skiing makes me feel young so maybe I don't represent my demographic all that well either.

 

[dlague]

A good point about millennials but I also know many who are far from destitute. The issue of skiing being expensive is also true but an increasing part of that is because of amenities such as grooming and high speed lifts. Frankly so many costs are being loaded onto the skiing model there is no way it can sustain itself. Skiing isn't about skiing anymore it's about the other attractions as well. Waterparks anybody?

Skiing makes me feel young so maybe I don't represent my demographic all that well either.

Actually, the 45+ demographic is growing primarily due to the boomers getting to be that age. That being said, it does not mean that we do not ski bumps, but there comes a time where bump bashing is not the same as it was. I certainly do not ski bumps as often as I used to mostly due to skiing with my wife. She can ski bumps but does not necessarily like to do that all day, nor do I any more. Last year at A Basin I caught an edge skiing a bumped steep run and lunged forward and started a tumble - luckily about three bumps later I stopped - what went through my head? Shit I am going to tomahawk down this whole trail - I a goner! I will be honest, I am finding that I am more calculated than I have ever been.

My wife and I met this guy who was 80 years old and skis every other day. He was rocking some Soul 7 skis and we watched him ski ahead of us and he had that nice classic form that you do not see that often any more. He was not killing it he was just taking his sweet as time and it looked beautiful!

BTW Bragging rights go to those age 68 and older, who averaged 9.5 days skiing last season - more than any other age group.

Also the trend is to provide more things to do so, SPAs, theaters, variety of dining, yes waterparks, etc is the trend with larger resorts while year round activities are also trending to increase revenues.

 

[deadheadskier]

OK, I'll bite and admit it. I'm an old (55+) affluent guy. Does this mean it is abnormal for me to expect expert terrain to also have bumps?

There is way too much grooming in my opinion. NEVER should more than 65-70% of a resort's terrain be groomed at any one time. Now it's almost impossible to find bumps anywhere in the NE. I agree with DHS...even if the bumps are frozen I will ski a few bump runs. But now I rarely even have any choice.

When I visited Quebec last season I was so thrilled to see multiple steep long trails covered wall to wall with bumps (not a fan of the "half groom" idea either). Took me back to the days when if you wanted to ski the front four at Stowe you had better be able to ski bumps!

Many US ski areas have gotten just plain BoRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRing!

Good point on Stowe. That's exactly how/why I learned to ski bumps. I didn't just love moguls as a young learning skier. Around aged 9 I wanted to be able to ski the most difficult trails on any mountain. Well, in order to do that, I had to learn to ski bumps. I didn't take lessons to learn moguls. I put the time in. There's no substitute for practice. I simple started skiing moguls constantly because I wanted to ski Outer Limits without struggling and looking like an idiot in the process. I simply watched the best bump skiers and tried to copy what they were doing. In the beginning, I'd try to zip a line and make it 2-3 bumps before crashing. 2-3 became 4-5 and within a couple of seasons I was able to run bumps well top to bottom.

Another argument why there actually should be MORE moguls now than there was in the past is technology; both mountain technology and equipment technology. The skis, boots and bindings of today are SO MUCH better than what I had growing up in the 80s. That makes it easier for people to become better skiers faster on all terrain types including bumps. The mountain grooming and snowmaking technology means that mountains that get little to no natural snow can offer man made bumps. This was unthinkable 20 years ago. Literally every single ski area in the country can offer a decent mogul product now. Not having enough natural snow or expert skiers to form bumps isn't an excuse anymore. Bumps should be viewed the exact same as terrain parks. It's a terrain feature resort should always be certain to have and promote.

 

[snoseek]

I cant for the life of me figure out how even an advanced skiers mountain, like say Cannon, grooms out such a large percentage of their terrain. I get the freeze thaw issue....but grooming a trail like avalanche damn near everyday, despite snow conditions, seems silly.

 

[Edd]

Intermediate bumps are badly needed. At most ski areas, it's a jump from intermediate groomers to advanced bumps, which I struggle with, barring great conditions. If that gap can be filled, it would be a positive step towards more bumps on the mountain in general.

 

[dlague]

Intermediate bumps are badly needed. At most ski areas, it's a jump from intermediate groomers to advanced bumps, which I struggle with, barring great conditions. If that gap can be filled, it would be a positive step towards more bumps on the mountain in general.

Head west - bumps are much easier to ski by a long shot!

 

[drjeff]

Many of today's (and these even goes for the last 10+ yrs) kids aren't learning to ski bumps in the frequency that they used too simply because they're spending more time in terrain parks and less time skiing the whole mountain - that is a big shift in the development process of so many young skiers now, and that lack of bumps experience is likely to continue as this age demographic gets older

Without a doubt though, the families with kids demographic will always be a prime industry target, as those families are likely not to just bring more than one person to the ski area/resort, but also purchase other items from food and beverage to lessons to rentals, making them a higher yield group of the area/resort

Sent from my XT1254 using AlpineZone mobile app

 

[benski]

Ski schools should take all there experts skiers into the bumps. All large mountain should have intermediate bumps like Moonshine at Sugarbush.

 

[SnowRider]

Millenials have no where near the disposable income that boomers had at the same age. College is much more expensive and buying into homes is getting to be pipe dream for a growing number. Soooo you have a shrinking demographic of young ripper and more groomers. Its that simple

This combined with feeder resorts closing. You see mountains getting smarter about it though. Mount Snow offers their college pass deal until 24 or 25 I beleive. I also think resorts are working towards more package deals.

 

[benski]

I think young people would ski a lot more if they knew they can ski in April and late March. Cheeper lodging, cheeper tickets, more partying, and occasional scantly clad women should make spring skiing popular with younger people but very few people know it even is a thing.

 

[VTKilarney]

I just saw a study that said that Millenials are making 20% less on average than Boomers were at the same age.

The Boomers are the first generation in a long time to leave the country worse off than they found it. Thanks, Boomers.

 

[cdskier]

I think young people would ski a lot more if they knew they can ski in April and late March. Cheeper lodging, cheeper tickets, more partying, and occasional scantly clad women should make spring skiing popular with younger people but very few people know it even is a thing.

Interesting...they really don't know that? With the ease of coming across this type of info on the Internet, I would have thought the younger people would know this easily. When I was in college, spring break was when I always planned my ski trip to VT.

 

[bdfreetuna]

Icy moguls suck. So they get groomed. Also mogul skiing is no longer a competitive event many people take interest in. The young crowd would rather watch freestyle "unconventional" steep ungroomed terrain get skied creatively for style points.

So areas groom a few more trails now, but they also cut 5 or 10 woods in the last decade. I'll take it.

 

[JimG.]

Intermediate bumps are badly needed. At most ski areas, it's a jump from intermediate groomers to advanced bumps, which I struggle with, barring great conditions. If that gap can be filled, it would be a positive step towards more bumps on the mountain in general.

From your mouth to the ears of every ski area manager on Earth.

Amen.

 

[Smellytele]

Many of today's (and these even goes for the last 10+ yrs) kids aren't learning to ski bumps in the frequency that they used too simply because they're spending more time in terrain parks and less time skiing the whole mountain - that is a big shift in the development process of so many young skiers now, and that lack of bumps experience is likely to continue as this age demographic gets older

Without a doubt though, the families with kids demographic will always be a prime industry target, as those families are likely not to just bring more than one person to the ski area/resort, but also purchase other items from food and beverage to lessons to rentals, making them a higher yield group of the area/resort

Sent from my XT1254 using AlpineZone mobile app

I have brainwashed my kids to love bumps and trees. They don't like parks nor racing. As far as racing they see skiing as a fun thing and don't like to be told when to turn. Although I do find racers are more likely to ski the whole mountain than park rats and can ski better.