What in the world is going on at wildcat…

[deadheadskier]

No mention of snowmaking on the website or social media that I saw. Maybe Christmas Eve Eve is a holiday for them. Lol

 

[Hockeyski1998]

Can you still defer for any reason? If so yeah you probably should.

Also are they seriously not making snow today in this cold? Man things are really broken...I hope it snows in January so I can get up there.

I believe you are able to move it to a pass for next season if you do not use your pass at all this season. Don’t quote me on it, I definitely will have to check into it. However, it’s such a terrible situation. I have a place not far from both Attitash and wildcat… it brings back my memories of skiing there as a kid. I will have to see how things pan out in the next month as I will not be heading to the North Conway area till the end of January

 

[Quietman]

Can you still defer for any reason? If so yeah you probably should.

 

[chuckstah]

I think they made a refund or rollover almost bulletproof this year. Medical issues or closures, not much else, without looking to verify.

 

[eatskisleep]

No mention of snowmaking on the website or social media that I saw. Maybe Christmas Eve Eve is a holiday for them. Lol

I’d guess the rumors are true about the snow makers leaving the job then.

 

[thetrailboss]

Considering how bad everything was in New Hampshire at the Vail resorts last season, are any of you at all surprised at how it’s going so far?

 

[snoseek]

Considering how bad everything was in New Hampshire at the Vail resorts last season, are any of you at all surprised at how it’s going so far?

I shouldn't be but yes I am. I figured Covid and all last year was alot for Vail to handle with all the new resorts...growing pains. I sorta figured they would run things shitty but maybe would have learned from last years mistakes. I'm starting to see this is how its actually going to be and its not a mistake its all by design.

As a company they will never last back east operating like this. The masses will show next week and you'll be hearing alot of complaining. It won't just be the core locals bitching anymore.

 

[deadheadskier]

Considering how bad everything was in New Hampshire at the Vail resorts last season, are any of you at all surprised at how it’s going so far?

Not at all surprised. ALL of the local competition performed better than Frob the fraud last year and really didn't make excuses about Covid. They showed they wanted to kick ass for their customers and come back great from the abruptly ended 19-20 season. Bring normalcy and joy back as much as they could.

Not Vail. They made excuse after excuse about staffing and everything else they could last season.

The fact that they're performing even worse two years in is what's really surprising to me. I thought after last year's garbage they'd improve at least a little And last year really got bailed out in a serious way for Vail with good weather in January and February.

I didn't buy an Epic Pass this season. I did so kinda hoping I'd eat crow. The last time I didn't have a pass at Wildcat was after a disastrous season operationally that had already followed a poor season prior with promises to fix things which Peak didn't. Peak didn't hide and apologized all season for fucking up and promised to fix it for real. I needed to see it to believe it and didn't buy a pass. Peak did an even bigger upgrade than promised and started gunning for a Nov 1st to May 1st every season after. I ate crow big time

No crow this time around

I was never so excited about my skiing possibilities when Vail bought Peak. The mountain locations and my personal history with those mountains in NH combined with VT is perfect for me.

I grew up skiing Okemo as my home hill from 83 to 94 when I graduated HS.

Stowe became home as a college student mixed with a ski bum degenerate through my mid 20s.

Wildcat has been my most skied place since 2007 by far. I love Crotched for what it offers as a quick hit.

Perfect!!!

Nope. Vail is a god damned disaster

 

[snoseek]

I've on and off skied Wildcat since I was a little kid. The Bobcat chair was a tbar the first time I went to give you an idea. There's been some rough patches and the snowmaking and grooming has always lacked, that the appeal but right here in 2021 I've not seen them not be able to ski t2b going into xmas. Last year was Lynx till sometime in January. This is the new normal I guess and until Vail is gone things are grim.

The local businesses must be fucking livid.

 

[Mainer]

I don’t think vail has hurt business for the locals. The MWV valley is as busy as ever. The epic pass brings a lot of mediocre skiers that need to buy gear. When I was at attitash they weren’t doing rentals so people were going to Andes to rent. The local skiers are pissed though. Vail not joining the chamber, canning the rec ski league. Putting out a terrible effort compared to other resorts in the area. I’d even wager that they stopped doing shop passes for Ski shops.
But the valley is in tough shape right now. Went to go to dunkins in glen closed. Went to get gas at Irving at 4 in conway closed out of gas. Went to eat on Wednesday delaneys, moat, chef bistro all closed for lunch that day. Between covid and no staff it’s a shit show in North Conway.

 

[thebigo]

I don’t think vail has hurt business for the locals. The MWV valley is as busy as ever.

Agreed, if vail was sabotaging an isolated mountain the story would be different. Attitash and wildcat are an extremely small percentage of the overall tourist draw for the MWV, further there are several ready alternatives.

 

[Edd]

Possible silver lining is this could be good for Black Mountain. I’ve gotta believe Cannon, BW, Cranmore, and Boyne (especially after buying Shawnee) will sell more passes than usual next year.

 

[thebigo]

Possible silver lining is this could be good for Black Mountain. I’ve gotta believe Cannon, BW, Cranmore, and Boyne (especially after buying Shawnee) will sell more passes than usual next year.

The numbers on the WMSP would be interesting.

Boyne needs to add an option in the southern half of NH to truly take market share from fail. I just don't know what options they have. Gunstock, pats and ragged are the obvious choices but none would appear to be available anytime soon.

Wonder if Boyne could do for whaleback what Peaks did for crotched?

 

[deadheadskier]

I bet Ragged could be had for the right price

 

[Newpylong]

God I hope not.

They've been approached quite a bit already and weren't interested.

 

[Newpylong]

The numbers on the WMSP would be interesting.

Boyne needs to add an option in the southern half of NH to truly take market share from fail. I just don't know what options they have. Gunstock, pats and ragged are the obvious choices but none would appear to be available anytime soon.

Wonder if Boyne could do for whaleback what Peaks did for crotched?

The only thing that is going to allow Whaleback to survive long term is a massive cash infusion to modernize and become more efficient. The buildings are falling down, the lifts are junk, the snowmaking is undersized by at least half and the lights are out of code and kept operating with duct tape (yeah literally). UVSSF (the non-profit that owns and operates it) has raised a good amount to fund operating loses and some capital improvements but nowhere near enough to be where it needs to be. Until thats done the product will be sub par, they'll continue losing customers who aren't captive, and they'll go year to year just surviving. I think it's going to take being run for profit unfortunately again to turn it around. I'm not sure who would be interested though the last time the place went bankrupt UVSSF bought it from the bank at auction with no other interest for far less than asking.

 

[deadheadskier]

God I hope not.

They've been approached quite a bit already and weren't interested.

I figured with your camp location, a Boyne run Ragged might have appeal. Ragged local for you, Sunday River access from your camp.

What would concern you with Boyne buying Ragged?

 

[thebigo]

I bet Ragged could be had for the right price

Pacific / ragged appear to have a good thing going. They recently acquired wintergreen and wisp after serving as an operator for a number of years. I would assume them more likely to add properties, not subtract.

After a few weeks skiing ragged several times a week, the last thing I would root for is a change in ownership. Honestly, not even sure I would like to see the expansion. If they have money to invest, I would put it towards snowmaking. The snowmaking has been excellent but you can never have enough. Being able to blow showboat and yankee top to bottom would be impressive.

 

[Newpylong]

I figured with your camp location, a Boyne run Ragged might have appeal. Ragged local for you, Sunday River access from your camp.

What would concern you with Boyne buying Ragged?

They put out a top notch product year after year. They are well staffed (and every department knows what they are doing), and the value can't be beat. They aren't sharing resources with other regional hills and their corporate overlords give them about as free of a hand as possible.

While enticing I wouldn't want to jeopardize that just to be able to ski in Maine a couple times a year on the same pass.

 

[IceEidolon]

I don't think Whaleback has enough land to be interesting to any of the big chains. To be viable as a for-profit you need two fixed grip lifts (one to the top, one replacing the mid mountain T-bar), a new lodge, a steady commitment of ~2000' of new pipe per year for a decade, at least one more electric compressor, totally new pumps and permits to run at 1000-2000 GPM, (currently less than 500 gpm) and 20 HKD SV14 towers a year and two fans. Ideally someone with the pockets to automate, too. And electrical work for the lights and fan gun power. If they had a core of a beginner trail off the midstation and an intermediate and an expert trail off the summit as reliable Christmas trails, they'd be an excellent value option/local choice. Unfortunately that takes the kind of big money that doesn't appreciate a 15+ year repayment period nor no base area development.