VAIL SUCKS

[crystalmountainskier]

Also this quote was funny, Vail literally had a brand new lift sitting in the parking lot and the town wouldn’t give them the permit to install it.

Two lifts - a six pack with mid-station and an eight pack.

 

[thetrailboss]

Also this quote was funny, Vail literally had a brand new lift sitting in the parking lot and the town wouldn’t give them the permit to install it.

Yep, that actually happened. And Vail IS investing in PCMR....just the other side of it due to that dispute.

FWIW apparently he bought the Park Record, hence why now it has become his own mouthpiece.

 

[thetrailboss]

Maybe a different operator, who was less hated and behaved more like a partner in addressing the towns concerns, would have gotten the permit

The City initially approved it; a resident appealed stating that the lift's capacity suggested that PCMR was violating its carrying capacity agreement with the City. The appeal reversed the approval on that grounds. A court upheld it.

 

[EPB]

Vail aint gonna sell Park City they don't even want to get rid of Wildcat

At the risk of making a serious faux pas and giving Vail an ounce of grace, was there really a viable offer given to Vail for Wildcat? I’ve never been able to confirm a reasonably attractive (and actionable) offer was ever given.

 

[ThatGuy]

Maybe a different operator, who was less hated and behaved more like a partner in addressing the towns concerns, would have gotten the permit

This town is extremely nimby so I wouldn’t count on it. Im not a Vail apologist but I think no matter who owned this place the town would find something to complain about.

 

[jimmywilson69]

we don't want to wait in line.

We'll put higher capacity lifts in!

We don't want new lifts with higher capacity!

 

[thetrailboss]

we don't want to wait in line.

We'll put higher capacity lifts in!

We don't want new lifts with higher capacity!

This. I get that Vail has made some missteps in Park City. The hostile takeover, the attempt to copyright the name "Park City", increasing traffic issues, etc. But the town would be a ghost town, literally, without the ski areas. If the owner was different then I'd still expect complaining about other issues.

 

[raisingarizona]

This. I get that Vail has made some missteps in Park City. The hostile takeover, the attempt to copyright the name "Park City", increasing traffic issues, etc. But the town would be a ghost town, literally, without the ski areas. If the owner was different then I'd still expect complaining about other issues.

Complaining about ski area management and the owner is a regular ski town past time in just about every single ski town.

 

[1dog]

with very few exceptions agreed. People gotta understand where their bread is buttered. Different sport but when N Conway lost the tennis gig in the 80's? it was pretty devastating for a while there after it went to VT. TB is spot on- there will always be those who complain regardless of the owner - corporate or local. Summit Ventures in MAd River was always attentive to the locals ears. Don't recall a lot of withcin' and bitchin'. Always gonna be the Clint Eastwood Gran Torino 'get off my lawn' taxpayers tho. Sometimes, they have a good argument. American way.

 

[raisingarizona]

with very few exceptions agreed. People gotta understand where their bread is buttered. Different sport but when N Conway lost the tennis gig in the 80's? it was pretty devastating for a while there after it went to VT. TB is spot on- there will always be those who complain regardless of the owner - corporate or local. Summit Ventures in MAd River was always attentive to the locals ears. Don't recall a lot of withcin' and bitchin'. Always gonna be the Clint Eastwood Gran Torino 'get off my lawn' taxpayers tho. Sometimes, they have a good argument. American way.

I love it when whiny locals say "all they care about is making money"! Like, duh. It's a business dumb ass. How do you eat?

I'm a life long ski bum but I get it, I don't help much to keep the lights on so I can't help but think these entitled locals need to get over themselves.

And yes 1 Dog, there are times where management does indeed suck .

 

[kbroderick]

I love it when whiny locals say "all they care about is making money"! Like, duh. It's a business dumb ass. How do you eat?

I'm a life long ski bum but I get it, I don't help much to keep the lights on so I can't help but think these entitled locals need to get over themselves.

And yes 1 Dog, there are times where management does indeed suck .

I think the complaint can be reasonable when the business falls to give adequate consideration to externalities that the local community bears. There are plenty of businesses out there that actively consider community impacts in their planning; it doesn't mean they're going to always put the community impact first, but they recognize that a vibrant local community is actually for business. IMO, doing that proactively is the best way to discourage local government from increasing regulation.

I also think that concern is particularly acute when the business is focused on short term profits and fails to adequately consider how externalities might affect its own long-term sustainability (eg when ski area growth pushes housing out of reach for ski area salaries).