A Little Stowe Birdie....

[thetrailboss]

...told me yesterday some not-so-great news. She works at the mountain and said to expect them to "get rid of the riff-raff" this season...

How? Season passes are going to be around $2,000.00 each this season. And no more college passes....



Stay tuned....

 

[Warp Daddy]

This form of elitism/segregation is ruining the country and is More evidence of the erosion of the Middle class ??? -- what's next a gated , guarded , welcome gate for Muffy and Buffy at Stowe ?

altho we could afford it, we will never support this kind of crap

 

[riverc0il]

This form of elitism/segregation is ruining the country and is More evidence of the erosion of the Middle class ??? -- what's next a gated , guarded , welcome gate for Muffy and Buffy at Stowe ?

altho we could afford it, we will never support this kind of crap

While I feel and understand the sentiment, I think making a public ski area into a quasi-country club through financial self selection is hardly erosion of the middle class. There has always been elitism and segregation of the high income from the low income as far back as this country has history. It is trending in a direction towards the most extreme it has ever been, but I am not sure how that is eroding the middle class which is much more concerned with housing prices, domestic goods, food pricing, transportation needs, and providing for their children. There are of course bigger issues at play and what the upper crust does with their money does have an effect on everyone. It can be negative for the middle class (housing cost increases) or positive (more jobs to service upper class recreational, residential, and social pursuits in which a limited number of people participate but a lot of people are needed to service). Etc.

Too bad about the elimination of the college pass. That was a steal even though it was the most expensive college pass around. Considering what I saw at Stowe on their closing weekend (what could be considered "riff raff" dress :roll: and smoking pot while riding the Forerunner), I think eliminating the college pass will substantially assist Stowe if they think they have an "on hill image problem" with their upper crust clientel. Raising the season pass price is sure to piss off the locals though.

But supply and demand being what it is, Stowe has just cause to do so if they feel that their product is under valued.

 

[Warp Daddy]

While There has always been elitism and segregation of the high income from the low income as far back as this country has history. It is trending in a direction towards the most extreme it has ever been,



Steve : As always a thoughful response !!


Yes and this is what is most disturbing . I do agree that the ovewhelming majority of " middle class" America could care less about what Stowe does . They are too busy taking care of basics

Skiing already has an elite imageand as you poin out UMC America seems to be trending into a more class and residentially segregated gated community. than ever before > Is that good ??


A New book called "Leisureville " by Andrew Blechman is an interesting read (Atlantic press) . It profiles several gated Retirement Utopias and their impacts both on the social mores and demographics. While this is NOTskiing specific , there may be some parallels.

Several salient questions arise as to impact of this trend downline -- but Steve with your intellectual curiosity i won't spin this book -- i'll leave you to draw your own conclusions if you read

Warp

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

This form of elitism/segregation is ruining the country and is More evidence of the erosion of the Middle class ??? -- what's next a gated , guarded , welcome gate for Muffy and Buffy at Stowe ?

altho we could afford it, we will never support this kind of crap

Come on Stowe is hardly the Yellowstone club. It's a top tier ski resort..with fast lifts, excellent terrain, snowmaking, grooming..night skiing..and now posh slopeside lodging. Not every place can be Magic, Mad River Glen, or Berkshire east. Stowe has their niche..and for many it's worth the high cost of admission. The end of the college pass(I'll believe it when I see it). But if that's the case..Stowe is shooting themselves in the foot because at least when I was at UVM..lots of students bought the college pass at Stowe who only skied 10-15 days per season..it wasn't just die-hards. I guess most students will get passes at Sugarbush, MRG, Smuggs and Jay Peak.

 

[Warp Daddy]

[QUOTE=GrilledSteezeSandwich;. The end of the college pass(I'll believe it when I see it). But if that's the case..Stowe is shooting themselves in the foot because at least when I was at UVM..lots of students bought the college pass at Stowe who only skied 10-15 days per season


True: Market forces will determine the success of any endeavor , but the market is a moving target especially downline

Your quoted Point is taken and that' s some of what's behind my thinking.. For example that 'Downline" when students graduate ,become sucessful might there be a backlash against the area ? I don't know, but it seems a legitimate question for future market development n'est pas ?

For certain other regionals WILL fill the void and MAY reap both short AND long term benefit ---

 

[ComeBackMudPuddles]

[For example that 'Downline" when students graduate ,become sucessful might there be a backlash against the area ? I don't know, but it seems a legitimate question for future market development n'est pas ?

Backlash?

Or......Those college kids who don't get to go much when they are students will think they've "finally made it" when they can afford Stowe and will gladly "finally" pay the price of admission. Truth be told, I doubt Stowe thinks the average UVM grad is their target market (even 15-20 years down the line).

It's like with BMW vs. Chevrolet....Do BMW's sales suffer because college kids can't buy them? No. Their image is one of a luxury brand that (certain) people aspire to purchase, thereby allowing BMW to charge a premium. Do they give college kids a break?

Contrast that with Chevrolet, which some college kids might consider buying out of school, but only until they can "finally" purchase BMWs, thereby depressing the price Chevy can offer their cars....Maybe some people will never buy a BMW, because of their prices, but enough people do pay the premium to make it sensible for BMW.

 

[jack97]

Yes and this is what is most disturbing . I do agree that the ovewhelming majority of " middle class" America could care less about what Stowe does . They are too busy taking care of basics

Maybe the majority of the middle class doesn't care. However, I'm in the belief that places catering to upper class does establish the value for the rest of the market and in the end it does influence the ticket and season pass prices for the rest of the ski areas. An open market system makes value a relative item.

If you think about it, why do most vendors have high end, middle end and low end products. Sometimes it for choice, other times its to set value, you make the high end product look expensive so that people feel that they are getting a bargain on the mid to low end stuff. In another life, I knew marketing people who try to optimise pricing based a three tier system. However is this case, mid end places can justify a price increase because the high end market already did their increase... lots of ways to spin this.

 

[ComeBackMudPuddles]

i just hope this won't mean the end of powderfreak/scott's TRs.....

 

[Warp Daddy]

An open market system makes value a relative item.

. lots of ways to spin this.

---For certain !!

The "champagne " effect( if you PAY MORE it MUST be WORTH more) in pricing does impact tiered pricing and consumer action/reaction.

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

i just hope this won't mean the end of powderfreak/scott's TRs.....

I doubt it..unless he moves out west..

 

[Warp Daddy]

powderfreak WILL rock on !!

 

[thetrailboss]

I'm not so sure about the credibility of the source, but she is a manager at the mountain and a friend of a friend....

She told a whole bunch of us this news. She said that they have to pay for the new construction and want to get rid of the trash. I looked online just to see what the prices were last season...$1305 early, $1635 late purchase (!). So if early is jumping up to $2,000, that is quite a jump. She figured day rates may eclipse $90.

 

[BeanoNYC]

i just hope this won't mean the end of powderfreak/scott's TRs.....

By far, my favorite reports.

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

Well unless we get official word on www.stowe.com It's all speculation. Sure $90 a day seems steep for a day at Stowe..but there are numerous ski club discounts along with multiday discounts and deeply discounted spring rates..along with an early and late season canned food day. I'm glad Stowe is doing well and one thing is for sure..I don't ever see it becoming a NELSAP lost ski area..because the mountain is just so good.

 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

By far, my favorite reports.

His weather forecasts on www.uvm.edu/skivt-l and www.firsttracksonline.com are great....I see Scott Doppler 2k on the weather channel someday although I doubt he'd want to livew in Hot-Lanta..

 

[snoseek]

Nice mountain but you'd be a fool to pay that price for a pass-rich or poor.

 

[maplevalleymaster]

According to their web site, they are offering a college pass for 07/08 and prices will be around 1,600 for late purchase adult season pass.

http://www.stowe.com/tickets/season_passes/

 

[ski_resort_observer]

According to their web site, they are offering a college pass for 07/08 and prices will be around 1,600 for late purchase adult season pass.

http://www.stowe.com/tickets/season_passes/

last seasons info

 

[deadheadskier]

I think 2 G's is going to see their season pass sales go way down. At that price, even if day tickets were $90, the break even point is 22.2 days. I'm sure there are some folks who get passes as a matter of convenience, not to break even; but the vast majority of folks get a pass to save money. Most places the break even point is in the 12 to 15 day range.

At 22, some people will most likely stick to day tickets. This puts the mountain at a greater financial risk in terms of weathers influence on people's buying decisions.