Attn. Killington, Chris Danforth, Marketing Manager - RE: SPRING SKIING

[Nick]

well hopefully march is the snowiest month this year. Since the rest of them haven't been that great.

 

[skiersleft]

I wasnt going to say anything, but yeah, I read that from Killington and did a, huh?

Not that the difference between the snowfall in any of the 4 months is massively dramatically different, but March statistically has the least snow of any of the 4 months. It's common sense if you're thinking about averages, as cold is a necessary condition for snow.

At Killington, March has historically been the snowiest month. While Killington is in Vermont, state averages don't necessarily coincide with averages at ski resorts, as mountains have their own microclimates that makes precip there differ from precip at valley locales. Also, note that while it's true that cold is a necessary condition snow, that's also true about moisture rich disturbances. While March is not as cold as January or February, it's usually stormier because you get more clashes of cool and warm airmasses. Since Vermont at higher elevations remains pretty cold in March and it's very stormy, you often get significant snowfall. I agree that the difference between these months is not very significant, but it's technically correct that march is the snowiest month at Killington on average. Here are the stats:

http://www.killington.com/winter/mountain/mountain_info/historical_weather

 

[Nick]

Holy crap people, give HS a break! These are legitimate questions, asked in a polite manner, and I am sure the answers would interest many people on this board.

I agree on all points. But as DHS and others have said, I know HS has issues with the way Powdr operates, and hey, that's fine, everyone is entitled to their own opinions. If someone else had asked this question I wouldn't have had the hunch on baiting that I have here.

Like others have said, it's probably too early for an intelligible answer on the plans for the spring, particularly given the type of season we have had so far, and on top of that I can't imagine what answer might be given that would lead HS to say, "Sounds perfect!". :lol:

Anyway - as long as it's kept civil in here we can keep the thread open. I'll take your word for it, HS. I value the industry representation in AlpineZone a lot, from resorts across the northeast, and that doesn't mean we don't ask tough questions (the AZ Challenge usually has some very difficult questions) - but they are aggregated and filtered in a way that can be responded to in a controlled manner. If there were threads springing up all the time baiting all the industry reps, you can bet they would disappear from the site.

Internet forums... when it comes to stuff like this ... you can never make everyone happy.

 

[gmcunni]

If it was a spring pass, I would agree with HS. But this is a four day pass. This attempt = FAIL

isn't that telling in of itself? they've abandoned the spring pass and just offer discounted days.. no hope of a late spring @ K???

 

[drjeff]

If it was a spring pass, I would agree with HS. But this is a four day pass. This attempt = FAIL

Maybe for what you might be looking for AZ, it could be viewed as a FAIL, but for someone like myself (or a season passholder to another mountain that usually closes in early April) this has some potential.

Us Mount Snow regulars have been told that weather permitting, they'll spin the lifts through Easter (April 8th this year) and then after that operations would be based on the old "snow and business conditions permitting" plan. If March doesn't deliver with some decent snowfall, this is an option that I might have to think about, especially after I head up to K in a few weeks so my kids can race in the Mountain Dew Vertical Challenge qualifier and see what the snow situation is like there 1st hand.

If K came out and said something to the extent of "as of now, weather permitting we plan on operating daily through ?? and then after that based on snow and business levels on weekends" that would really tempt me to plop down the VISA card and buy a few for the family

 

[TheBEast]

 

[drjeff]

isn't that telling in of itself? they've abandoned the spring pass and just offer discounted days.. no hope of a late spring @ K???

Maybe they're looking at it as a way to get folks who might not have committed to a more expensive spring pass because of the other activities that tend to pop up in late March/April and possibly beyond and they we're worried that they wouldn't get their $$'s worth out of it into a shorter term item, with the ability to add on some more days if they find the need to do so. If the old standard for a spring pass is about $300, then that person would have to get 7 days on the hill for them to feel like a more traditional unlimited # of days spring pass would have been a better deal. I'm guessing that far more people would use it/have used a spring pass in the past, for less than 7 days than more than 7 days??

 

[2knees]

Holy crap people, give HS a break! These are legitimate questions, asked in a polite manner, and I am sure the answers would interest many people on this board.

SERIOUSLY?????????

.

 

[steamboat1]

Didn't see this thread at 1st so I posted the 4-play pass in the skiing on the cheap thread.

As for historical snowfall this is right off the Killington web page.

SNOWFALL AVERAGES
November 29 inches
December 33 inches
January 52 inches
February 55 inches
March 57 inches
April 24 inches

(Measured at the 4,000-foot level below the summit of Killington Peak)

I hope they stay open late. I know last year they closed May 1 with plenty of snow still left on both Superstar & Skyelark (I was there). I'd guess they could have stayed open for at least another 2 weeks, maybe more. There were plenty of people skiing the last day but I don't know how many were season pass holders as opposed to day ticket sales. Be interesting to see what they do this year since they erected the 2 umbrella bars at the base of Superstar that weren't there before this season.

 

[2knees]

I hope they stay open late. I know last year they closed May 1 with plenty of snow still left on both Superstar & Skyelark (I was there). I'd guess they could have stayed open for at least another 2 weeks, maybe more. There were plenty of people skiing the last day but I don't know how many were season pass holders as opposed to day ticket sales. Be interesting to see what they do this year since they erected the 2 umbrella bars at the base of Superstar that weren't there before this season.

last year closing with wall to wall (almost) coverage on ss was sad. It was busy no doubt and the lines on ss were fantastic.

http://forums.alpinezone.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4578&d=1304293156

that being said, it's hard to believe they'll go as far this year based on the lack of snow and what seems to be a lack of interest in skiing at this point from the casual skier.

but i'm sure Mr. Danforth will come into this thread and give us a concrete answer to that.....

 

[steamboat1]

last year closing with wall to wall (almost) coverage on ss was sad. It was busy no doubt and the lines on ss were fantastic.

http://forums.alpinezone.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4578&d=1304293156

that being said, it's hard to believe they'll go as far this year based on the lack of snow and what seems to be a lack of interest in skiing at this point from the casual skier.

but i'm sure Mr. Danforth will come into this thread and give us a concrete answer to that.....

Like the pic. It was a beautiful warm sunny day. I think is was the only day I got to ski in a t-shirt last year.

 

[skiersleft]

last year closing with wall to wall (almost) coverage on ss was sad. It was busy no doubt and the lines on ss were fantastic.

http://forums.alpinezone.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4578&d=1304293156

that being said, it's hard to believe they'll go as far this year based on the lack of snow and what seems to be a lack of interest in skiing at this point from the casual skier.

but i'm sure Mr. Danforth will come into this thread and give us a concrete answer to that.....

1. There is no lack of snow over at Superstar. They have as much or more snow there than they had last year. They really hit it hard the last couple of weeks.

2. Casual skiers won't ski Killington in May regardless of how much snow fell in Winter. Casual skiers are done in March. If K is going to see a lot of visits, it's going to be from hardcore skiers, not casual ones (usually season pass holders at other hills that close in April).

 

[2knees]

1. There is no lack of snow over at Superstar. They have as much or more snow there than they had last year. They really hit it hard the last couple of weeks.

2. Casual skiers won't ski Killington in May regardless of how much snow fell in Winter. Casual skiers are done in March. If K is going to see a lot of visits, it's going to be from hardcore skiers, not casual ones (usually season pass holders at other hills that close in April).

cant speak to the first but the second i agree with. problem is, powdr has basically said there is no interest in late skiing in years that havent seen decreased visits in winter. I find it hard to believe they won't take the easy out this year and call it a season earlier based on the reduction in visits they have had ytd. We have had the "who skis in may" discussion here a million times before. long before you were a member. not trying to get into that again at all.

 

[RustyK]

Wow!

 

[Highway Star]

2. Casual skiers won't ski Killington in May regardless of how much snow fell in Winter. Casual skiers are done in March. If K is going to see a lot of visits, it's going to be from hardcore skiers, not casual ones (usually season pass holders at other hills that close in April).

cant speak to the first but the second i agree with. problem is, powdr has basically said there is no interest in late skiing in years that havent seen decreased visits in winter. I find it hard to believe they won't take the easy out this year and call it a season earlier based on the reduction in visits they have had ytd. We have had the "who skis in may" discussion here a million times before. long before you were a member. not trying to get into that again at all.

Without excessively rehashing the last 5 years, POWDR-Killington has said and done many other things and eventually changed their minds after seeing the reality of things.

I spent 3 weekends early season this year riding the glades triple singles line. Very rarely did I ride with a Killington local or passholder. I rode with people from sugarbush, stowe, burlington, albany, NJ, NYC, MA, mt. snow, CT, NH. Everyone was skiing on a day ticket, or a 2-for-1 ticket. There were 20 minute lines, it was mobbed, because Killington was the only game in town.

 

[bigbob]

Closing of coarse will be weather dependant. Somebody here or over at K Zone posted an April 29th closing date. Yes.they have blown a shitload of snow on Skylark and Superstar, the pile at the top was ENORMOUS today. And todays 3"+ "Dump" helps.

 

[mister moose]

Chris,

<snipped for clarity>

Will Killington consider a Superstar/Skyepeak Quad spring operation that keeps Bear mountain (with the parks and OL) as long as possible?
Will Killington stay open later than the first weekend in May?
Will Bear stay open later than the first weekend in April?


Will they try weekend only operations?

Will Killington attract visitors from other areas?

Thanks,

HS.

Attention Dangah:
A few years ago, I believe before your tenure, Killington made the public statement that Killington would stay open to May. They closed that year a week prior than stated with wall to wall coverage on Superstar, after selling spring passes that were advertised as staying open later than that.

There have been other similar inconsistent statements.

Since no one can predict the spring weather, no one expects a firm date for any trail pod closing. Until such time as decisions are made to make the commitment to stay open as late as possible, meaning the same or similar "some walking required" standard we have seen early season, I see no reason to answer the first 3 questions and stick your neck on the block. You (Meaning the guy with the checkbook) either want to take the steps necessary to stay open as long as the snow lasts, or you don't. You either want that reputation of latest and biggest spring skiing, or you don't. This year with a decent pile on Superstar and the new U-bars, I think we should just watch what happens. Of course, watching what happens means no one can make any plans, and there are lots of folks that want to make plans. You know those folks, they plan weeks in advance. So you do lose some momentum that way. Me, I can make plans the night before.

The weekends only question though is a simple yes or no. I'd be interested in that one.

The last question is a crystal ball question. Although I think the safe answer is yes.

 

[dangah]

Chris,

Now that Killington has released the "4-play" spring pass, can you give a hint as to what to expect from spring skiing at Killington this year?



We have seen fairly strong snowmaking efforts on OL, Lower Skyeburst, and Skyelark, and Superstar. Snowmaking has been fairly thin in the canyon and snowdon. Will Killington consider a Superstar/Skyepeak Quad spring operation that keeps Bear mountain (with the parks and OL) as long as possible? Which might need some more snowmaking on upper skyeburst?

Will Killington stay open later than the first weekend in May? Will they try weekend only operations? Will Bear stay open later than the first weekend in April? Will Killington attract visitors from other areas?

There are lots of rumors floating around, it would be helpful to hear something from Killington on this.

Thanks,

HS.

Thanks for your polite question :grin: and sorry for the delayed response. I am only checking in on the forum every week or so. A friend let me know about this particular thread. In the future, please send your Killington related questions to info@killington.com so we can get you a quick response.

As you and several folks have pointed out, we have been working on building our spring base in the Superstar area and things are starting to look pretty good. It is our intention to operate the Superstar area through the end of April, conditions permitting (of course). We do not expect to operate the Bear area any later than we have in the last several years, meaning April 1 this year.

I hope this info helps.

 

[powhunter]

last year closing with wall to wall (almost) coverage on ss was sad. It was busy no doubt and the lines on ss were fantastic.

http://forums.alpinezone.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4578&d=1304293156

that being said, it's hard to believe they'll go as far this year based on the lack of snow and what seems to be a lack of interest in skiing at this point from the casual skier.

but i'm sure Mr. Danforth will come into this thread and give us a concrete answer to that.....

Last year a week AFTER they closed

 

[Highway Star]

Thanks for your polite question :grin: and sorry for the delayed response. I am only checking in on the forum every week or so. A friend let me know about this particular thread. In the future, please send your Killington related questions to info@killington.com so we can get you a quick response.

As you and several folks have pointed out, we have been working on building our spring base in the Superstar area and things are starting to look pretty good. It is our intention to operate the Superstar area through the end of April, conditions permitting (of course). We do not expect to operate the Bear area any later than we have in the last several years, meaning April 1 this year.

I hope this info helps.

Thanks, guess I'll have to take it up with Nyberg next time I see him.