AZ Challenge 2011 Results: Killington

[Nick]

Thanks to Chris Nyberg and Sarah Thorson for providing answers to our questions!

http://skiing.alpinezone.com/articles/challenge/2011/response.htm?resort=killington

 

[thetrailboss]

Well, there is confirmation that Snowdon Quad will become a HSQ and that the two areas will eventually be connected.

 

[SkiDork]

so I guess May skiing (beyond a few days) is dead.

I liked the interconnect attitude.

 

[millerm277]

All reasonable answers. Good to hear they are planning to replace the SRT/Snowdon and that the Interconnect isn't dead.

I think he is somewhat mistaken about the May skiing, in that Killington misses a key detail about why it was more viable in the past.....there were events. They held various competitions and other things to give people a reason to come up. He's absolutely right in that "May skiing" alone, doesn't draw enough people.

 

[Newpylong]

Positive responses that hopefully can put rumors to bed. The Snowdon Quad will be replaced by a HSQ, probably in two years. The old Quad will go to South Ridge, probably in 3 years. the interconnect will happen once all this stuff is done.

 

[thetrailboss]

I think he is somewhat mistaken about the May skiing, in that Killington misses a key detail about why it was more viable in the past.....there were events. They held various competitions and other things to give people a reason to come up. He's absolutely right in that "May skiing" alone, doesn't draw enough people.

+ 1. They are using a different business model than SKI was I guess.

 

[Highway Star]

Interesting positivity on the interconnect. "Not within the first five years".......well, this is actually the start of POWDR's 5th year of operations at Killingon. It will be five years this spring.

 

[oakapple]

Interesting positivity on the interconnect. "Not within the first five years".......well, this is actually the start of POWDR's 5th year of operations at Killingon. It will be five years this spring.

Of course, that doesn't mean "Year 6" either; it just means "not within five". It sounds like the completion of the Peak Lodge, the replacement of the Snowdon Quad, and the replacement of the South Ridge Triple, are all a higher priority than the Interconnect.

On the other hand, he did say quite emphatically that he expects it to happen.

 

[mediamogul]

Of course, that doesn't mean "Year 6" either; it just means "not within five". It sounds like the completion of the Peak Lodge, the replacement of the Snowdon Quad, and the replacement of the South Ridge Triple, are all a higher priority than the Interconnect.

On the other hand, he did say quite emphatically that he expects it to happen.

I would be interested to see the details of the plan for the interconnect. He did say "plan" didn't he.

They also better have a plan for a layout of snowdon that promotes better skier flow. Otherwise adding twice as many people to that trail pod is going to be utter chaos.

Also, there is no way a quad will fit on the return line of the jug where it becomes black. I would expect that they will widen at least that portion of the trail.

 

[oakapple]

I would be interested to see the details of the plan for the interconnect. He did say "plan" didn't he.

The permitting application is a matter of public record. They probably won't talk about exactly how they are going to go about it, until they are ready to start construction. I don't blame them. Killington partisans tend to roast the management, if anything they say turns out to be even slightly incorrect. Partly because of that, they tend not to go into details any earlier than they have to.

 

[millerm277]

They also better have a plan for a layout of snowdon that promotes better skier flow. Otherwise adding twice as many people to that trail pod is going to be utter chaos.

They are slowly improving it, such as with the well-done adjustment to Great Northern up in the Glades/North Ridge this year and the previous widening of Lower Bunny Buster, but realistically, you are never going to be able to "solve" the traffic issues in the center of Snowdon unless you're willing to either destroy the Snowdon woods to reroute GN entirely, or unless you turn it into a mess of speed/traffic control fence everywhere.

If it is a HSQ and not a 6-pack, the new lift is not going to make a huge difference in uphill capacity, so busy days are not going to get that much worse. What will change instead is that you will have more "busy days" on Snowdon, because people will want to take the lift more, and all that sort of thing.

That said, there are other things they can do to try to shift traffic more. Frolic badly needs to be redesigned, for instance. It's got a couple of "steep" turns too difficult for beginners at the top, and then it's flat/uphill. Make it less terrible and widen Caper below the Northstar intersection, and you'll make that area more friendly to beginners instead of just being connector trails that most people don't like.

 

[SkiDork]

He's absolutely right in that "May skiing" alone, doesn't draw enough people.

I never understood statements like this when they have half to 1/3 of the cars in the parking lot on a typical day for mountain biking and never say boo about that not drawing enough people/staying open.

 

[MadPadraic]

Just to invite flames....better to open another mountain than widen the trails.

 

[roark]

The permitting application is a matter of public record. They probably won't talk about exactly how they are going to go about it, until they are ready to start construction. I don't blame them. Killington partisans tend to roast the management, if anything they say turns out to be even slightly incorrect. Partly because of that, they tend not to go into details any earlier than they have to.

so why not invite input from your clientele ala jay peak a couple years ago?

 

[skiersleft]

I never understood statements like this when they have half to 1/3 of the cars in the parking lot on a typical day for mountain biking and never say boo about that not drawing enough people/staying open.

Aren't they required by law to open during the summer regardless of how busy it is?

 

[Hawkshot99]

I never understood statements like this when they have half to 1/3 of the cars in the parking lot on a typical day for mountain biking and never say boo about that not drawing enough people/staying open.

It is a whole lot cheaper to operate for Mtn. iking than it is in ski season.

 

[SkiDork]

It is a whole lot cheaper to operate for Mtn. iking than it is in ski season.

how so? (bearing in mind the snow is already on the mountain in the spring, and you don't need to groom either)

 

[Nick]

I've wondered the same. I always kinda figured running / maintaining the lifts and salaries for those people would be the biggest operating expenses. And snowmaking but no one is making snow in May.

 

[tt431]

I never understood statements like this when they have half to 1/3 of the cars in the parking lot on a typical day for mountain biking and never say boo about that not drawing enough people/staying open.

Yeah, lots of cars in the parking lot but they also see tailgate BBQs but not a lot bar, food or day tickets sales. Policies are not written in stone so maybe the U bars can potentially create more spring business and make opening later into May profitable.

 

[SkiDork]

Yeah, lots of cars in the parking lot but they also see tailgate BBQs but not a lot bar, food or day tickets sales. Policies are not written in stone so maybe the U bars can potentially create more spring business and make opening later into May profitable.

mountain bikers no doubt have season passes as well...