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Shawnee Peak Maine acquired by Boyne

graysquirrel73

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Tin Woodsman

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Weight, weight, and nothing but weight.

Jordan will also grow in acreage long term.

Right - all that is likely true. But to me that doesn't justify the sequencing here. It's certainly building in anticipation of a lot of extra capacity in the future, but that could be 5-10 years away easy. And is the weight of an 8 truly a difference maker vs. a 6? When I consider the existing needs closer into the core of the resort, I don't understand the decision making.
 

thetrailboss

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Right - all that is likely true. But to me that doesn't justify the sequencing here. It's certainly building in anticipation of a lot of extra capacity in the future, but that could be 5-10 years away easy. And is the weight of an 8 truly a difference maker vs. a 6? When I consider the existing needs closer into the core of the resort, I don't understand the decision making.
I’ve seen it reported in a couple places that someone from Boyne Central visited and made the suggestion. When he saw that Jordan was on wind hold he asked why it wasn’t an 8-person.

Honestly I’d rather have seen Barker replaced first. I get that they “think” they are expanding but who knows if that will happen.

I also think that the ‘loaf could have used some new lifts before they replaced Jordan. SuperQuad is almost 30 years old.
 

machski

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I’ve seen it reported in a couple places that someone from Boyne Central visited and made the suggestion. When he saw that Jordan was on wind hold he asked why it wasn’t an 8-person.

Honestly I’d rather have seen Barker replaced first. I get that they “think” they are expanding but who knows if that will happen.

I also think that the ‘loaf could have used some new lifts before they replaced Jordan. SuperQuad is almost 30 years old.
Yes, one of the Boyne high ups saw one of the weekends when Jordan was down for the whole time due to winds. They told DB to fix it now. Also plays to lack of draw of the Jordan Grand (quarter share resales are dirt cheap and the old Grand Summit has more demand than Jordan. Some of this a good lift won't fix with how far out Jordan sits). So yes, that pushed Jordan ahead of Barker (second Jordan 8 video DB admitted as much). And yes, the 8 was determined to be the best option for wind resistance.
 

Smellytele

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While people say barkercan’t handle more traffic on the trails it is more about getting skiers out of that base area and across the mountain. While south ridge can get the beginners out with the chondola. Traffic gets bogged down at barker with people coming over from white cap from one direction and from north peak from the other. The mountain is a transversing hell between pods. White cap has fucking 2 trails. Just need to get the fuck out of there. Most pods have no more than 4 ways down. Barker and oz (although oz is fucked with out natural snow) are the only ones that have more.
 

deadheadskier

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Do people really think terrain beyond Jordan gets developed? I don't see the need nor do I think it would draw enough additional crowds to support it with much profit. Seems to me after Barker they should spend the next decade working on the other three areas in the East. Then maybe look at expansion. Sunday River is pretty massive as is. Tough to staff as well I'm sure
 

Newpylong

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I can tell you the water line they buried under Kansas this year to feed Oz/Jordan next season is sized to send twice as much water as is currently required...FWIW.
 

machski

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While people say barkercan’t handle more traffic on the trails it is more about getting skiers out of that base area and across the mountain. While south ridge can get the beginners out with the chondola. Traffic gets bogged down at barker with people coming over from white cap from one direction and from north peak from the other. The mountain is a transversing hell between pods. White cap has fucking 2 trails. Just need to get the fuck out of there. Most pods have no more than 4 ways down. Barker and oz (although oz is fucked with out natural snow) are the only ones that have more.
I'm betting ng Barker is upgraded to a D-Line 6 bubble. Given Jordan 9 is only a 20% capacity boost over the Quad it is replacing, the 6 shouldn't be more than 35% or so at Barker. I say that because the current Barker spins slower than the racing T-Bar so just the speed gain will increase the uphill movement. That said, with 4 primary routes down and 2 secondary (I would expect Top Gun to get better snowmaking equipment and Agony to actually get snowmaking again given the relative ease of taking chairs off the line overnight on D machines, giving them 6 solid routes down) Barker has plenty of trail capacity for a 6.

As to the comment on Oz, the glades and Ruby will not change and still need natural, but I expect both Eureka and Princess to see snowmaking, in Eureka's case first time in almost a decade and LP, picking up again after last year's pause. Both will be needed with the 8 at Jordan IMHO and they will have the water capacity to do both now with the booster at the top of NP.
 

deadheadskier

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I don't think it's a bad idea to prepare for the future. I just question how much more they can grow their skier visits to support the growth.

Where as I think improvements at Pleasant and Sugarloaf might grow their market share because what's being discussed address product deficiencies that many wish to see modernized.

We will see. Happy to see all the Maine improvements all over. Not just Boyne and SB, but Black and Big Rock too. Who knows, maybe the Big Squaw project happens someday.
 

Newpylong

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I'm betting ng Barker is upgraded to a D-Line 6 bubble. Given Jordan 9 is only a 20% capacity boost over the Quad it is replacing, the 6 shouldn't be more than 35% or so at Barker. I say that because the current Barker spins slower than the racing T-Bar so just the speed gain will increase the uphill movement. That said, with 4 primary routes down and 2 secondary (I would expect Top Gun to get better snowmaking equipment and Agony to actually get snowmaking again given the relative ease of taking chairs off the line overnight on D machines, giving them 6 solid routes down) Barker has plenty of trail capacity for a 6.

As to the comment on Oz, the glades and Ruby will not change and still need natural, but I expect both Eureka and Princess to see snowmaking, in Eureka's case first time in almost a decade and LP, picking up again after last year's pause. Both will be needed with the 8 at Jordan IMHO and they will have the water capacity to do both now with the booster at the top of NP.

Those Oz trails might need to wait another year unless the winter is kind. Jordan and Oz are still fed down Quantum, up and over Aurora base for one more year. They buried the pipe while doing the Kansas rework this year but never planned on cutting it in. There are only two pumps in the new booster station which will serve Spruce (big new feed on Downdraft). Next year they'll add the next set of 4 pumps and cut that new feed in to points West. They'll have to reconfigure everything as it all feeds from the bottom now.

Trail 1 on Merril has snowmaking completed as well.
 

machski

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Do people really think terrain beyond Jordan gets developed? I don't see the need nor do I think it would draw enough additional crowds to support it with much profit. Seems to me after Barker they should spend the next decade working on the other three areas in the East. Then maybe look at expansion. Sunday River is pretty massive as is. Tough to staff as well I'm sure
Yes, but I think this is years off (5-10 IMHO). I also do not know to what extent it will be developed. I would go easy if it follows on from anything I saw from Les' vision with the village by where the Jordan hotel is now, at least one additional lift will drop down from the top of Lola Ridge if you will, down and just above the golf course. How many actual "trails" vs gladed areas are developed is anyone's guess. I would venture if a new lift does go in beyond Jordan, that would include at least 3 snowmaking trails but I'm just guessing here. I believe before they get anywhere near the Western Reserve, we will see additional upgrades on the current pods,perhaps a few new trails here and there as well and the 2nd phase of Merrill Hill with the backside lift installed.

Regardless of SR's continued evolution, the other 2 East resorts stand on their own. Loon has two new(ish) lifts already, another already ordered for all new terrain next season and I'm certain the upgrades their are not stopping (Loon is their ROI leader on NE after all). Sugarloaf will see continued improvement, the Kircher and the family love SL, even if it doesn't produce the ROI they might wish it did. Which is why West Lift probably went to a refurbed Swift Current HSQ but if you have seen Loon's Seven Bros HSQ, you would be hard pressed to know that is the former KancQuad.
 

machski

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Those Oz trails might need to wait another year unless the winter is kind. Jordan and Oz are still fed down Quantum, up and over Aurora base for one more year. They buried the pipe while doing the Kansas rework this year but never planned on cutting it in. There are only two pumps in the new booster station which will serve Spruce (big new feed on Downdraft). Next year they'll add the next set of 4 pumps and cut that new feed in to points West. They'll have to reconfigure everything as it all feeds from the bottom now.

Trail 1 on Merril has snowmaking completed as well.
Yeah, that whole connection never made a ton of sense to me. Why cross the system down low like they did under the Jordan Double?? Not sure what Les and crew saw with that setup, maybe lack of on hill boosters at the time made crossing lower seem more logical then. Perhaps they also planned a second river feed way back then too. I know the full push of water west isn't ready this year, but I do expect both runs in Oz to get some snow. It had been a pain point for DB to not get to Eureka for as long as they haven't. One for me too, that is one of the best spring runs in late March when it has seen machine made during the season. Can be great too with natural alone, but that goes fast!
 

SteezyYeeter

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Does anybody know what time they open in the morning this year? Last year was 10, the year before that was 11. The late opening makes it hard to get some turns in before work. Hoping for boyne to make it 9
11 o clock?! jeez. all resorts should be open by 8, upper mountain lifts by 9 at the latest.
 
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