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COVID concerns in the Northeast

Andrew B.

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Feb 2, 2013
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Depends on the chair. You can have 2 unrelated singles on a quad.
Regardless of the chair
If I am on a chair there is no reason to believe the person with me is uncomfortable of my mask status unless they are screaming from the chair
If they were that uptight they wouldn’t have loaded with me, a stranger
Use some common sense,
I know, it’s not common.
 

VTKilarney

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Regardless of the chair
If I am on a chair there is no reason to believe the person with me is uncomfortable of my mask status unless they are screaming from the chair
If they were that uptight they wouldn’t have loaded with me, a stranger
Use some common sense,
I know, it’s not common.

So they have to tell you that they are uncomfortable? How about you just follow the rules and don’t put other people in that position.

You may not like the rules, but they are what they are.
 

Andrew B.

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I do agee w/ you, BUT I believe their SOP is Masks are requied on lifts and in lines
So they have to tell you that they are uncomfortable? How about you just follow the rules and don’t put other people in that position.

You may not like the rules, but they are what they are.
I only ride with pod members
Based on the number of half full chairs while lines are long indicates most people are too
 

cdskier

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I only ride with pod members
Based on the number of half full chairs while lines are long indicates most people are too
A half full chair still doesn't mean the people are together. I've ridden a number of quad chairs this year with a complete stranger. Two of us on opposite sides of a chair means that chair is half loaded. So simply looking at the number of people on a chair tells you nothing about whether most people are riding chairs with only people they know.
 

Andrew B.

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A half full chair still doesn't mean the people are together. I've ridden a number of quad chairs this year with a complete stranger. Two of us on opposite sides of a chair means that chair is half loaded. So simply looking at the number of people on a chair tells you nothing about whether most people are riding chairs with only people they know.
Not if you weren’t comfortable you wouldn’t have to
If I am asked I decline no matter who asks. Have had patrollers asked and have declined.
Sorry, I don’t know you means I don’t ride with you this year.
PS I give patrollers the right of next chair.
 

cdskier

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Not if you weren’t comfortable you wouldn’t have to
If I am asked I decline no matter who asks. Have had patrollers asked and have declined.
Sorry, I don’t know you means I don’t ride with you this year.
PS I give patrollers the right of next chair.

Yes, but that wasn't my point at all. Just because you say no doesn't mean others do. Therefore you have no idea whether people are "together" or not just because they're on the same chair. Hence a lifty or patroller simply looking at a chair can't assume people know each other and rightly should tell people to put their mask on if they see it off if the rules at that resort state masks must be worn on lifts.

FWIW, I did say no this weekend once. A group of 2 wanted to get on a quad chair with me. I'm ok with another single getting on since there would be 2 empty seats between us, but only 1 empty seat was too close for my comfort.

Your take on this is a bit odd and contradictory. On the one hand you're using the rule that allows you to not ride with others if you don't want to (which I'm perfectly fine with you doing). Yet on the other hand you're saying the rule about wearing a mask on a lift shouldn't be enforced as employees should simply assume everyone on a chair knows each other. Shouldn't we advocate enforcing/following all rules and not just the ones you personally like/feel comfortable with?

I also don't agree with your assertion that someone uncomfortable with someone else on a chair taking off their mask would say something. When I get on a chair with someone else, I assume they're going to follow the rules and be respectful of others. However I'm not going to be confrontational if someone did take it off when I'm in a confined space on a chair with that person with nowhere to go.
 

Andrew B.

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Yes, but that wasn't my point at all. Just because you say no doesn't mean others do. Therefore you have no idea whether people are "together" or not just because they're on the same chair. Hence a lifty or patroller simply looking at a chair can't assume people know each other and rightly should tell people to put their mask on if they see it off if the rules at that resort state masks must be worn on lifts.

FWIW, I did say no this weekend once. A group of 2 wanted to get on a quad chair with me. I'm ok with another single getting on since there would be 2 empty seats between us, but only 1 empty seat was too close for my comfort.

Your take on this is a bit odd and contradictory. On the one hand you're using the rule that allows you to not ride with others if you don't want to (which I'm perfectly fine with you doing). Yet on the other hand you're saying the rule about wearing a mask on a lift shouldn't be enforced as employees should simply assume everyone on a chair knows each other. Shouldn't we advocate enforcing/following all rules and not just the ones you personally like/feel comfortable with?

I also don't agree with your assertion that someone uncomfortable with someone else on a chair taking off their mask would say something. When I get on a chair with someone else, I assume they're going to follow the rules and be respectful of others. However I'm not going to be confrontational if someone did take it off when I'm in a confined space on a chair with that person with nowhere to go.
I think riding a chair alone verse riding a 4 with an unknown regardless of their mask status is safer. A six pack maybe but doubtful.
Why would you put yourself in the position of getting on a chair with an unknown and taking the chance they won’t behave as you want them too?
 

drjeff

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I think riding a chair alone verse riding a 4 with an unknown regardless of their mask status is safer. A six pack maybe but doubtful.
Why would you put yourself in the position of getting on a chair with an unknown and taking the chance they won’t behave as you want them too?

Serious question for you. How many cases of spread, while riding a chairlift, or even standing in a lift line for that matter, have been documented?

I am unaware of any.

The key seems to be outdoors, some distance between people (regardless of if they are or aren't from the same party of people), and airflow.

Ski resort related outbreaks sure seem to be from the after skiing bar/party gatherings as opposed to the actual act of skiing/riding.

Case in point, the state of VT did on site rapid testing for those who wished to be tested at both Stratton and Bromley 2 Saturdays ago. Apparently there were 3 positives out of all the tests they did. You don't hear about the state of VT looking to quarantine the general public who may of been in the area where the testing was done.

There is plenty about this disease process that brings one's own personal comfort level with risk into the equation of how they go about their lives. There have also been so much information put out there by so many sources that frankly has been either false, or presented in an "absolutely worst cases scenario possible" way, something which is likely as probable as say being struck by lightening, for it to happen. 2 unrelated parties on a quad, or heck, even a triple, mask up or mask down, for the time it takes a typical lift to travel from its base terminal to its top terminal is probably of lower transmission risk than going to the grocery store. We have to keep the big picture perspective in mind, or else we will never get past this and get back to something close to "normal" again. The simple truth is that 20 years from now, there will still be people passing away from the COVID-19 virus, just like there are still today people passing away from the H1N1 virus, it will just be in very low numbers. That is just the realities of viruses, once they're here, they don't go away, and eventually we are able to control them enough so that the fatalities they cause are very minimal
 
Last edited:

Domeskier

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At this point in the pandemic, I generally assume some idiot who refuses to wear a mask already has antibodies from previous exposure and is probably safe. Nevertheless, I still refuse to ride the lift with strangers and ski only at night when the lifts are basically ski on.
 

Andrew B.

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Feb 2, 2013
Messages
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Serious for you. How many cases of spread, while riding a chairlift, or even standing in a lift line for that matter, have been documented?

I am unaware of any.

The key seems to be outdoors, some distance between people (regardless of if they are or aren't from the same party of people), and airflow.

Ski resort related outbreaks sure seem to be from the after skiing bar/party gatherings as opposed to the actual act of skiing/riding.

Case in point, the state of VT did on site rapid testing for those who wished to be tested at both Stratton and Bromley 2 Saturdays ago. Apparently there were 3 positives out of all the tests they did. You don't hear about the state of VT looking to quarantine the general public who may of been in the area where the testing was done.

There is plenty about this disease process that brings one's own personal comfort level with risk into the equation of how they go about their lives. There have also been so much information put out there by so many sources that frankly has been either false, or presented in an "absolutely worst cases scenario possible" way, something which is likely as probable as say being struck by lightening, for it to happen. 2 unrelated parties on a quad, or heck, even a triple, mask up or mask down, for the time it takes a typical lift to travel from its base terminal to its top terminal is probably of lower transmission risk than going to the grocery store. We have to keep the big picture perspective in mind, or else we will never get past this and get back to something close to "normal" again. The simple truth is that 20 years from now, there will still be people passing away from the COVID-19 virus, just like there are still today people passing away from the H1N1 virus, it will just be in very low numbers. That is just the realities of viruses, once they're here, they don't go away, and eventually we are able to control them enough so that the fatalities they cause are very minimal
We are on the same page
Like you I assume 0 cases have been transmitted outdoors on ski hills.

I like to take my mask down when riding the lift
Me riding alone has more to do with me not wanting to upset someone than it does worrying about my safety. The other point is you have to be comfortable so take control.
If you don’t want to take the chance of being in a chair with someone who would rather ride maskless assume that the other party feels this way and not vice versa.
If you don’t want to wear a mask on the lift assume the other unknown party will get upset and ride single.
We can choose this year and no one should get upset with you no matter your choice (on the lift.) Next year a assume I will be bitching loudly if I see empty chairs going up and I am in a long line.

This country is in for a rude awakening when we figure out how badly we have handled this.
My take is 2-3 years down the road it will be clear.
 

Andrew B.

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Feb 2, 2013
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At this point in the pandemic, I generally assume some idiot who refuses to wear a mask already has antibodies from previous exposure and is probably safe. Nevertheless, I still refuse to ride the lift with strangers and ski only at night when the lifts are basically ski on.
I assume nothing this year and act like any unknown is an idiot.
Works for me but I am very jaded
 

KustyTheKlown

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I wonder how it is spreading in VT?

these guys lost their franchise because of ups' decision, not the state of Vermont. this has been a hot topic in the Vermont subreddit. the state didn't really do anything to them at all for months, then a few reddit threads took off, then ups revoked their franchise, and then the state took some action. but fundamentally, this is about a franchisee not following the rules set by the franchisor, and they deserved to lose their franchise. ups does not need to let them tarnish their brand. way to ruin your franchise business to own the libs!
 

kbroderick

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Dec 1, 2005
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Serious question for you. How many cases of spread, while riding a chairlift, or even standing in a lift line for that matter, have been documented?

I am unaware of any.

The key seems to be outdoors, some distance between people (regardless of if they are or aren't from the same party of people), and airflow.
Even in places with good contact-tracing programs (emphatically not the US), what's the success rate on identifying the source of infections? I've read less than 50%, (but that wasn't well-sourced, so I'd be happy to learn otherwise if that's the case).

Assuming even 20% of cases come from unidentified spread, let alone 50%, wouldn't it stand to reason that some of that percentage comes from activities that are lower-risk but not zero-risk and have probably been producing some cases, albeit at a low-enough rate that it makes tracking the exact source difficult or impossible?
 
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