Do bumps make the man?

[highpeaksdrifter]

I was riding in the gondi at Whiteface about a month ago with 2 guys who had never been there before. They asked me what trails I would recommend they try. I asked them how well they skied and they responded that they where experts.One trail I told them to try was Empire, a steep, narrow bump run. They told me that they like steep, narrow trails, but that they don’t ski bumps.

When someone tells me they don’t ski bumps I take it to mean that they can’t ski bumps well. I think a lot of skiers who are experts often measure the abilities of others by how well they ski moguls. If a person can’t, doesn’t or won’t ski bumps can that person still be considered an expert skier if he/she does every other aspect of skiing very well. I say no, what do you think?

 

[andyzee]

I'm not bump skier, no problem with the steepest of steep, I have to agree with you.

 

[trailertrash]

and on the flip side, is a snowboarder an expert rider if they cant hit the pipe with some degree of grace? good post.

 

[tekweezle]

i'm a terrible mogul skier so I don;t consider myself an expert. i;d say I;m more of an "advanced intermediate". I still got things to learn.

 

[JimG.]

Expert skier: Skier who can ski any terrain in any conditions in any weather with style and control.

If you don't ski bumps by choice but can if put to the task, you are an expert.

If you CAN'T ski bumps, you are not an expert.

There's a difference. I know alot of experts who used to ski bumps alot but don't care for it anymore. But they are great bump skiers and can rip the zipper if challenged.

 

[Greg]

If you want to consider yourself an "expert", I would think being able to ski moguls well is part of the equation. Otherwise, I guess it's fair to call yourself "advanced". Some folks opt out of skiing bumps as they claim it hurts their knees. If skied correctly, bumping doesn't necessarily have to hurt your knees. I would bet that most people that say they don't ski bumps is because they can't, not because they simply don't like to. I've never met anyone that can rip moguls, pass on them because they'd rather ski a groomer. I suppose age does play some factor, but again, I feel good technique in the bumps or at least altering your technique a bit as you get older can allow you to ski them at an "advanced" age. HPD is a good example of this (sorry, buddy - couldn't resist ).

Want to know where the best skiers are on the mountain? Check the mogul fields. Some of the most graceful looking guys on the steep groomers can flail around like a beginner when put on even the lowest angle bump runs. However, that guy who rips the bumps can probably ski that steep groomer with the same grace and confidence as our "expert" friend. To be a true all-mountain expert, you must master the bumps as well.

For me, moguls provide a high degree of mental and physical challenge. There's always more to learn and I improve every season. I'm often told that I underestimate my bump skill. That's probably due in part of the mental challenge and sometimes I don't feel like I skied a run well, even though I kept my line and made it through the run relatively unscathed. Skiing bumps correctly is probably as unintuitive as it can get. But once it clicks, you can simply feel that you're nailing it and it's the best feeling there is when skiing...at least for me. I was always intrigued by moguls and really started to get a handle on the technique the past two seasons. I figured out I did 70+ bump runs at my local hill this season. The repitition certainly has helped, evidenced by how well I felt I skied at Sugarbush this past weekend. None of the runs intimidated me and I was able to comfortably hold my lines more often than not.

I consider myself "advanced". I still struggle with big moguls on steep runs, but the fear of them is pretty much gone. I have no problem jumping right in and can usually pick up a string of a half dozen bumps or so before I get thrown off or back. I still have a ton to learn and the feeling of perfect absorption and extention and rotary turns is something I literally crave (crack, anyone?). I don't nail it every run, but I'm getting it more and more. I suppose the next step in becoming a true all-mountain expert for me is to learn to ski trees. I've dabbled, but for now the mogul field is plenty of challenge for me. Once I'm happy with my skill in the bumps, I'll likely get into tree skiing more. A good bump technique is probably a good weapon to have in the woods...

 

[JimG.]

For me, moguls provide a high degree of mental and physical challenge. There's always more to learn and I improve every season. I'm often told that I underestimate my bump skill. That's probably due in part of the mental challenge and sometimes I don't feel like I skied a run well, even though I kept my line and made it through the run relatively unscathed.

True bumpers are never happy with their technique and always feel they could ski better. Hardest to please group you'll ever encounter on the hill. Always trying to improve or tweak something.

 

[bvibert]

Expert skier: Skier who can ski any terrain in any conditions in any weather with style and control.

If you don't ski bumps by choice but can if put to the task, you are an expert.

If you CAN'T ski bumps, you are not an expert.

That would be my definition as well.

 

[Greg]

True bumpers are never happy with their technique and always feel they could ski better. Hardest to please group you'll ever encounter on the hill. Always trying to improve or tweak something.

So are you saying I'm a "true bumper"? Skiing with you Jim has definitely helped. Last season it was about keeping the hands up and forward. This year's tips included working on raising the hips and reducing the hesitation (which = fluidity). See, I listen...

BTW, this is a good place to mention this must-have for anyone looking to improve in the bumps:

http://forums.alpinezone.com/5633-everything-instructors-never-told-you-about-mogul-skiing.html

 

[WICKEDBUMPER]

I suppose age does play some factor, but again, I feel good technique in the bumps or at least altering your technique a bit as you get older can allow you to ski them at an "advanced" age.

I spent last week out west and there was a pack of 60+ year old guys ripping lines better then pretty much everyone else on the trail. they did about 4 laps and then left. they didnt bomb the whole run like teenagers but they sure had style. I can only hope to be in as good shape when I hit their age.

 

[NYDrew]

Have you ever been to a resort at 4pm on a soft snow/spring day and noticed that the mountain is nothing but bumps due to crowds skiing on it? Bump skiing is an essential part of the sport. I don't mean zipper lines up to a kicker to pull Moselys dinner roll, I mean navagating down without complaining, without constant traversing, stopping or excessive effort.

An expert skiier is someone who doesn't look at trail maps because it just won't matter. They can ski anywhere, any time in any conditions without any problems. Any and all race courses included, an expert should be able to complete it gracefully and at a respectable time (defineing time as the average NE Nastar course in under 30 seconds) on recreational gear.

Experts can ski backwards, fowards or sideslip in both directions, with or without twin tips. Which brings me to the half pipe, the same expert should at least be able to go up and down the wall switch or fowards. Jumps are in the realm of a park skiier/rider. An expert may not need to know how to do tricks, but should be able to learn them quickly if they put their mind to it.

In essence, an expert skiier has evolved to the point that their skiis are just an extension of their body. All aspects of skiing should feel natural at all points in the season, even first run.

This doesn't mean that they can't refuse to ski moguls. Everyone has preferences on terrain, but the expert is not afraid, or annoyed to stray away from their specialties if need be and make it look good.

Conclusively, if you can't ski bumps, or any other form of terrain in all conditions, then you are only advanced. This includes bullet proof ice.

 

[skibum1321]

I would tend to agree with much of what has been said above. If you can't ski bumps and trees with fluidity, I wouldn't consider you an expert. All experts have something to improve and can be helped by constructive criticism. I tend to be similar to you, Greg, in that I never think I ski the bumps as well as others think I do.

 

[WICKEDBUMPER]

True bumpers are never happy with their technique and always feel they could ski better. Hardest to please group you'll ever encounter on the hill. Always trying to improve or tweak something.

soooooooooooo true. when you ski with a group of 3 or 4 real good bumpers, every run is a clinic.

 

[JimG.]

So are you saying I'm a "true bumper"? Skiing with you Jim has definitely helped. Last season it was about keeping the hands up and forward. This year's tips included working on raising the hips and reducing the hesitation (which = fluidity). See, I listen...

BTW, this is a good place to mention this must-have for anyone looking to improve in the bumps:

http://forums.alpinezone.com/5633-everything-instructors-never-told-you-about-mogul-skiing.html

Just got a message from Dan today; the book is doing very well. Thanks to all here who decided to read it and learn from it.

Thanks for the compliment Greg, it's important to know that I'm still effective at passing my knowledge onto others. I must still be doing OK if folks can watch my skiing and improve theirs.

 

[dmc]

and on the flip side, is a snowboarder an expert rider if they cant hit the pipe with some degree of grace? good post.

I hate the park - parks are for kids I always say... Besides wen I learned to ride there were NO parks...

 

[trailertrash]

thats the point

I hate the park - parks are for kids I always say... Besides wen I learned to ride there were NO parks...

thats the point, you may hate the park, i dont enjoy bumps (on skis or board). i think to be considered an "expert" you would need to master the park and pipe on a board. in otherwords, be able to do it even if you dont enjoy it. by master i mean get down with some grace, not be a rockstar at it.

 

[highpeaksdrifter]

Oh Yeah

I feel good technique in the bumps or at least altering your technique a bit as you get older can allow you to ski them at an "advanced" age. HPD is a good example of this (sorry, buddy - couldn't resist ).

Just so you know wise guy, I was in a bump contest this past weekend at Whiteface. I was in the masters division with 20 entrants. I came in 2nd overall (I'm 52), 3rd place was age 53 and 5th was age 50.

So the soon to be Viagra generation did pretty well against guys in there 30's and 40's.

I don't kid myself about aging and losing quickness, stamina, etc., but some of us old fellers still have game left. ).

My son age 31 won - I'm a proud Dad.

 

[Greg]

Just so you know wise guy, I was in a bump contest this past weekend at Whiteface. I was in the masters division with 20 entrants. I came in 2nd overall (I'm 52), 3rd place was age 53 and 5th was age 50.

So the soon to be Viagra generation did pretty well against guys in there 30's and 40's.

I don't kid myself about aging and losing quickness, stamina, etc., but some of us old fellers still have game left. ).

My son age 31 won - I'm a proud Dad.

Awesome! Even though there were no bumps at Jiminy in Nov., I could tell both you guys could rip.

 

[tekweezle]

people ask me all the time if I am an expert. must be all the gear I lug t the slopes. i just tell them that I;m okay. i do the bumps when they are there. I like the west coast variety better though-large moguls, soft snow, not too steep angles.

i get nervous when confronted with steep, icy, hard, scraped off moguls though. i end up doing more traversing and panicking 3 bumps at a time....but that;s the thing I like about skiing. There is still so much to learn.

A few year ago, as a self taught skier I actually thought I knew all there was to skiing. anything harder than a steep groomed black i would deem as not fun and just not do it. Then I took some lessons and realized afterwards that I knew nothing! now I go everywhere...well maybe not the trails with the exposed rocks.

 

[meat]

definatly need to ski bumps well, in all conditions, its probably one of the best things you can do to make you an all around great skier. being able to take air in the park, being able to carve high speed turns on a groomer, and being able to ski deep powder well should be some indicaters of being an all around expert too. obviously deep powder takes the cake in enjoyablity factor. this day and age the biggest challenges for me are to ski steep, tight, gnarly lines in the trees and being able to ski them with good speed and flow.