Hermitage club

[Highway Star]

How much annual snowmaking budget, lift ops, ongoing fees to cover these?
saying 100 people are already on board without knowing how many are needed minimally to make it work doesn't erase the skepticism

Annual dues are about $5k per family, but the up front membership fees are pretty steep:

http://hermitageclub.com/membership/membership-levels/

Looks like they also offer a Private Residence Membership, which is basicly an expensive timeshare.

Not sure how they are going to be taking in enough yearly to operate a ski area of this scale.

 

[jack97]

If you have that much cash I would just fly to SLC all the time.

If it was me..... I would do that in a heartbeat.

but I was just making a point about what would be the hypothetical selling point about Haystack. Last season was the first time I didn't take my daughter to BW. IIRC, that place is dead after 2:30, crowds don't like the skied off stuff. Makes sense if most don't go skiing that much.

 

[jaytrem]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that it doesn't sound like they're trying to keep the place super exclusive. They already have to sell some tickets to Wilmington residents, due to the town owning the upper half of the mountain. I also remember reading something about them setting up ski and stay packages with some of the other hotels in the area. Not sure exactly what they're allowed to do at this point thanks to the non-compete clause fro when Mount Snow sold the place. But that expires pretty soon anyway. I figure at some point they might want to go the way o some of the other clubs out there and open the weekdays to everybody and maybe keep the weekends just for the members/residents.

Also, for the non-addicted skier the place is probably just fine, especially once they have a high speed lift. Back in the day my parents would go with the Haystack only pass. They preferred the lack of crowds and the terrain was plenty for them. I'm sure they're are plenty of other similar folks out there.

As for the price, yeah, the initiation fee is kinda steep these days, it was a much better deal a year or two ago. But the annual fees don't seem too crazy as long as you take advantage of the golf part. And they give you enough lift tickets to take care of your family and some friends for a good chunk of the season.

 

[billski]

Probably because it's not about the skiing, not really anyway. It's about the Experience, I'm guessing, the exclusivity / etc.

It's like a private golf club. I always thought, why would I want to just play the same course over and over and over and over again?

Spot on. You're paying not for the skiing, but to keep the riff-raff out.

Membership: $40K/individual, $45K/family
annual dues: $2500-$5000 annual dues

Property owners:
Residence: 650K+,
plus annual dues of 25-75K
Membership: $40K/individual, $45K/family

Lots of chatter about improving private jet access.


http://www.7dvt.com/2013haystack-mountain-resurrected-private-ski-area

 

[snoseek]

You pay a pretty good fee to join and maintain a membership at a private golf club but generally with that comes a really nice course with somewhat lower volume. Here you get the lower volume but on (IMO) a subpar mountain. Interesting to see how it all works out but in the end its good for employment locally and another area off NESLAP.

 

[Smellytele]

Is there also a golf course as part of Hermitage as well?

 

[mister moose]

Uh, the dues are a little higher than that if you buy a home, and they are already signaling big increases:

At a price, of course. In addition to the initiation fee, members will still pay $2500 to $5000 more each year in dues, and even more — from $25,000 to $75,000 — if they buy a home here. “If you love it, join. If you don’t, don’t,” Pinney says simply, though he encourages potential members to decide soon. The initiation fee is climbing incrementally, “and eventually will be in the six figures,” he says.

The airport is currently a 2,650' runway with non precision approaches. The smallest lightest and read slowest jets need over 3,000 feet. To upgrade to dependable jet capability you're looking at well over a 1,000 foot runway extension and a precision landing system, and all the federal and local approvals (and $$$) that go with it. I'm throwing this in the believe-it-when-I-see-it category. Many jets need 5,000 feet. The one thing I do agree with is that a functional airport opens up the market to include aircraft owners in a 3-500 mile radius with urban centers like Philly, Baltimore and DC. But all the winter operation issues and hassles still apply. And with all those hassles, why not go to Vail or Aspen? Because it's still just Haystack. For a six figure annual dues? Niche within a niche within a niche.

 

[drjeff]

Is there also a golf course as part of Hermitage as well?

Yup, the Haystack Golf course has been renamed as the Hermitage Golf Club. It's semi private and a fun test of mountain golf

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[Smellytele]

Yup, the Haystack Golf course has been renamed as the Hermitage Golf Club. It's semi private and a fun test of mountain golf

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Not that I am joining but does your 40-45k to join and 5k a year get you golf as well?

 

[billski]

Hey Mister (as they said back in the day...),

One of the first to buy in was the president and founder of Netjets. It's a little playground. Just like Stowe has been to AIG for many years.

 

[billski]

Think we could get an AZ Summit there next year?

 

[billski]

Also, for the non-addicted skier the place is probably just fine, especially once they have a high speed lift. Back in the day my parents would go with the Haystack only pass. They preferred the lack of crowds and the terrain was plenty for them. I'm sure they're are plenty of other similar folks out there.

You nailed it. The money isn't in the highly skilled skiers.

 

[AdironRider]

If you have that much cash I would just fly to SLC all the time.

People with that much cash don't ski SLC. SLC is a shithole with decent skiing. Rich folks go to Aspen or Jackson, which are both awesome with amazing skiing.

 

[Quietman]

People with that much cash don't ski SLC. SLC is a shithole with decent skiing. Rich folks go to Aspen or Jackson, which are both awesome with amazing skiing.

People at Deer Valley don't have money?
I skied there once and it was 4 days after the most recent snow. We skied 2' of untracked powder in the woods all day long and had a blast. All the wealthy folks like their trails over groomed!

 

[xwhaler]

People with that much cash don't ski SLC. SLC is a shithole with decent skiing. Rich folks go to Aspen or Jackson, which are both awesome with amazing skiing.

Add Sun Valley to this list....not sure it stacks up on the skiing side but the 2nd home wealth out there is apparent

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[ScottySkis]

People with that much cash don't ski SLC. SLC is a shithole with decent skiing. Rich folks go to Aspen or Jackson, which are both awesome with amazing skiing.

True about the city maybe but seriously your calling Alta Snowbirds mountains decent? Have you been there, lots of people consider it some of the best winter skiing snowboarding in the country.

 

[AdironRider]

Add Sun Valley to this list....not sure it stacks up on the skiing side but the 2nd home wealth out there is apparent

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Sun Valley for sure, probably throw Telluride in there as well, but Aspen and Jhole are the big two.

 

[AdironRider]

People at Deer Valley don't have money?
I skied there once and it was 4 days after the most recent snow. We skied 2' of untracked powder in the woods all day long and had a blast. All the wealthy folks like their trails over groomed!

Park City is full of rubes compared to Aspen and Jhole.

 

[mister moose]

One of the first to buy in was the president and founder of Netjets. It's a little playground. Just like Stowe has been to AIG for many years.

Saw that. Doesn't mean he understands small airport winter ops in the northeast. Doesn't mean he knows runway requirements from a pilot's point of view. Doesn't mean he ever cracked a POH. (Aircraft manual) I once worked for an airline where the president of the company (an MBA type, not an ops guy) thought he scored a big deal when he bought a fleet of parked jets for cheap. Then he found out he'd have to refuel to the target city pair or lose half the passenger capacity of the plane right off the top. Sorta cut into profitability. That plus some other bad moves put the company into receivership.

I have no dog in this. Don't really care either way, in fact I'd lean towards hoping they make it. But the jet talk is just sizzle at this point from what I can tell, not substance. That's my overall point. Developers often inflate sales figures to drive interest early on.


I know just too many people with bux that do all their skiing out west. And these aren't even private jet people. So that shapes my opinion. I think it's going to be a struggle.

 

[AdironRider]

Saw that. Doesn't mean he understands small airport winter ops in the northeast. Doesn't mean he knows runway requirements from a pilot's point of view. Doesn't mean he ever cracked a POH. (Aircraft manual) I once worked for an airline where the president of the company (an MBA type, not an ops guy) thought he scored a big deal when he bought a fleet of parked jets for cheap. Then he found out he'd have to refuel to the target city pair or lose half the passenger capacity of the plane right off the top. Sorta cut into profitability. That plus some other bad moves put the company into receivership.

I have no dog in this. Don't really care either way, in fact I'd lean towards hoping they make it. But the jet talk is just sizzle at this point from what I can tell, not substance. That's my overall point. Developers often inflate sales figures to drive interest early on.


I know just too many people with bux that do all their skiing out west. And these aren't even private jet people. So that shapes my opinion. I think it's going to be a struggle.

The NetJets guy also has a 5 or so million condo at the Seasons slopeside in Jackson. Doubt this is a primary usage type thing here. Also, you seem to think that these rich guys are going to be flying themselves. Please. In your breakdown earlier, its more like driven to airport in Maybach by Jeeves, drink 2 bottle of Dom with friends on my 30 minute flight to SVT, Jeeves drives us to slopeside digs, ...profit. This drive yourself and scrape of the car thing is pure bullshit for the clientel you think will do it.