High Priced Lift Tickets

[Hawk]

I was bored and looking back at the beginings of the Sugarbush Thread from 2005. I came across this post.

So 18 years ago the sugarbush pass was $1,000. Well now it still is $1,000 and I can ski all over the world for that same $1,000. So in fact the cost of skiing has actually gone down, Right? LOL

 

[2Planker]

I was bored and looking back at the beginings of the Sugarbush Thread from 2005. I came across this post.
View attachment 59142
So 18 years ago the sugarbush pass was $1,000. Well now it still is $1,000 and I can ski all over the world for that same $1,000. So in fact the cost of skiing has actually gone down, Right? LOL

... and my employee SR Pass worked out to just about $3/hour 30 years ago.
Move forward 34 years and our Epic "pay" is now $2.75/hr

 

[Harvey]

Are you guys figuring (only) the cost of the lift ticket in your cost per day, or other costs too?

I repeat my question...

 

[jaytrem]

I repeat my question...

I keep track of everything else on trips. Not so much for local or home mountain skiing (Mount Snow). In order to keep things reasonable you have to find a lot of other ways to save money than just on lift tickets. Rotating credit cards helps with flights and hotels. Buying gift card at a discount also helps with hotels and food.

 

[Harvey]

I keep track of everything else on trips. Not so much for local or home mountain skiing (Mount Snow). In order to keep things reasonable you have to find a lot of other ways to save money than just on lift tickets. Rotating credit cards helps with flights and hotels. Buying gift card at a discount also helps with hotels and food.

Have your cost to ski gone down in the last 10 years, 20 years?

 

[cdskier]

I was bored and looking back at the beginings of the Sugarbush Thread from 2005. I came across this post.
View attachment 59142
So 18 years ago the sugarbush pass was $1,000. Well now it still is $1,000 and I can ski all over the world for that same $1,000. So in fact the cost of skiing has actually gone down, Right? LOL

Yea...people are only focusing on the fact that skiing the specific way they want to ski is more expensive. In general there are also a lot of people that are spending less on lift tickets/season passes today (or skiing more days for the same price as they paid to ski fewer days in the past). Season pass prices are better values today than they were back then. I don't quite think we have the right balance yet. I think season passes are a bit too low and day tickets are a bit too high. But in general I do believe that people buying day passes should pay more (per day) than season pass holders. Loyalty should be rewarded. This is common in many other industries and no one questions it. If I become a wine club member at a winery and make a commitment to them, they give me more discounts than the person that shows up off the street to buy a single bottle or two once in a while. That makes complete sense. Why is skiing viewed differently? If you want to lower your cost of skiing, pick one resort and get a pass there. If you want to make a last minute decision and go to a different large resort every day/weekend, then you should be paying a premium for that.

I love how on the one hand you'll see people complaining how expensive skiing is and how that is going to kill the sport and no one will be able to afford it. But then in the next breath they complain about how crowded it is. Which is it? Is it too crowded? Or too expensive for people to afford to ski? And every resort shouldn't necessarily need to offer cheap tickets. To use another metaphor, the best seats at a Broadway show should not be expected to be available for a cheap price on a prime day/time (which is what people that want to walk up to places like K, SB, Stowe, etc on a Saturday last minute and still get cheap tickets are essentially asking for). You can still go to the theater for a cheaper price though...you just have to compromise (rear mezzanine seats, weekday matinees, off-Broadway shows, etc). Skiing is similar. You can still find cheaper day tickets if that's the route you want to take, you just need to be willing to compromise a bit (smaller mountain, off-peak day/time, pre-paid tickets, etc).

Also specifically to that post you quoted from 2005...I feel like that last comment fits me so incredibly well. Sugarbush DID take that advice and created a cheap pass for people in their 20s which is exactly what led me to become a passholder there that now spends $1K+ on a season pass.

 

[jaytrem]

Have your cost to ski gone down in the last 10 years, 20 years?

I took a quick look at emails and spreadsheets dating back as far as 2007. I'd have to search harder for older stuff. I'd say things are pretty flat. Rental car prices are up a bit, but Turo has helped with that. Flights are usually free with miles, but even ones I pay for are about the same. Airbnb has helped keep lodging costs down. Trip type hasn't changed much over the years, I'm always chasing new areas whether they're big names or rinky-dink. Just got my Michigan White Gold Card in the mail today, can't wait to hit those rinky-dinks!

 

[Smellytele]

Yea...people are only focusing on the fact that skiing the specific way they want to ski is more expensive. In general there are also a lot of people that are spending less on lift tickets/season passes today (or skiing more days for the same price as they paid to ski fewer days in the past). Season pass prices are better values today than they were back then. I don't quite think we have the right balance yet. I think season passes are a bit too low and day tickets are a bit too high. But in general I do believe that people buying day passes should pay more (per day) than season pass holders. Loyalty should be rewarded. This is common in many other industries and no one questions it. If I become a wine club member at a winery and make a commitment to them, they give me more discounts than the person that shows up off the street to buy a single bottle or two once in a while. That makes complete sense. Why is skiing viewed differently? If you want to lower your cost of skiing, pick one resort and get a pass there. If you want to make a last minute decision and go to a different large resort every day/weekend, then you should be paying a premium for that.

I love how on the one hand you'll see people complaining how expensive skiing is and how that is going to kill the sport and no one will be able to afford it. But then in the next breath they complain about how crowded it is. Which is it? Is it too crowded? Or too expensive for people to afford to ski? And every resort shouldn't necessarily need to offer cheap tickets. To use another metaphor, the best seats at a Broadway show should not be expected to be available for a cheap price on a prime day/time (which is what people that want to walk up to places like K, SB, Stowe, etc on a Saturday last minute and still get cheap tickets are essentially asking for). You can still go to the theater for a cheaper price though...you just have to compromise (rear mezzanine seats, weekday matinees, off-Broadway shows, etc). Skiing is similar. You can still find cheaper day tickets if that's the route you want to take, you just need to be willing to compromise a bit (smaller mountain, off-peak day/time, pre-paid tickets, etc).

Also specifically to that post you quoted from 2005...I feel like that last comment fits me so incredibly well. Sugarbush DID take that advice and created a cheap pass for people in their 20s which is exactly what led me to become a passholder there that now spends $1K+ on a season pass.

Well it seems that mega season pass holders are the ones complaining about ski areas being too crowded. It seems that non pass holders are the ones complaining that skiing is too expensive.

 

[joshua segal]

Have your cost to ski gone down in the last 10 years, 20 years?

Current IRS rules allow for $0.655 per mile driven. That comes out to $200 on a 300-mile round-trip. By the time one amortizes cost of equipment, and cost of food and drink, it goes even higher. If you stay overnight somewhere or own a slope-side condo, cost-to-ski get crazy. Lift tickets at $200 are less than 40% of the cost of a day of skiing - and as everyone has pointed out: if you want a low price per day, and don't want to buy one of the (cheap) major passes, look for bargain days and bogos. They're still available.

 

[crank]

Current IRS rules allow for $0.655 per mile driven. That comes out to $200 on a 300-mile round-trip. By the time one amortizes cost of equipment, and cost of food and drink, it goes even higher. If you stay overnight somewhere or own a slope-side condo, cost-to-ski get crazy. Lift tickets at $200 are less than 40% of the cost of a day of skiing - and as everyone has pointed out: if you want a low price per day, and don't want to buy one of the (cheap) major passes, look for bargain days and bogos. They're still available.

I don't understand. Are you deducting mileage on your car on your federal taxes for ski trips?

 

[Great Bear]

Yea...people are only focusing on the fact that skiing the specific way they want to ski is more expensive. In general there are also a lot of people that are spending less on lift tickets/season passes today (or skiing more days for the same price as they paid to ski fewer days in the past). Season pass prices are better values today than they were back then. I don't quite think we have the right balance yet. I think season passes are a bit too low and day tickets are a bit too high. But in general I do believe that people buying day passes should pay more (per day) than season pass holders. Loyalty should be rewarded. This is common in many other industries and no one questions it. If I become a wine club member at a winery and make a commitment to them, they give me more discounts than the person that shows up off the street to buy a single bottle or two once in a while. That makes complete sense. Why is skiing viewed differently? If you want to lower your cost of skiing, pick one resort and get a pass there. If you want to make a last minute decision and go to a different large resort every day/weekend, then you should be paying a premium for that.

I love how on the one hand you'll see people complaining how expensive skiing is and how that is going to kill the sport and no one will be able to afford it. But then in the next breath they complain about how crowded it is. Which is it? Is it too crowded? Or too expensive for people to afford to ski? And every resort shouldn't necessarily need to offer cheap tickets. To use another metaphor, the best seats at a Broadway show should not be expected to be available for a cheap price on a prime day/time (which is what people that want to walk up to places like K, SB, Stowe, etc on a Saturday last minute and still get cheap tickets are essentially asking for). You can still go to the theater for a cheaper price though...you just have to compromise (rear mezzanine seats, weekday matinees, off-Broadway shows, etc). Skiing is similar. You can still find cheaper day tickets if that's the route you want to take, you just need to be willing to compromise a bit (smaller mountain, off-peak day/time, pre-paid tickets, etc).

Also specifically to that post you quoted from 2005...I feel like that last comment fits me so incredibly well. Sugarbush DID take that advice and created a cheap pass for people in their 20s which is exactly what led me to become a passholder there that now spends $1K+ on a season pass.

Well, all of the above can be true depending on who you are talking about.

- For an Ikon pass holder day tripper, who figured out they could purchase a cheapish pass, pack a peanut butter sandwich in the car, toss their bud light can off the lift and get a shit load of days in, skiing now is very much cheaper than it used to be. All while overcrowding the mountains.
- For me, as a passholder at Killington, skiing today is currently quite a bit more expensive than some of the previous years where the "Ski America" pass gave reciprocity at all ASC mountains or the years of the "bronze/silver/gold" passes. Plus it is very much more expensive than it has ever been if I want to take a western trip - eitehr super expensive day tickets or i risk pre-buying tickets (or a second season pass of some sort) 6 to 9 months in advance that i may or may not end up using.
- For my brother in law's family, who are not big skiers but would like to get up and ski with us once or twice a year, skiing is far more expensive than ever, even with the friends discounts we get with our season passes. (Or as mentioned above, they risk having to purchase tickets months in advance that they may or may not end up using).

So, to the point about complaining, yes, in my case, for my family and especially my extended family, i can say in one breath that skiing has become very expensive and then in the next breath that the mountain is more crowded than ever. In this case both are true.

 

[djd66]

Yeah, mountains are too crowded,… no one skis there anymore.

Got to love Yogi!

 

[deadheadskier]

I don't understand. Are you deducting mileage on your car on your federal taxes for ski trips?

I thought that was what he was saying at first too, but then I realized he was referring to costs people sometimes don't consider with skiing. Like that it costs 65 cents a mile in wear and tear / depreciation on a vehicle to go skiing.

Granted that only assumes one person in the car.

 

[RichT]

I don't understand. Are you deducting mileage on your car on your federal taxes for ski trips?

Hey I want to do that too!

 

[1dog]

Maybe skiing is responding to less available free cash flow from the customer? With rent, mortgage payments/food/fuel/ staples being inflated, people have less disposable income.
Agree with those who see skiing cheaper than it has been in years - maybe ever. But its only cheaper if its done more than a handful of times. Back in the day they put out stats that the average skier went 3-4 days a year. Thats now too expensive to do unless your a 1%'er - ok maybe a 5%'er.

Ski 15 days - most on here I imagine ski 20-30 days. Take $1100 Ikon and it comes out to $73 a day.

Food - gotta eat regardless, don't have to buy the $13 burger. Transportation, equipment, those are all variable with 4 people traveling together, etc. Some very good used or demo equipment out there via Ebay or swaps or hand-me-downs.

Hasn't happened with other sports yet, as far as I can see, but a little research and its a doable family sport that is hard to compare with others.

Just Sugarbush alone has come up with so many options - even a 1PM-4 PM season pass for $400. How many people ski more than 3. hours? Chairs empty after 3 in general- and yeah icy, but $400- no blackouts? Cheap.

 

[jaytrem]

Hey I want to do that too!

Step 1. Become a youtuber, blogger, etc. and make some money.
Step 2. Create LLC.
Step 3. Deduct travel.

Hopefully you have some charisma.

 

[1dog]

Step 1. Become a youtuber, blogger, etc. and make some money.
Step 2. Create LLC.
Step 3. Deduct travel.

Hopefully you have some charisma.

Great post.

 

[joshua segal]

I don't understand. Are you deducting mileage on your car on your federal taxes for ski trips?

For better or worse, that's what it costs to drive, unless, of course, you are doing your own car repairs and/or fooling yourself into not counting oil changes, tires, depreciation and general repairs. Gas is a small part of the price of driving a car.

 

[trackbiker]

Lift tickets at $200 are less than 40% of the cost of a day of skiing - and as everyone has pointed out: if you want a low price per day, and don't want to buy one of the (cheap) major passes, look for bargain days and bogos. They're still available.

When's the last time you saw a BOGO?
Send a link if you know of one.

 

[2Planker]

Hey I want to do that too!

My accountant had me deducting 350 miles every weekend that I worked for SR. Basically every weekend from Thanksgiving until April.
No problem at all. Even got audited 2 times during those 25 years. Never an issue with that deduction.