Jay Peak bombshell

[fbrissette]

Correct, but it's a smart excuse; sort of like setting up a plausible deniability for sales failure for yourself. This Goldberg guy is nobody's fool.

That said, I dont think people have the wool pulled over their eyes, having to admit via court documents that not a single offer was formally submitted is pretty telling.

This is completely out of my area of expertise, but I would assume that before an offer is formally submitted, there's gotta be lots of informal discussions. I can't help but wonder if they were too greedy to begin with. By all accounts, a profitable resort with mostly new infrastructures (not talking about the ski lifts here) should be an easy sale, especially during the current consolidation period.

 

[AdironRider]

This is completely out of my area of expertise, but I would assume that before an offer is formally submitted, there's gotta be lots of informal discussions. I can't help but wonder if they were too greedy to begin with. By all accounts, a profitable resort with mostly new infrastructures (not talking about the ski lifts here) should be an easy sale, especially during the current consolidation period.

It's only been for sale now for what, 3 years?

I think Jay has much higher street cred on forums than in real life. In real life, it is far away from anywhere of consequence and does not have the greatest conditions ever. 9 out of 10 times its boilerplate just like everywhere else on the East Coast. People go once and say, that was what people were raving about?

 

[EPB]

This is completely out of my area of expertise, but I would assume that before an offer is formally submitted, there's gotta be lots of informal discussions. I can't help but wonder if they were too greedy to begin with. By all accounts, a profitable resort with mostly new infrastructures (not talking about the ski lifts here) should be an easy sale, especially during the current consolidation period.

This is tangential to mine. Lots of discussions for sure - both internally (at potential suitors) and between the seller and the five(?) bidders.

I also suspect the asking price was too high given just how many investors $$$ got sunk into the place, the fact that the higher the recovery the less of a public debacle the fraud appears, and the amount of time it's been on the market.

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[Smellytele]

It's only been for sale now for what, 3 years?

I think Jay has much higher street cred on forums than in real life. In real life, it is far away from anywhere of consequence and does not have the greatest conditions ever. 9 out of 10 times its boilerplate just like everywhere else on the East Coast. People go once and say, that was what people were raving about?

The trails yes not so with the woods/trees.


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[thetrailboss]

The trails yes not so with the woods/trees.


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Assuming that the lifts are not on windhold.

 

[thetrailboss]

https://www.vpr.org/post/jay-peak-sale-process-substantially-delayed-due-pandemic

Makes sense. Did VT Digger do a deeper dive on the issue?

IIRC it went on the market in 2019 or so and the usual suspects were interested. That said, I can understand why nobody has submitted a bid in the last two months or so. As to why not before, "?"

 

[thetrailboss]

This is tangential to mine. Lots of discussions for sure - both internally (at potential suitors) and between the seller and the five(?) bidders.

I also suspect the asking price was too high given just how many investors $$$ got sunk into the place, the fact that the higher the recovery the less of a public debacle the fraud appears, and the amount of time it's been on the market.

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The Receiver is certainly in between a rock and a hard place in terms of selling. As you said, he investors are owed a lot of $$$ that Q never ever intended to pay back. So yes the price was probably on the higher end because they were stuck.

 

[Dickc]

Right now, I just want the border to reopen so I can get my mountain bike back,

Can you get hold of anyone there and have it shipped to you? A property manager or the like?

 

[gregnye]

They've been trying for 3 years to sell it and no one wants Jay. Perhaps Vermont could make it state-run like Cannon?

A Cannon-Jay-Burke pass would be sweet. One can dream

I could see the skiing of Jay being state-run like Cannon, with amenities (hotels, waterparks, etc.) contracted out like the National Park service does for their hotels, bus services and restaurants within their parks.

 

[mister moose]

They've been trying for 3 years to sell it and no one wants Jay. Perhaps Vermont could make it state-run like Cannon?

Of course someone wants it if the price is right. I'll buy it for ten dollars. The problem is buying at a price the creditors will approve given the amount they stand to lose, and what the court will deem in their collective best interest. In other words, the minimum bid asked by the receiver was too high for the bidders.

The Receiver is certainly in between a rock and a hard place in terms of selling. As you said, he investors are owed a lot of $$$ that Q never ever intended to pay back. So yes the price was probably on the higher end because they were stuck.

​

You have to sell at a price an educated buyer is willing to pay. There is no hard place, only losses to be absorbed by the creditors.

 

[BenedictGomez]

This is completely out of my area of expertise, but I would assume that before an offer is formally submitted, there's gotta be lots of informal discussions. I can't help but wonder if they were too greedy to begin with. By all accounts, a profitable resort with mostly new infrastructures (not talking about the ski lifts here) should be an easy sale, especially during the current consolidation period.

Yes, this is a good point.

I'm too busy to look it up right now, but I believe they were rumored to be asking for a multiple of something like 10x, whereas I think something closer to 6x is more typical in the industry. I just remember thinking, "pfffftttt"..... when I read the rumored asking price.

 

[machski]

The trails yes not so with the woods/trees.


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That is not necessarily true either. I've gone to Jay thinking they would get the goods, they didn't and the woods were rock solid ice moguls. Not much fun at all that day in particular and I've had others the woods didn't really deliver on at Jay. It is a mountain that has to be timed correctly to have a great experience, even the woods. That is a tough spot for a distant "resort" area which is what the asking price makes Jay. It's lack of Snowmaking ability to recover for inclement New England weather o think is a major hole in getting the asking price they are for it, regardless of all the side extras they have.

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[VTKilarney]

Jay may seem like it’s in the middle of nowhere, but its proximity to Montreal should not be underestimated, especially when you realize how small many of the Laurentian resorts are.

 

[Cobbold]

Off topic/ Bousquet was sold today

Would post this in its own thread, but don’t know how, Bousquet ski area in Pittsfield was sold to mill town partners, and Berkshire East will operate the ski area, Bousquet will be on the Berkshire summit pass, which includes Berkshire East and catamount.

 

[dblskifanatic]

They've been trying for 3 years to sell it and no one wants Jay. Perhaps Vermont could make it state-run like Cannon?

A Cannon-Jay-Burke pass would be sweet. One can dream

I could see the skiing of Jay being state-run like Cannon, with amenities (hotels, waterparks, etc.) contracted out like the National Park service does for their hotels, bus services and restaurants within their parks.

Two different states!


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[BenedictGomez]

Jay may seem like it’s in the middle of nowhere, but its proximity to Montreal should not be underestimated, especially when you realize how small many of the Laurentian resorts are.

I agree with this. With the huge caveat that Jay's proximity to Montreal should not be overestimated either.

 

[ScottySkis]

Would post this in its own thread, but don’t know how, Bousquet ski area in Pittsfield was sold to mill town partners, and Berkshire East will operate the ski area, Bousquet will be on the Berkshire summit pass, which includes Berkshire East and catamount.

It's easy to start new thread:

Instead of going into existing thread on website
Just click POST NEW THREAD
And write what u want
I guess I started a few over the years lol

 

[AdironRider]

I agree with this. With the huge caveat that Jay's proximity to Montreal should not be overestimated either.

To your latter point, Tremblant is marginally closer, consistently ranked higher as a resort, and no border crossing. Jay is probably the third or fourth option at best for the Montreal skier.

The receiver screwed up by demanding top tier resort money for a second rate option. At least he knew Burke was a boat anchor that will lose money and said as much.

I think the investors better get comfortable being ski resort owners. Their best best to get their money back is to harvest profits if they can.

 

[VTKilarney]

If only Bill Stenger knew about the fraud. He could have done something!

 

[Cobbold]

If only Bill Stenger knew about the fraud. He could have done something!

Not to sound stupid, but who is bill Stenger?