Jay Peak bombshell

[BenedictGomez]

A $15 Million chairift, which may now cost almost $23 Million - that's sub mile in length?

For reference, PCMR is currently putting in a new gondola as we speak, it's well over a mile long, over dramatically more challenging installation & construction terrain, and with giant 10 passenger cabins to boot, and with all that it penciled in at $18 Million.

I'll take, "Things That Never Happened, for $500 Alex".

 

[jaytrem]

Sunrise is $27 million. $18 from Vail. $9 from the homeowners association. Sloppy post on your part.

 

[Hastur]

Plus they got The pre tarrif price.

 

[doublediamond]

As posted up thread, the $15M original price tag was in line with the Superstar lift replacement ($12M).

And if you think either of those prices are outrageous, just look to Wachusett’s price tag … their new 4400 foot long Doppelmayr HSS is $20M.

 

[thetrailboss]

A $15 Million chairift, which may now cost almost $23 Million - that's sub mile in length?

For reference, PCMR is currently putting in a new gondola as we speak, it's well over a mile long, over dramatically more challenging installation & construction terrain, and with giant 10 passenger cabins to boot, and with all that it penciled in at $18 Million.

I'll take, "Things That Never Happened, for $500 Alex".

View attachment 66404

Admittedly, Jay under Stenger had exaggeration. But I find Steve more credible.

 

[BodeMiller1]

Well, this is not good at all......

Canada will come around. I talk with Canadians every day in Montpelier. They, like myself really don't care what's going on in Washington and Ottawa.

File under: So, what, big deal who cares.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Sunrise is $27 million. $18 from Vail. $9 from the homeowners association. Sloppy post on your part.

The lift and lift construction costs are $18M. The $9M is for extra project costs which are non-lift or lift construction related. Sloppy response on your part.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Canada will come around. I talk with Canadians every day in Montpelier. They, like myself really don't care what's going on in Washington and Ottawa.

File under: So, what, big deal who cares.

There's no doubt there's anger in Canada, but the aspect that is being completely ignored is the twin dagger of the fact the Canadian economy is not in a great place, simultaneous with the fact the Canadian dollar is in the toilet.

A lot of this began pre-tariffs, which is being conveniently ignored, and it is not shocking that sales/activity began to fall in the first quarter of 2025, because the end of 2024 was when the CAD was at its absolute weakest (it's been fighting back lately). In other words, much of this narrative is completely political.

 

[jaytrem]

The lift and lift construction costs are $18M. The $9M is for extra project costs which are non-lift or lift construction related. Sloppy response on your part.

Please post your source.

Preliminary plans unveiled for new 10-person gondola at Canyons Village - Park Record

The Sunrise Gondola is expected to cost $27 million. It is subject to approval.

www.parkrecord.com

 

[thetrailboss]

There's no doubt there's anger in Canada, but the aspect that is being completely ignored is the twin dagger of the fact the Canadian economy is not in a great place, simultaneous with the fact the Canadian dollar is in the toilet.

A lot of this began pre-tariffs, which is being conveniently ignored, and it is not shocking that sales/activity began to fall in the first quarter of 2025, because the end of 2024 was when the CAD was at its absolute weakest (it's been fighting back lately). In other words, much of this narrative is completely political.

View attachment 66406

Yeah, but the point that Steve Wright was making was that there are a significant number of his Canadian customers who are not coming to Jay in protest of the direction of the U.S. The status of the Canadian economy and the CAD is not as relevant to this discussion because Jay charges at par IIRC. If anything, a part of the Canadian economy struggling is all of the trade war B.S. that Trump has started with one of our largest trading partners.

Additionally, I am hearing that Kingdom Trails traffic is WAY down due to a lack of Canadians. I talked to a guy from Whitefish, MT last week and he was also saying that their tourist business, which usually is Canadian traffic, is off.

 

[jaytrem]

Ok, I see it on liftblog. Sounds like Vail is paying $18 million for the actual lift equipment with the home owners group paying the rest. Install and whatever stuff the lift manufacturer doesn't provide I assume. So yeah, it's a $27 million lift, just like it was always stated to be.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Ok, I see it on liftblog. Sounds like Vail is paying $18 million for the actual lift equipment with the home owners group paying the rest. Install and whatever stuff the lift manufacturer doesn't provide I assume. So yeah, it's a $27 million lift, just like it was always stated to be.

The $9M has not been broken out, but my belief is the $9M likely includes the major expenses for the new Sunrise Gondola plaza that is currently being constructed. What that entails I do not know (dont believe it's currently publicly stated), but one presumes it includes building, things like retail and/or restaurants, bathrooms/lockers, typical things like that. I havent seen any sort of diagram, Vail isnt nearly as open with stuff like this as Deer Valley is, which has wonderful pictures of what everything will look like.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Yeah, but the point that Steve Wright was making was that there are a significant number of his Canadian customers who are not coming to Jay in protest of the direction of the U.S. The status of the Canadian economy and the CAD is not as relevant to this discussion because Jay charges at par IIRC. If anything, a part of the Canadian economy struggling is all of the trade war B.S. that Trump has started with one of our largest trading partners.

I thought the "at par" policy is only for the tickets? I don't think Jay accepts CAD for the major purchases like hotel nights or for things like food, etc...

EDIT: Nothing on food. But looks like they can pay 50% of their lodging at par, but only if they show up with a certified bank check or travelers checks. I wonder what percentage are even aware of that or would bother getting travelers checks.

 

[Edd]

Additionally, I am hearing that Kingdom Trails traffic is WAY down due to a lack of Canadians. I talked to a guy from Whitefish, MT last week and he was also saying that their tourist business, which usually is Canadian traffic, is off.

Friends of mine were at KT last week; I heard the same from them. Last thing the Burke area needs right now.

 

[snoseek]

Friends of mine were at KT last week; I heard the same from them. Last thing the Burke area needs right now.

Same report I got. My friend was up yesterday and sent me pics while I was working. Looked like a Tuesday in late September to me.

 

[jaytrem]

The $9M has not been broken out, but my belief is the $9M likely includes the major expenses for the new Sunrise Gondola plaza that is currently being constructed. What that entails I do not know (dont believe it's currently publicly stated), but one presumes it includes building, things like retail and/or restaurants, bathrooms/lockers, typical things like that. I havent seen any sort of diagram, Vail isnt nearly as open with stuff like this as Deer Valley is, which has wonderful pictures of what everything will look like.

View attachment 66407

Yeah, none of its very clear. But $18 million for a gondola of that length with a direct drive motor seems crazy low compared to everything else that's been built recently.

 

[AdironRider]

The $9M has not been broken out, but my belief is the $9M likely includes the major expenses for the new Sunrise Gondola plaza that is currently being constructed. What that entails I do not know (dont believe it's currently publicly stated), but one presumes it includes building, things like retail and/or restaurants, bathrooms/lockers, typical things like that. I havent seen any sort of diagram, Vail isnt nearly as open with stuff like this as Deer Valley is, which has wonderful pictures of what everything will look like.

View attachment 66407

Translation: I was wrong but to much of a blowhard to admit it

 

[thetrailboss]

Friends of mine were at KT last week; I heard the same from them. Last thing the Burke area needs right now.

Same report I got. My friend was up yesterday and sent me pics while I was working. Looked like a Tuesday in late September to me.

One has to wonder if the reason for the sale listings of Mike’s Tiki Bar and Dirt Church is in part due to the anticipation of a bad summer due to low Canadian traffic.

 

[thetrailboss]

 

[bigbob]

They are hurting due to the lack of Canadian visitors refusing to visit the US.