Off Road Vehicles arrrrgh

[skiguide]

I'm definitely of the mind that anything that gets you into Outdoor Recreation is a good thing, motorized or non, and I am one of those rare people that enjoys both, and try to set a good example for others whenever i'm on any type of trail. It's all about mutual respect and obtaining knowledge on how to minimize environmental impact, and just not be a dumbass, and spoil it for others completely.

Southern maine has had a lot of uproar lately between ATVers AND Snowmobilers, which you would think would be the same crowd mostly (as we were both) - because of ATVs wrecking trails and privately owned land, they've also had to close it to snowmobilers.

here in the northeast, it is a bit harder to find separate use trails, because of the tigher area available aand more people using the outdoors. Definitely out west, it's more wide open. but destination spots such as Moab cope on the whole.

I don't buy into the pollution argument that greatly, because that should be in the hands of federal standards to be reduced across the boards - Trucks/SUVs, boats, etc.

rossignol... you definitely sound like a dedicated jeeper... just make sure you support those companies that support the cause, and buy your parts/accessories from somewhere like http://www.tellico4x4.com or http://www.rubicon4x4.com

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

NH Supreme Court Rejects ATV Park Developement

This morning the NH Supreme Court rejected the claim of a private developer to build an ATV Park on private land without a Site Plan Review & Approval Process by the local authority having jurisidiction (planning board and selectmen).

The Town of Lyndeborough NH defeated BOISVERT PROPERTIES, LLC including the New Hampshire Department of Resources and Economic Development and the Granite State ATV Association.

See http://www.courts.state.nh.us/supreme/opinions/2004/lynde057.htm for the official verdict ruling. It is not long and is written in plain english.

The proposed ATV Park was to occupy upwards of 500 acres and promoted that the use was for 24/7 all year round.

This will affect the many of the areas in the state operating in the same manner.

 

[Mike P.]

Is mud part of the challenge or part of the impact?

Most of the challenge appears to be climbing rough trails that might tip your vehicle over or end up hung up over a rock or ledge. They tend to go very slow. The kids (mostly) that I see in store parking lots in mud covered vehicles are not really embracing the 4x4 LNT (Leave as little as possible trace) & are a black eye on the 4x4 crowd much like the few littering hikers.

Snowmobiles are loud & older models are two stroke engines but once the snow melts, you can't tell they were there. That is not the case with ATV's & 4x4's. All stress out the wildlife but that is another issue.

 

[mudbogger]

what trails are for

I dont see how atvs are directly hurting the enviroment, with the statements provided by fellow forum goers, the business of off roading is more of a nusence to people than an actual problem to the enviroment. Mud is not bad for the enviroment, noise is not bad for the enviroment. I dont see any one way of using the trails as better than the other. It should not be anyone person, or groups decision as to how the woods are to be used, everyone has the same right to them. Walkers and offroaders should have a mutual respect for what the other is trying to accomplish.

P.S. Rossignol where do you go jeepin'?

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

Re: what trails are for

I dont see how atvs are directly hurting the enviroment, with the statements provided by fellow forum goers, the business of off roading is more of a nusence to people than an actual problem to the enviroment. Mud is not bad for the enviroment, noise is not bad for the enviroment. I dont see any one way of using the trails as better than the other. It should not be anyone person, or groups decision as to how the woods are to be used, everyone has the same right to them. Walkers and offroaders should have a mutual respect for what the other is trying to accomplish.

P.S. Rossignol where do you go jeepin'?

As an avid hiker and jeeper, I agree, under certain circumstances both jeepin and hiking can alter the enviroment.

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

Living in the "Scenic Country" of central NH, we have had problems with the noise and wildlife habitat destruction caused by ATV's and Dirt Bikes.

Trail walkers, horse riders and skiers developed most of our community trails. Over time bicycles and eventually machines made their way onto them as well. It is not uncommon for me to walk on trails on my property during a Sunday morning and come across any or all of the trail users listed above. I haven’t had a face to face problem and I do not look for one. My wife and I welcome trail users; hopefully peaceful ones who want to enjoy the wildlife as we do. We enjoy having the wildlife live on our land and are glad when other trail users get to enjoy it as well.

Admittedly I get a bit annoyed when I find trash, broken parts, and discarded personal items on and around the trails. Periodically I bring a trash bag and take it out full.

Generally speaking (at least where we live) it is not the landowners or abutters behind the "Blasting through the Woods," but out-of-towners. I have seen property owners go through the process of closing off trail-use on their land. I don’t necessarily agree with that, however it is their property. To be fair, we have had no issues with hunters or fisherman.

Wildlife needs protection from machines tearing up the ground they forage for berries, bark, critter holes, etc. Most land animals are nocturnal, and with machines terrifying them during the day, their rest cycle is disturbed, thus effecting their health. Birds visit the area less often and that effects the natural cycle of seed dropping, plant growth, fly growth patterns, etc… Ultimately, the natural cycle of the ecosystem is altered. That bothers me.

The State Department of Environmental Services (NH DES) specifically protects wetlands and bodies of water. Running a machine through a wetland or any bodies of water in NH is a forbidden act.

I do believe you have the right to use your land as you may want, however using other person’s property the way you want without their permission is undeserved and wrong. I believe you will find that is what most people are concerned about.

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

Charlie Schuessler wrote:

Trail walkers, horse riders and skiers developed most of our community trails.

and many community trails are old roads.

Admittedly I get a bit annoyed when I find trash, broken parts, and discarded personal items on and around the trails. Periodically I bring a trash bag and take it out full.

I've come across alot more garbage on trails used by hikers and skiers than on ATV and jeep trails.

Wildlife needs protection from machines tearing up the ground they forage for berries, bark, critter holes, etc. Most land animals are nocturnal, and with machines terrifying them during the day, their rest cycle is disturbed, thus effecting their health. Birds visit the area less often and that effects the natural cycle of seed dropping, plant growth, fly growth patterns, etc… Ultimately, the natural cycle of the ecosystem is altered. That bothers me.

That's funny. The moose and bears I see crossing the Kanc. don't look too bothered. The next time you're driving along and see some deer in a field near the road, stop your car and get out. Then see how fast the deer leave. Many animals are much more afraid of people on foot than they are of vehicles.
"fly growth patterns", now that bothers me.

On a related note. Massabesic Lake is a primary water source for the residents of Manchester, NH. Motor boats are permitted on this lake, swimmers are not. That's because it has been determined that people are more harmful to the enviroment than motor boats. :-?

 

[MtnMagic]

Seed droppings, plant growth, bird visits, yes, all understood. Fly growth patterns is a bit less than clear. Mud pollution can be a problem. But noise pollution may be a noisier problem. Not to mention the air pollutants.
________________
Can you elaborate, please?!

 

[MtnMagic]

And btw I'd like to share the following fact: The biggest secret in the state of NH is the fact that its largest lake, Winnipesaukee is completely polluded with oil and gas from years of leakage from boats.

Now local area private wells are saturated with this *growth pattern*. The slick is seen on the water everyday.
_________________
I am glad to be very far north of this pollution!

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

MtnMagic wrote:

And btw I'd like to share the following fact: The biggest secret in the state of NH is the fact that its largest lake, Winnipesaukee is completely polluded with oil and gas from years of leakage from boats.

Now local area private wells are saturated with this *growth pattern*. The slick is seen on the water everyday.

Another big secret is that oil and gas floats on the surface of water (that's why motor boats are allowed on Massabesic) so I doubt the whole lake is polluded (what's polluded mean anyways ), and the amount of oil and gas leaking from boats is nothing compared to the amount leaked by cars and trucks in the area and then washed into the lake. Wouldn't you agree?

 

[Charlie Schuessler]

Old roads were initially developed as walking trails by wildlife and mankind, not the other way around...

 

[Mike P.]

If the mud washes into the streams, you add more silt than would be there without churning it all up. While noise may not hurt the environment, it's not part of the environment either, it's added & the engines that make it pollute.

Thinkling old septic tanks maybe more of an issue on lakes with older established communities on them.