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What exactly is so bad about Heaven's Gate? All the new lift will do is slightly bump capacity and boost reliability a bit, although it seems to be one of the more reliable lifts at Sugarbush right now. If it was detachable, that would be a bigger upgrade, but I can't really see how a fixed grip quad is that much of an upgrade.
It's a physical thing, I just find it horribly uncomfortable all around unlike any other lift. Obviously it's me. I have some upper back and neck mobility issues and for some reason I have issues with that lift that I don't with others anywhere. I get it's 40yrs old, and I'm not looking for a 6-pack bubble heated chair. I just find it really an uncomfortable ride that I happily take as often as I can.
Having Dopplemayr install a Poma was the original sin. It was initially installed around 1990 and moved in '95 so on paper it shouldn't need to be replaced already, but it clearly does.I have been reluctant to comment on all this lift discussion. But here is a perspective on NRX. When it was installed by Claneil back in the 80’s it was advertised as the fastest lift in the USA and I think was the first top drive in the USA. The chain in the terminal as also unique and it hindsight not great. When Les Otten bought Sugarbush he moved it from where GMX is to its current location and put in the infamous “Slug”. We replaced the Slug with the current GMX. It is now at Jay Peak. When Les moved NRX he had Dopplemyr move a Poma lift. As a result neither wanted accountability for it in its new location. We did spend a lot of $ over the years. Specifically a new motor , new communication lines and new Drive. Also all the tower has been rewired a few times including I believe this summer. It happens to be a tough lift to maintain and none of the issue are due to anyone not focusing or spending dollars on it. One might argue that it should be replaced ahead of HG but that is a judgment call and since 75-80% of visitors ski at LP or ME, I certainly can‘t argue with that decision. Many of the comments that have been made in my opinion are misinformed and hopefully Sugarbush will respond with the facts. When I owned the resort one statistic I looked at carefully each year was the percent of time lifts ran without a mechanical to electrical problem and we were in most years around 99.5%. That is a very good result within the industry. But given the number of hours that the 16 lift run that could mean that there were 50-60 hours when lifts were down. The vast majority were minutes not hours. But occasionally a serious issue like a motor fail could cause a lift to be down for a day or more. That said if one is unlucky to be on a lift when it goes down for 10-15 minutes it can be a terrible experience and that frames ones opinion. I have skied 49 days this season and have over 450,000 vertical and have not experienced more than a minute of two of stoppage and some of those were due to misloads or unloads. (hopefully I have not jinxed myself)
If Valley House is any indication, it will only run at about 425 ft/min which is pretty much what Heaven's Gate runs at. Fixed grip quads can only run at 450 ft/min and they typically run slower to reduce misloads. I'm curious to see if they do a loading conveyor or not. It technically allows a fixed-grip quad to run slightly faster, but it is quite expensive and has caused a lot of problems for Valley House.
It runs slower than code allows because the unload was engineered steeper than we would have liked. When we first opened many skiers were not anticipating the unload and the chair was hitting them from behind and causing falls. If the unload at HG in better it should run faster than the 425 at VH.
Nice! It's almost as if they cared about their customers. SB used to have an owner like that...
Heavens gate runs at a similar speed to valley house? really? seems slower to me.
1) there can be arguments back and forth on how hard it is to keep a lift rolling, but IMO there's no excuse for the lack of communication. 90 min total shut down on a Sunday in the middle of the season and not a single word on what happened?I have been reluctant to comment on all this lift discussion. But here is a perspective on NRX. When it was installed by Claneil back in the 80’s it was advertised as the fastest lift in the USA and I think was the first top drive in the USA. The chain in the terminal as also unique and it hindsight not great. When Les Otten bought Sugarbush he moved it from where GMX is to its current location and put in the infamous “Slug”. We replaced the Slug with the current GMX. It is now at Jay Peak. When Les moved NRX he had Dopplemyr move a Poma lift. As a result neither wanted accountability for it in its new location. We did spend a lot of $ over the years. Specifically a new motor , new communication lines and new Drive. Also all the tower has been rewired a few times including I believe this summer. It happens to be a tough lift to maintain and none of the issue are due to anyone not focusing or spending dollars on it. One might argue that it should be replaced ahead of HG but that is a judgment call and since 75-80% of visitors ski at LP or ME, I certainly can‘t argue with that decision. Many of the comments that have been made in my opinion are misinformed and hopefully Sugarbush will respond with the facts. When I owned the resort one statistic I looked at carefully each year was the percent of time lifts ran without a mechanical to electrical problem and we were in most years around 99.5%. That is a very good result within the industry. But given the number of hours that the 16 lift run that could mean that there were 50-60 hours when lifts were down. The vast majority were minutes not hours. But occasionally a serious issue like a motor fail could cause a lift to be down for a day or more. That said if one is unlucky to be on a lift when it goes down for 10-15 minutes it can be a terrible experience and that frames ones opinion. I have skied 49 days this season and have over 450,000 vertical and have not experienced more than a minute of two of stoppage and some of those were due to misloads or unloads. (hopefully I have not jinxed myself
Your communication comment is reasonable. I suspect there will be one even if it is late. And yes, there are requirements to report significant issues to the VT Tram Authority. I am not aware of any standards that are shared, but in discussions I had with other operators a 99.5% was considered very good.
I've understood your position and appreciated your concern for the most part. That said, I may be misinterpreting what you've written above. IMHO there can not be "legitimate" arguments back and forth on how hard it is to keep a lift running when one side has few facts and no expertise and the other side has all the facts and all the expertise. And if more expertise is needed that same side can simply reach out to Dopp or Poma or whomever. I wish you the best of luck when you reach out to Dopp and/or Poma to discuss potential fixes for NRX.
Win,I have been reluctant to comment on all this lift discussion. But here is a perspective on NRX. When it was installed by Claneil back in the 80’s it was advertised as the fastest lift in the USA and I think was the first top drive in the USA. The chain in the terminal as also unique and it hindsight not great. When Les Otten bought Sugarbush he moved it from where GMX is to its current location and put in the infamous “Slug”. We replaced the Slug with the current GMX. It is now at Jay Peak. When Les moved NRX he had Dopplemyr move a Poma lift. As a result neither wanted accountability for it in its new location. We did spend a lot of $ over the years. Specifically a new motor , new communication lines and new Drive. Also all the tower has been rewired a few times including I believe this summer. It happens to be a tough lift to maintain and none of the issue are due to anyone not focusing or spending dollars on it. One might argue that it should be replaced ahead of HG but that is a judgment call and since 75-80% of visitors ski at LP or ME, I certainly can‘t argue with that decision. Many of the comments that have been made in my opinion are misinformed and hopefully Sugarbush will respond with the facts. When I owned the resort one statistic I looked at carefully each year was the percent of time lifts ran without a mechanical to electrical problem and we were in most years around 99.5%. That is a very good result within the industry. But given the number of hours that the 16 lift run that could mean that there were 50-60 hours when lifts were down. The vast majority were minutes not hours. But occasionally a serious issue like a motor fail could cause a lift to be down for a day or more. That said if one is unlucky to be on a lift when it goes down for 10-15 minutes it can be a terrible experience and that frames ones opinion. I have skied 49 days this season and have over 450,000 vertical and have not experienced more than a minute of two of stoppage and some of those were due to misloads or unloads. (hopefully I have not jinxed myself
Yeah, it's just me I've never heard anyone have the issue I apparently have with it.I get the arguments being made to focus elsewhere, I guess I don't have the hours on the mountain that most of you do to frame an opinion based on reliability issues. I can see how Bravo is a huge single point of failure. That's the heart of the place, that needs to move masses. Bravo and GH need to be bulletproof, this much I have figured out.
