I think it is a very fair comparison. If there's not enough snow yet to run CR (at higher elevations), why would there be enough snow at lower elevations to run Slide Brook? I don't know if I've ever seen Slide Brook run before CR...
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The "Sugarbush Thread"
- Thread starter thetrailboss
- Start date
I think it is a very fair comparison. If there's not enough snow yet to run CR (at higher elevations), why would there be enough snow at lower elevations to run Slide Brook? I don't know if I've ever seen Slide Brook run before CR...
NewEnglander77
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Any reason that a chairlift in place of both GMX and Summit from base to summit isn't a viable option? No easy way down from summit seems to be the only reason I could find. If it's too windy at the top, then run Inverness.
KustyTheKlown
Well-known member
there isnt a lot of space at the top of summit and it wouldnt be good for all of the traffic to go up there, for the lift offload and the groomer path down. the top of gmx is a big flat area with a lodge.
xlr8r
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Northridge being removed without replacement, sends a really bad message. Detachable lifts are the standard, while it is acceptable that Village, Valley House, Sunny Q, and now Heaven's Gate were replaced with Fixed Quads, the fact is Sugarbush has not installed a new detachable now in almost 25 years. With NRX and Slidebrook closed, Sugarbush only has 3 detachables running, compared to 6 at Stowe.
NRX should be replaced with another HSQ, Ellen has an ideal lift layout as is when every lift runs, as there is lift redundancy to every part of the mountain axcept for above the top of NRX which is only accessible by Summit. With all the lift breakdowns in recent years, Ellen has needed that redundancy. The only alternative that might make sense is replacing NRX and GMX with one lift due to GMX also having lots of issues in recent years. The NRX liftline could be extended down to the base in its current alignment and a single signature detachable could run from base to top of NRX. For capacity reasons this would probably have to be a sixpack as it would replace 2 quads, leave Inverness, Summit, and Sunny Q as is.
NRX should be replaced with another HSQ, Ellen has an ideal lift layout as is when every lift runs, as there is lift redundancy to every part of the mountain axcept for above the top of NRX which is only accessible by Summit. With all the lift breakdowns in recent years, Ellen has needed that redundancy. The only alternative that might make sense is replacing NRX and GMX with one lift due to GMX also having lots of issues in recent years. The NRX liftline could be extended down to the base in its current alignment and a single signature detachable could run from base to top of NRX. For capacity reasons this would probably have to be a sixpack as it would replace 2 quads, leave Inverness, Summit, and Sunny Q as is.
One chair vs 2 would completely change the way the MTN skis - funneling all that traffic to one spot - sounds awful. (Never mind having to ski that runout on every run)
I question the validity of the rumor that they are going to pull the NRX without a replacement. Makes no sense. Even if they can only make the chair run 10 days a year, they can still boast that they have 5 HSQ’s
just curious, does anyone know of the total days Ellen has been open this year, how many days has NRX been down or not operated for a full day due to mechanical issues?
I question the validity of the rumor that they are going to pull the NRX without a replacement. Makes no sense. Even if they can only make the chair run 10 days a year, they can still boast that they have 5 HSQ’s
just curious, does anyone know of the total days Ellen has been open this year, how many days has NRX been down or not operated for a full day due to mechanical issues?
xlr8r
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The other possibility is that they realize NRX is a lost cause, but its now too late to get an order in with Doppelmayr or Leitner Poma for a new HSQ for next season. They might announce this is the last year for NRX, but its replacement won't come until 2026
FWIW North Ridge was listed last year as a lift likely to be replaced in 2025 on Peter's site. Now that entry has been deleted. NRX is not listed in 2026.
liftblog.com
2025 New Lifts
This is a list of new lifts likely to be built in the United States and Canada during the 2025 construction season. Last updated 1/3/2025. Have an addition or correction? Please comment below or e…
liftblog.com
xlr8r
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Originally they announced back in (2022? I think) both Heaven's Gate and NRX would be replaced together in 2024. They then it changed to Heaven's Gate 2024 and NRX in 2025, then that got pulled and the replacement of NRX is now unknown to the public. Also Stratton had planned on replacing Tamarack in 2025, but that also has been pulled. This is leading to the rumors Alterra is cutting back on capital investments.
NewEnglander77
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Cutting back on the East Coast to be more specific. There is no shortage of investment being made elsewhere.
The investment in employee housing doesn't seem to be imminent either, although some of that rests on Warrens shitty zoning and the town's inability to embrace housing growth.
The investment in employee housing doesn't seem to be imminent either, although some of that rests on Warrens shitty zoning and the town's inability to embrace housing growth.
doublediamond
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Why not a mid load at the current NRX bottom? Best of all worlds. Only 1 lift, only 3 terminal for maintenance. And you can lap the main mountain while providing base access.
PowderDreams
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As far as I’m concerned, we have no high speed lifts at Mt Ellen this year. GMX runs at quarter speed, if at all, 80% of the time this year. NRX has been loading for what, a dozen hours all season? It is now January.Hypothetically: If you could snap your fingers and tomorrow, in place of NRX, there's a new, properly running fixed grip quad. Same alignment. Would you take that?
I know it wouldn't ever actually happen but I'm curious what people think. A slow but new and reliable North Ridge lift vs the current failure prone NRX and the prospect of (god only knows when) future replacement?
I think if the Saudi overlords had to ritual-sacrifice an Ellen detachable lift at the Deer Valley altar, they should definitely get rid of GMX. NRX serves all the interesting terrain of GMX, and it has a far superior alignment. But honestly, after ruining last spring, after ruining the eclipse, after ruining Christmas, and now ruining January, we should be asking where we want the third detachable to go. I think they should put bubbles on Slidebrook so they can stop the money hold chicanery. Barring that, I think I’ll be taking the single chair next year. I know a dozen other long time passholders who aren’t planning on renewing this year.
This thread is the canary in the coal mine. The average customer is a lot madder than all these loyal diehards. But instead of posting about it, they just won’t come back. Just look at how many people were in town Saturday night and didn’t bother skiing a powder Sunday. The cold’s never stopped anyone before now.
Can you imagine the lines at mid station? Maybe this could work on week days, but no way on weekends and holidays.
And today….Note that North Ridge will be delayed this morning while lift maintenance is hard at work sorting out a chair spacing issue!
in all seriousness, i know that invariably when lifts are replaced, new towers come with it. But is it possible to only replace the lift mechanism?
in all seriousness, i know that invariably when lifts are replaced, new towers come with it. But is it possible to only replace the lift mechanism?
Newpylong
Well-known member
I wasn't solely referring to this year, but all of them in aggregation. No one can deny it's beyond a second class citizen at this point for reasons A-Z.
However I don't think CR is an apples to apples comparison. There is a difference between getting snowmobiles in to get a few people off the lift and terrain holding up to hundreds of skiers.
I had the same thought. Where is everyone? People voting with their pocketbooks? Snow was good to great ( upper lower FIS was sweetest) and was not bad.
Slap higher rates on everything - except fuel- and except for homeowners and locals - competition is taking a toll.
It may not be apples to apples, but it is close enough. Yes you need less snow, but there IS less snow at lower elevations naturally. So even if CR and SB opened the same day, there's still going to be less snow in SB on the service roads than on CR. I can't recall in the past 10-15 years where Slide Brook didn't come online after CR...
I also guess Slide Brook running or not doesn't bother me much. Very low priority on my list of concerns.
With the stated shortage of lift mechanics Slide Brook is not going to be on the priority list of opening. It takes a lot of time to clear the line in the morning. It is also a stress to Mtn Ops when it is running fearing an evac will be needed. Newpy is correct, when it went in in 95 it ran everyday until ASC sold to Win. It was not a snow depth issue, the lift mechanics would take 4 wheelers in on the service roads. Perhaps add another bus going back an forth so it is only a 15 minute wait and not 30 minutes. There used to be two.
NRX is a huge issue and will hopefully be replaced with a HSQ. They invested enough money in the snowmaking system there so it shows they do care about Ellen a little bit and hopefully justifies replacing NRX. GMX doesn't need to be replaced, just fixed.
They have said it, but it's clear they are struggling with the lift maintenance staff in numbers and probably institutional knowledge. They are working hard but it's not enough and constantly fighting issues. I recall this same issue 8-10 years ago under Win's ownership and it got corrected with what I am assuming was better than market wages. I want to ski at Ellen but until the lifts are running reliably I will stay away.
NRX is a huge issue and will hopefully be replaced with a HSQ. They invested enough money in the snowmaking system there so it shows they do care about Ellen a little bit and hopefully justifies replacing NRX. GMX doesn't need to be replaced, just fixed.
They have said it, but it's clear they are struggling with the lift maintenance staff in numbers and probably institutional knowledge. They are working hard but it's not enough and constantly fighting issues. I recall this same issue 8-10 years ago under Win's ownership and it got corrected with what I am assuming was better than market wages. I want to ski at Ellen but until the lifts are running reliably I will stay away.
Hawk
Well-known member
Ahh my evil plan is working! Soon we will have the mountain back. HA HA HA
Count me as another lurker who’s fed up with the management. Been skiing Sugarbush for 10 years and own a home there. We love the mountain terrain and the MRV, but have lost confidence in the current management’s ability to manage what should be a world class ski mountain. The combination of exorbitant prices along with poor lift infrastructure and maintenance as well as poor snowmaking has significantly diminished the experience over the past few years. If you're going to charge top dollar for the experience, you better be able to deliver a competitive experience. And right now, Sugarbush is not competitive with what other mountains are offering. With global warming, it's not a good strategy to have underpowered snowmaking like they do at LP. And it's simply mismanagement to let lift ops languish.
They can make excuses all they want about how difficult it is to maintain lifts or hire the right talent or make snow, etc. But those are the responsibilities of running a ski mountain. And the current management team has shown an inability to handle those responsibilities.
Last week, my wife said to me "maybe we should look into selling our house in Warren and finding another mountain that has better lifts and snowmaking..."
The natural snow this past weekend was excellent, and reminded us why we love Sugarbush. But there's gotta be a better plan for the future than "let's hope for natural snow and pretend that all of our terrain is open without lift access"
They can make excuses all they want about how difficult it is to maintain lifts or hire the right talent or make snow, etc. But those are the responsibilities of running a ski mountain. And the current management team has shown an inability to handle those responsibilities.
Last week, my wife said to me "maybe we should look into selling our house in Warren and finding another mountain that has better lifts and snowmaking..."
The natural snow this past weekend was excellent, and reminded us why we love Sugarbush. But there's gotta be a better plan for the future than "let's hope for natural snow and pretend that all of our terrain is open without lift access"
KustyTheKlown
Well-known member
really a bummer all this.
i dont think its ops' fault (mostly), but i had a straight up mediocre day at lincoln peak on saturday - my first day this season that i wouldnt classify as good to great.
it was really cold. not managements fault. was surprised my layers and face mask didnt keep me toasty. prob bc i hiked to castlerock, sweat, and then was wet in the cold. thats my fault.
but i just barely found any good snow. the top of ripcord was a disaster. my poor season1 armadas. then once i got past the crap of it the new snow on ripcord was so strangely wind effected. organgrinder was a deathtrap of dust on bumps with ice troughs. paradise skied ok but not nearly as good as i expected with the new snow. castlerock was kinda not worth the hike (liftline was not soft at all. it got good once i got to cotillion. really glad for those few powder turns). the unmarked woods next to organgrinder skied well. most of the other woods on lincoln peak are low (below super bravo) and dont have the good coverage yet to handle their pitch. and all of the glades, including marked ones, are full of fucking deadfall. i dont know if any clean up has occurred in the glades at all. eden is a fucking mess.
i was considering going back sunday for mount ellen bc the glades tend to be higher and better there (tumbler, exterminator, bravo, and the unmarked woods next to summit chair line). but after hearing good words about stratton woods, i decided to drive 80 min south instead of north, and had one of my best days of the season. then i learn that ellen lifts were fucked all day.
i dont think its ops' fault (mostly), but i had a straight up mediocre day at lincoln peak on saturday - my first day this season that i wouldnt classify as good to great.
it was really cold. not managements fault. was surprised my layers and face mask didnt keep me toasty. prob bc i hiked to castlerock, sweat, and then was wet in the cold. thats my fault.
but i just barely found any good snow. the top of ripcord was a disaster. my poor season1 armadas. then once i got past the crap of it the new snow on ripcord was so strangely wind effected. organgrinder was a deathtrap of dust on bumps with ice troughs. paradise skied ok but not nearly as good as i expected with the new snow. castlerock was kinda not worth the hike (liftline was not soft at all. it got good once i got to cotillion. really glad for those few powder turns). the unmarked woods next to organgrinder skied well. most of the other woods on lincoln peak are low (below super bravo) and dont have the good coverage yet to handle their pitch. and all of the glades, including marked ones, are full of fucking deadfall. i dont know if any clean up has occurred in the glades at all. eden is a fucking mess.
i was considering going back sunday for mount ellen bc the glades tend to be higher and better there (tumbler, exterminator, bravo, and the unmarked woods next to summit chair line). but after hearing good words about stratton woods, i decided to drive 80 min south instead of north, and had one of my best days of the season. then i learn that ellen lifts were fucked all day.
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