Ski Resort Response to COVID-19

[nhskier1969]

I know it is different but I would like to see in terms of other deaths in the united states. I also would like to see excessive deaths for the year. Between Heart disease, cancer, stroke we all know there are some crossover deaths between the above mentioned. So what is the total deaths from Coronavirus? I agree it is bad and the press everyday makes sure we know it. I don't believe that the American people know that over 1.4 million people die each year from underlining health conditions. How much will these go down in 2020. I am sure the press won't tell us? Also if someone has stage 4 cancer and coronavirus then dies, will the death be counted towards the virus or cancer? Are they counting it twice?

 

[drjeff]

I am not sure how everyone else feels about this but when media is showing deaths per week for Coronavirus, what can't they also show daily deaths for heart disease, Cancer and stroke. It would be interesting to show the American public.

Because the simple fact that on average there are about 8800 deaths PER DAY of any and all causes in the US, and that by most accounts that you can find that the overall death rate in the US this year isn't much different, of at all than normal, would take away from some of the narrative that the media and various politicians are pushing on society to in essence force compliance.

For perspective, if one wants to arbitrarily assign March 15th of this year as the start of the COVID related deaths, since then, there have been just under 2.3 MILLION deaths from any and all causes in the US. And there have been just over 270 THOUSAND deaths attributed to COVID 19 in the US. There are no indications that the total number of deaths in the US this year are up over 10%.

Some perspective does matter when looking at the entire picture of this disease. Just looking at the headlines, and not looking at the entire picture, is what leads many to panic and be very fearful, which often leads to one ceding their own freedoms to the Government. There is a vast difference in being a good member of society, and doing things to reduce the risk of transmission to others as well as reducing the risk that one may acquire this disease, a disease which for the vast majority of society won't end up being much more than some flu like symptoms, if at all, and being more of a pawn to the government, the people we elect to work for us, not to control us.

No question that for some, this can be a deadly disease, and that in certain environments, especially when some basic precautions aren't being taken, that it can spread very easily. I don't dispute that at all. The approach and generalized fear inducing headlines that so many are using, and the public just reacting and not thinking rationally about the entire picture, is very concerning on far different levels

 

[Smellytele]

I know it is different but I would like to see in terms of other deaths in the united states. I also would like to see excessive deaths for the year. Between Heart disease, cancer, stroke we all know there are some crossover deaths between the above mentioned. So what is the total deaths from Coronavirus? I agree it is bad and the press everyday makes sure we know it. I don't believe that the American people know that over 1.4 million people die each year from underlining health conditions. How much will these go down in 2020. I am sure the press won't tell us? Also if someone has stage 4 cancer and coronavirus then dies, will the death be counted towards the virus or cancer? Are they counting it twice?

They have lists showing underlying conditions in association with covid

 

[abc]

I know it is different but I would like to see in terms of other deaths in the united states. I also would like to see excessive deaths for the year. Between Heart disease, cancer, stroke we all know there are some crossover deaths between the above mentioned. So what is the total deaths from Coronavirus? I agree it is bad and the press everyday makes sure we know it. I don't believe that the American people know that over 1.4 million people die each year from underlining health conditions. How much will these go down in 2020. I am sure the press won't tell us? Also if someone has stage 4 cancer and coronavirus then dies, will the death be counted towards the virus or cancer? Are they counting it twice?

What's difficult to quantify, is what the death number would be WITHOUT social distancing.

We've entered lockdown in mid-March. For about a month, people were dying in NYC and bodies were stored in refrigerator trucks. There's a very practical reason for that. Funeral homes can't process the body fast enough!

Then the death rate came down dramatically after we lockdown for 2 months. Now, it's more like a "bad flu", all summer long.

What will happen if we remove all the social distancing? Who wants to be the Guinea Pig? (when I said "who", I mean which state governor).

Reality being, we ARE Guinea Pigs after all. The science aren't well known, NOT YET. The disease is still too new for all the questions to be answered. So during this time, each state is playing some sort of social experiment. Easing this or that restriction and trying to balance on a tight rope. The biggest problem with Covid is, when you're off balance, you only fall off 2 weeks later! By then, it's too late!

 

[EPB]

...The science aren't well known, NOT YET. The disease is still too new for all the questions to be answered...

This point is so important. It's really sad how it's been lost in all the noise.

Of course, we can still take basic precautions like distancing and wearing masks to reduce externalities on others. That seems to be the most reasonable way to balance the necessary tradeoff between trying to enjoy our lives and keeping everyone as safe as possible given what we do know.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

Because the simple fact that on average there are about 8800 deaths PER DAY of any and all causes in the US, and that by most accounts that you can find that the overall death rate in the US this year isn't much different, of at all than normal, would take away from some of the narrative that the media and various politicians are pushing on society to in essence force compliance.

For perspective, if one wants to arbitrarily assign March 15th of this year as the start of the COVID related deaths, since then, there have been just under 2.3 MILLION deaths from any and all causes in the US. And there have been just over 270 THOUSAND deaths attributed to COVID 19 in the US. There are no indications that the total number of deaths in the US this year are up over 10%.

Some perspective does matter when looking at the entire picture of this disease. Just looking at the headlines, and not looking at the entire picture, is what leads many to panic and be very fearful, which often leads to one ceding their own freedoms to the Government. There is a vast difference in being a good member of society, and doing things to reduce the risk of transmission to others as well as reducing the risk that one may acquire this disease, a disease which for the vast majority of society won't end up being much more than some flu like symptoms, if at all, and being more of a pawn to the government, the people we elect to work for us, not to control us.

No question that for some, this can be a deadly disease, and that in certain environments, especially when some basic precautions aren't being taken, that it can spread very easily. I don't dispute that at all. The approach and generalized fear inducing headlines that so many are using, and the public just reacting and not thinking rationally about the entire picture, is very concerning on far different levels

anecdotal and speculative at best from me here, and i have zero sense of numbers and how much this could impact a statistic like that - but - what about the assumed decrease in car accidents and other sorts of accidental deaths that happen just as a result of being out in the world. less drivers, less car accidents. less beach trips, less drownings. less shopping malls and concerts, less lone gunman at shopping malls and concerts. etc. just a thought about why the overall number seems steady.

 

[icecoast1]

Then the death rate came down dramatically after we lockdown for 2 months. Now, it's more like a "bad flu", all summer long.

The death rate came down when more people started getting tested including those with only mild symptoms or no symptoms at all. Initially, unless your symptoms were serious enough to require hospitalization, you werent getting tested. People with symptoms were even being told to just stay home early on because the testing capacity wasn't there (and in some areas still isnt) to test everyone

 

[EPB]

because cancer, heart disease, and stroke aren't communicable diseases with unchecked community spread. don't be obtuse. and don't post some bullshit about hpv and cervical cancer. you know its not the same. when i can catch cancer because I've stood too close and too long to another shopper on the grocery line, then they can report cancer deaths on news tickers too.

I took that comment as a ticky-tack way to bait someone on a technicality rather than a serious point, but I could be wrong.

It's probably not your cup of tea, but Irrational Exuberance by behavioral economist Robert Shiller provides some context to the ticker "debate". He basically argues that when big stock market gains or losses get reported widely on the news, the coverage needlessly amplifies those stock market moves. This is because media amplifications cause the lay person and professional investor alike to overreact and make moves in the market to their detriment (i.e. "buying high" or "selling low" which make market highs/lows more extreme as a result). While I totally agree with your assessment on externalities, the death ticker might do more harm to the psyche than good. Of course, it's an uncontrolled experiment, so it's hard to know for sure.

Matt Taibbi (formerly of Rolling Stone) also has a lot of interesting thoughts on how the news industry tries to enhance viewership numbers. My takeaway from listening to/reading him is that the death tickers are there to suck us back in. The news execs know humans are drawn to negative news and the ticker is a signal to bring eyeballs crawling back to the screen. The scary thing is that there seems to be lockstep industry consensus on this reading the tea leaves. Why else would CNN, MSNBC AND Fox News (and more) all use the same tactic? As mentioned previously by someone else, much like the stock market, the lay person (myself included) has a hard time making sense of what to expect death numbers to look like because we lack the base of knowledge to put them into proper context.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

i don't disagree with you on the psychology behind the tickers on the news networks at all.

my only point is deaths attributable to or at least associated with a new novel disease that has up-ended the way we live our lives worldwide is inherently more newsworthy than the common killers that have been common killers since the dawn of time and which are mostly attributable to poor individual personal health practices and decisions as opposed to the ability to catch it from someone else.

 

[1dog]

I know it is different but I would like to see in terms of other deaths in the united states. I also would like to see excessive deaths for the year. Between Heart disease, cancer, stroke we all know there are some crossover deaths between the above mentioned. So what is the total deaths from Coronavirus? I agree it is bad and the press everyday makes sure we know it. I don't believe that the American people know that over 1.4 million people die each year from underlining health conditions. How much will these go down in 2020. I am sure the press won't tell us? Also if someone has stage 4 cancer and coronavirus then dies, will the death be counted towards the virus or cancer? Are they counting it twice?

Don't know if this is factual but any time they take something down, well, flak is heaviest over the target.

All I've read is the 3.1 million deaths from all causes each year. So if this is all true markings of Covid-only caused death, it should be totaled 3.3 or 3.4 million in 2020.

Just keep in mind the same organization than runs these told us no masks in March, said it wasn't a problem in Feb, and now say 7-10 days is sufficient for quarantining ( yesterday that was announced by CDC)

Study: Absolutely NO excess deaths from COVID-19 – Behind The Black – Robert Zimmerman

 

[2Planker]

Exactly,
As time passes we learn and modify our guidelines....

Covid Testing line outside my window is 4+ blacks long this week.
Usually it's 1-2.

This is not going to be good in 2 weeks.
Just in time for the Holidays. - Sad

 

[cdskier]

Exactly,
As time passes we learn and modify our guidelines....

Amazing how science works! (Also amazing how many people use changes as some sort of "proof" that we were lied to or that so and so doesn't know what they're talking about which is not the case at all and is simply how science works as new data is uncovered).

 

[JimG.]

I am not sure how everyone else feels about this but when media is showing deaths per week for Coronavirus, what can't they also show daily deaths for heart disease, Cancer and stroke. It would be interesting to show the American public.

Not to mention flu. Wanna bet that flu numbers are way down this year?

 

[cdskier]

Not to mention flu. Wanna bet that flu numbers are way down this year?

As they in theory should be considering that social distancing, mask wearing, and being more careful about proper sanitizing practices should all contribute to lower spread of flu...

 

[mikec142]

As they in theory should be considering that social distancing, mask wearing, and being more careful about proper sanitizing practices should all contribute to lower spread of flu...

And people's heightened worry about COVID has most likely caused a lot more folks to go get a flu shot. Certainly was the case for my family.

 

[JimG.]

As they in theory should be considering that social distancing, mask wearing, and being more careful about proper sanitizing practices should all contribute to lower spread of flu...

Not to mention the flu deaths reported as COVID.

 

[abc]

As they in theory should be considering that social distancing, mask wearing, and being more careful about proper sanitizing practices should all contribute to lower spread of flu...

Flu should be non-existing if people are following the guide lines!

After all, much of the Covid guild lines were based on flu. So the number of flu is probably just as good an indication of how good/bad people are following the recommended practice.

 

[abc]

Not to mention the flu deaths reported as COVID.

HOW do you perceive flu death be "reported" as Covid death?

 

[Smellytele]

COVID-19 Provisional Counts - Weekly Updates by Select Demographic and Geographic Characteristics

Tabulated data on provisional COVID-19 deaths by age, sex, race and Hispanic origin, and comorbidities. Also includes an index of state-level and county-level mortality data available for download.

www.cdc.gov

 

[JimG.]

HOW do you perceive flu death be "reported" as Covid death?

I perceive nothing. Frankly I would be glad to ignore all of this. But I am being forced to think about it which I try to do as little of as possible.

I have no time for politics or conspiracies. Or alleged "science" from people who have no real idea. But if you are going to tell me that it's impossible to report flu as COVID I've got a nice bridge in Brooklyn for you.