The BIG Question

[billski]

I run into people all the time (including my father in-law) who think this warm weather is simply dandy. My bro-in-law played golf on Dec. 31st. Well, I've decided that rather than continue to repress my innermost agnst, I wanted to let them know that global warming is NOT OK and that some people actually DO enjoy winter. But I want to do in in a classy way.

So this AM, at the dry cleaners, the owner began to gloat over the ~60 degree forecast and how he might get his Harley out. So taking a queue from the politicians, I said, "you know Peter, you and I are going to be on opposite sides of the streets on this one." What I wanted to say, but didn't, is that come retirement time, he and I will undoubtedly not live anywhere near each other. I moved to New England so I could enjoy the mountains in all seasons.
He can move to Florida to get what he enjoys most. We all win. I can see him down in Florida complaining about how hot it is.

We need a new movement. We've had a "save the trees" movement, "save the children", "protect the environment", "peace on earth" movement. But what about poor defenseless snow? It's time for a "Save the Snow" movement.

 

[ctenidae]

We really need to quit the "save the [insert nature related item here" movements, and condense it all to "Save the Humans" because in the end, that's who we're going to kill off. The Earth will do just fine without us (assuming it has all the styrofoam it needs by then)

 

[dmc]

The Earth will do just fine without us (assuming it has all the styrofoam it needs by then)

Sure... When you break it down - the Earth is just a big blue ball floating in space..

"Picture a bright blue ball, just spinning, spinnin free,
Dizzy with eternity.
Paint it with a skin of sky,
Brush in some clouds and sea,
Call it home for you and me.
A peaceful place or so it looks from space,
A closer look reveals the human race.
Full of hope, full of grace
Is the human face,
But afraid we may lay our home to waste.

There's a fear down here we can't forget.
Hasn't got a name just yet.
Always awake, always around,
Singing ashes, ashes, all fall down.
Ashes, ashes, all fall down.


Now watch as the ball revolves
And the nighttime falls.
Again the hunt begins,
Again the bloodwind calls.
By and by, the morning sun will rise,
But the darkness never goes
From some men's eyes.
It strolls the sidewalks and it rolls the streets,
Staking turf, dividing up meat.
Nightmare spook, piece of heat,
It's you and me.
You and me."

John Perry Barlow

 

[Greg]

Please.......not another global warming thread... :roll:

 

[SkiDog]

Please.......not another global warming thread... :roll:

SERIOUSLY... ;-)

M

 

[dmc]

Please.......not another global warming thread... :roll:

Seems to be a big issue these days...

 

[koreshot]

I know what you mean billski, and I go thru the same anger stages too sometimes, but sadly nothing will change. You are not going to convince 90% of the population that sees snow as a nuisance and a pain the butt to change how they live because you want to ski.

Here, in the fattest nation in the world, each year people spend less and less time outdoors, so why should they care about it? Until we, as a society, make the outdoors part of our daily lives, we will continue to spend more money on bailing out airlines and car makers than we will bailing out our land and our air.

 

[Greg]

Seems to be a big issue these days...

Which is silly if it's spurred on because of this abnormally warm winter, no? The East coast ski season's warm weather is a regional thing. Just look at CO.

 

[dmc]

Which is silly if it's spurred on because of this abnormally warm winter, no? The East coast ski season's warm weather is a regional thing. Just look at CO.

...jus' sayin' it seems like a big deal this year...

My opinion as already been dismissed so I'm commenting on the banter thats all...

 

[Greg]

My opinion as already been dismissed so I'm commenting on the banter thats all...

I actually think one of the most recent [POST="128630"]posts[/POST] you made on the subject was pretty well said. There's certainly a bit of irony when the global warming discussion comes up on a skiing forum. Those skiers that are so unequivocally quick to blame manmade CO2 for global warming and/or this crappy ski season might want to ponder the fact that as a skier, they are greatly contributing to the problem. After all, when one purchases a lift ticket or a season pass, they are directly supporting an industry that has no problem clearing large swaths of trees on our pristine mountain ridges, as well as expending tons of energy via the use of snowmaking and chair lift systems, not to mention the amount of fossil fuels they burn on the way to/from their favorite ski areas. Let's just keep it in perspective. Unless you take tangible approaches in day-to-day life to help alleviate this perceived problem, these rants do indeed ring hypocritical to me...

 

[jack97]

Please.......not another global warming thread... :roll:

OK, how about an overpopulation thread. IMO, we have too many people on this planet which has a fix amout of resources. Some of the many concerns from this scenerio is; the increased amount of man made polutants in the atmosphere, how much cheap energy (oil) is left, will there be enuf clean water......

It seems ironic that our advances in medicine and tech have increased the population but has altered Darwin's natural selection process.

 

[hammer]

You are not going to convince 90% of the population that sees snow as a nuisance and a pain the butt to change how they live because you want to ski.

That 90% of the population is welcome to move south if they can't deal with a little snow...

 

[salida]

I actually think one of the most recent [post="128630"]posts[/post] you made on the subject was pretty well said. There's certainly a bit of irony when the global warming discussion comes up on a skiing forum. Those skiers that are so unequivocally quick to blame manmade CO2 for global warming and/or this crappy ski season might want to ponder the fact that as a skier, they are greatly contributing to the problem. After all, when one purchases a lift ticket or a season pass, they are directly supporting an industry that has no problem clearing large swaths of trees on our pristine mountain ridges, as well as expending tons of energy via the use of snowmaking and chair lift systems, not to mention the amount of fossil fuels they burn on the way to/from their favorite ski areas. Let's just keep it in perspective. Unless you take tangible approaches in day-to-day life to help alleviate this perceived problem, these rants do indeed ring hypocritical to me...

Greg, those ski areas that you are talking about are purchasing much (if not 100%) of their energy through wind credits, thus alleviating their carbon foot print. Yes, the common skier is wasting lots of gas to get to the mountains.

 

[dmc]

Unless you take tangible approaches in day-to-day life to help alleviate this perceived problem, these rants do indeed ring hypocritical to me...

Yup - I'm a friggin hypocrite...

 

[Greg]

Greg, those ski areas that you are talking about are purchasing much (if not 100%) of their energy through wind credits, thus alleviating their carbon foot print. Yes, the common skier is wasting lots of gas to get to the mountains.

Wind power has become a great PR tool and in fact you're correct in that some ski areas are now relying on wind power for energy. I very much doubt though that most, and certainly not all, ski areas are now purchasing their power in that way. What's your source for that claim? The bottom line is if you believe manmade CO2 is the cause of the global warming problem than the ski industry has contributed to it in some way, all for your skiing pleasure...

Yup - I'm a friggin hypocrite...

Wasn't meant to be a shot solely at you. Just my opinion...

 

[dmc]

Wasn't meant to be a shot solely at you. Just my opinion...

But it's true... I'm a gronola crunchin' - Grateful Dead listening - wants to save the world kinda guy that drives a car, heats my house and uses chairlifts...

So I can't argue with you types... My opinion is invalidated due to my own hypocracy and I'm OK with that...
But I still believe what I believe and there's nothing you guys(and Karl Rove) can do to take that away from me...

So I continue my conversations with people that are a little more understanding about my hypocracy and why I need to do what I do...

 

[salida]

But it's true... I'm a gronola crunchin' - Grateful Dead listening - wants to save the world kinda guy that drives a car, heats my house and uses chairlifts...

So I can't argue with you types... My opinion is invalidated due to my own hypocracy and I'm OK with that...
But I still believe what I believe and there's nothing you guys(and Karl Rove) can do to take that away from me...

So I continue my conversations with people that are a little more understanding about my hypocracy and why I need to do what I do...

I'm in much the same boat... minus the dead heads...

 

[dmc]

I'm in much the same boat... minus the dead heads...

Yup... Gotta stay quiet and watch...

Or talk with other self-recognized hypocrites...

 

[koreshot]

After all, when one purchases a lift ticket or a season pass, they are directly supporting an industry that has no problem clearing large swaths of trees on our pristine mountain ridges, as well as expending tons of energy via the use of snowmaking and chair lift systems, not to mention the amount of fossil fuels they burn on the way to/from their favorite ski areas. Let's just keep it in perspective. Unless you take tangible approaches in day-to-day life to help alleviate this perceived problem, these rants do indeed ring hypocritical to me...

I agree. I am a hypocrite, because I sometimes rant about environment, yet I regularly race my car on the weekends in the summer. To some degree, everyone is a hypocrite when it comes to this topic. But we have to be careful not to use it as an excuse to not change ourselves. An example of this would be a meat eating person (me) telling my friend who is vegan that she is a hypocrite because she doesn't eat meat but wears leather sometimes. Well, at least she doesn't eat meat. I can call her a hypocrite all I want but the bottom line is, she is a "hypocryte" that kills 1/10 of the animals that I do.

Most environmentalists, and many people that have posted rants in this forum, are not perfect and to some degree contribute to the "global warming problem" (if it really is real - different discussion) by driving to the resorts, by paying for lift tickets and eating red meet for dinner when they are done. But at least they are doing something (assumption)!

Like I said, I like to race my car, which is horrible for the earth, but at least I bought a car with a 1.6 liter engine when i could have easily afforded a car with more power, I drive it extremely conservatively on the road (65mph usually), regularly getting 34mpg. I pay a markup on the energy bill to get all my electricity from a wind mill farm in Atlantic City. I am a hypocrite, but at least I am a hypocrite that has made SOME sacrifices (monetary and/or lifestyle) to help the environment. Unfortunately, the majority of the people in this country have not made ANY sacrifices. They can turn around and call me a hypocrite for racing my car (and to some extent they will be right to do so), but at the end of the day, over 200,000 miles driven I will have burnt 1/2 as much gas as they have with their Explorer.

I guess what I am saying, do what you can/afford to, but do something...

 

[Greg]

I agree. I am a hypocrite, because I sometimes rant about environment, yet I regularly race my car on the weekends in the summer. To some degree, everyone is a hypocrite when it comes to this topic. But we have to be careful not to use it as an excuse to not change ourselves. An example of this would be a meat eating person (me) telling my friend who is vegan that she is a hypocrite because she doesn't eat meat but wears leather sometimes. Well, at least she doesn't eat meat. I can call her a hypocrite all I want but the bottom line is, she is a "hypocryte" that kills 1/10 of the animals that I do.

Most environmentalists, and many people that have posted rants in this forum, are not perfect and to some degree contribute to the "global warming problem" (if it really is real - different discussion) by driving to the resorts, by paying for lift tickets and eating red meet for dinner when they are done. But at least they are doing something (assumption)!

Like I said, I like to race my car, which is horrible for the earth, but at least I bought a car with a 1.6 liter engine when i could have easily afforded a car with more power, I drive it extremely conservatively on the road (65mph usually), regularly getting 34mpg. I pay a markup on the energy bill to get all my electricity from a wind mill farm in Atlantic City. I am a hypocrite, but at least I am a hypocrite that has made SOME sacrifices (monetary and/or lifestyle) to help the environment. Unfortunately, the majority of the people in this country have not made ANY sacrifices. They can turn around and call me a hypocrite for racing my car (and to some extent they will be right to do so), but at the end of the day, over 200,000 miles driven I will have burnt 1/2 as much gas as they have with their Explorer.

I guess what I am saying, do what you can/afford to, but do something...

You do make some valid points. Not always black and white, I guess. Carry on, folks.