This is going to get us coming and going

[Edd]

I hear theories sometimes about a future WWII level shift to our economy, in which we mobilize to build stuff less harmful to the environment. Careers would be abandoned. Massive sacrifice for the common good. Nobody gets away unscathed.

Sounds ridiculous comfortably sitting on my couch typing on my iPad but these things happen. It sounds about as plausible as ISIS coming to get me because they hate my Western ways.

 

[jack97]

In all fairness, you should also mention the idiots and morons conservative extremists who believe in wild capitalism, faith-based science and think that women should stay home and have kids.

Point about the BBC vid was to educate kids especially girls that having more children restricts the choices they have with their lives.

No one wants to meet in the middle on any topic nowadays (except when it comes to bombing muslims).

IMO, some of the alarmist have or are taking IS approaches.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2012...death_penalty_for_climate_change_deniers.html

 

[BenedictGomez]

That is one of the worst graphs I have ever seen and pretty much useless.

LOL. Hold that thought. I'll create a graph showing the explosion of internet usage during the last 20 years, and my 'X' axis will start in the Precambrian era. Boom! Winner!

If that was a Stock Market chart the voices would be screaming unsustainable.

The stock market (currently) is unsustainable.

Sounds ridiculous comfortably sitting on my couch typing on my iPad but these things happen. It sounds about as plausible as ISIS coming to get me because they hate my Western ways.

Wait, what? Given ISIS claims one of their goals (literally) is to state terrorist attacks in America, I'm not exactly sure why you wouldn't believe them, let along claim it's implausible.

 

[Tin]

The problem right now is no one wants to meet in the middle on these matters.

Ding, ding, ding...best post in this thread.

 

[fbrissette]

LOL. Hold that thought. I'll create a graph showing the explosion of internet usage during the last 20 years, and my 'X' axis will start in the Precambrian era. Boom! Winner!

Gee, you guys are a tough crowd. How about this one ? if you take a small enough slice, it will hide the exponential growth and shows it to be linear.

Does it make you feel any better ? Using both graphs, we nevertheless arrive at the same inescapable conclusion which is that at least 3.5 billions more people will inhabit the earth 30 years from now (it took 4.5 billions years to get the population up to 3.5 billions - circa 1965).

 

[fbrissette]

Ding, ding, ding...best post in this thread.

Yep. That is the sad truth.

 

[Tin]

LOL. Hold that thought. I'll create a graph showing the explosion of internet usage during the last 20 years, and my 'X' axis will start in the Precambrian era. Boom! Winner!



The stock market (currently) is unsustainable.



Wait, what? Given ISIS claims one of their goals (literally) is to state terrorist attacks in America, I'm not exactly sure why you wouldn't believe them, let along claim it's implausible.

Do you wear a tin foil helmet?

 

[mister moose]

While I don't entirely disagree with the above, it is only fair to mention that the motive behind the 'pro-development' and 'climate change-denying' machine is also $$$$$$. There are actually very very few decision makers that are really concerned with the welfare of middle-class families.

The basis of all environmental problems on earth is pretty much the same - we are too many, and we consume too much. Climate change is only part of this mess.

I actually agree with all this, but from a different vantage point. Yes, there is $$ behind each agenda. However, is it better to have $$ flow to people who manufacture the goods we need every day, or to the people who in the name of "doing something good" are actually lining their own pockets? I drive a smaller, older, cheaper car than I can afford. Why can't Al Gore do the same thing?

I agree that middle class families are not on the mind of most decision makers (at the national level, or at the boardroom level) At the national level, they should be concerned with trade policy, defense, immigration. These important functions protect everyone, and are not the domain of any class, middle or otherwise. Why Washington has a bloated education department is beyond me. Their solutions have not been effective. Return control, funding and standards to a more local level. If the bottom 10% of the school districts need federal help, so be it, but get out of the top 90%. But I digress.

There are 2 ways to help anyone advance in life. More education, (which includes on the job training) and unfettered access to the marketplace and workplace. Tell me this: Why do we have a system where Joe works 40 hours a week for $10 an hour, and pays X in taxes. Bob works 2 jobs, and works 80 hours for the same $10/hr, so why should his share of the tax burden be 2X? Why isn't Bob and Joe's tax burden equal? And to make it worse, Bob pays MORE than 2X, Bob pays 2X plus 20% because he gets thrust into a higher tax bracket than Joe. Does this make any sense to anyone here? You actually have a built in disincentive to work harder.

I hear theories sometimes about a future WWII level shift to our economy, in which we mobilize to build stuff less harmful to the environment. Careers would be abandoned. Massive sacrifice for the common good. Nobody gets away unscathed.

Sounds ridiculous comfortably sitting on my couch typing on my iPad but these things happen. It sounds about as plausible as ISIS coming to get me because they hate my Western ways.

The very fact that you write this sitting on your couch instead of working illustrates why your socialist "massive sacrifice" wouldn't work. No one works as hard for the community as they do for themselves. This is not the same as generosity. Generosity is giving part of what you make. How hard you work is not generosity. And I am not motivated to work 50 hours so you only have to work 35. I'm not, and you're not. And when I start working only 35 hours, I produce less. I invent less. I lose drive. I stop dreaming and striving to excell. That will never change, and trying to base a societal structure based on 'common good' will never work. Never.

In all fairness, you should also mention the idiots and morons conservative extremists who believe in wild capitalism, faith-based science and think that women should stay home and have kids.

Wild capitalism is what got us here. Don't be so quick to dismiss it. Feel free to live in non capitalistic countries. Cuba is just a short hop from here. (I wonder what the immigration rate is there....)

Faith based science is the right of those who choose to believe it. You calling them morons identifies you as the extremist.

Women should stay home and have kids, if they want to have kids.

 

[fbrissette]

Wild capitalism is what got us here. Don't be so quick to dismiss it. Feel free to live in non capitalistic countries. Cuba is just a short hop from here. (I wonder what the immigration rate is there....)

The world is not black and white. There is a lot of middle ground between unbridled capitalism and pure socialism.

Faith based science is the right of those who choose to believe it. You calling them morons identifies you as the extremist.

I have no problem with faith. 'Faith-based science' however is an oxymoron. Trying to impose faith-based science (as is currently being done in several states by US extremists) puts you on the same side of the fence with those nice folks from ISIS.

My use of 'morons' was in jest to a previous post about the 'liberal morons'. Sorry if you could not see that.

Women should stay home and have kids, if they want to have kids.

Men should stop telling women what they should do.

 

[mister moose]

The world is not black and white. There is a lot of middle ground between unbridled capitalism and pure socialism.

There is no middle ground between "yours" and "ours".

I have no problem with faith. 'Faith-based science' however is an oxymoron. Trying to impose faith-based science (as is currently being done in several states by US extremists) puts you on the same side of the fence with those nice folks from ISIS.

My use of 'morons' was in jest to a previous post about the 'liberal morons'. Sorry if you could not see that.

I never advocated imposing one set of beliefs upon another. Sorry I missed your humor. It's a long thread.

Men should stop telling women what they should do.

Agreed. But not what you said at first.

 

[Edd]

Wait, what? Given ISIS claims one of their goals (literally) is to state terrorist attacks in America, I'm not exactly sure why you wouldn't believe them, let along claim it's implausible.

Yes, that is one of their loudly stated goals. They've become a scary brand overnight. Free, unlimited PR courtesy of our actual-news starved media. Defense contractors across the globe must be toasting ISIS nightly as their stocks go through the roof.

I simply doubted that they're coming to get ME. On my list of daily worries I am not finding ISIS.

 

[Newpylong]

The reason I asked is down in PA the deregulated electric providers a couple years back. The information spreading like wildfire stated rates are going to skyrocket. However, that never happened and rates stayed pretty low. In addition, you typically locked in with a provider for a 2 year period, at a set rate.

Totally. Up here, it hasn't traditionally made sense to shop the supply because none of them actually make power, it all comes from the same place. So you're locking into a plan that could bite you in the a$$, or it could work out. It's not a given like when I contract 1500 gallons of Propane from Irving every summer for like $1.90/gallon vs paying over $3/retail every fill.

These people can't have their cake and eat it too. There needs to be a balance between environmental protection and common sense, and I feel the trend has been moving away from common sense.

 

[Puck it]

Since when do we have unbridled capitalism? Government sets rates on power, insurance. They are now involved in healthcare.


I forgot since I am fiscal conservative and morally liberal. I am classifed as a moron.

 

[BenedictGomez]

we nevertheless arrive at the same inescapable conclusion which is that at least 3.5 billions more people will inhabit the earth 30 years from now (it took 4.5 billions years to get the population up to 3.5 billions - circa 1965).

You think we're going to get there? I don't. There's always some unforeseen disease, wars, etc..., not to mention birth rates are already declining. I'm not so sure.

The very fact that you write this sitting on your couch instead of working illustrates why your socialist "massive sacrifice" wouldn't work. No one works as hard for the community as they do for themselves. This is not the same as generosity. Generosity is giving part of what you make. How hard you work is not generosity. And I am not motivated to work 50 hours so you only have to work 35. I'm not, and you're not. And when I start working only 35 hours, I produce less. I invent less. I lose drive. I stop dreaming and striving to excell. That will never change, and trying to base a societal structure based on 'common good' will never work. Never.

Well said; though all common sense. Sadly, the Socialist desire of imposing one's will on others in the name of "fairness" or "common good" is a powerful idea to some, especially for those who frankly aren't financially savvy.

Yes, that is one of their loudly stated goals. They've become a scary brand overnight. Free, unlimited PR courtesy of our actual-news starved media. Defense contractors across the globe must be toasting ISIS nightly as their stocks go through the roof.

I somehow doubt the thousands of Atheists, Christians, and not-correct-brand of Muslims that they've murdered for not converting to Islam, or the women being forced into sexual slavery, or the children being handed AK-74 rifles and told to fight, feel their "scariness" is quite as phoney as you do.

Since when do we have unbridled capitalism? Government sets rates on power, insurance. They are now involved in healthcare.

Never in our history.

 

[Puck it]

Never in our history.

It was tongue in cheek.

 

[ss20]

 

[bobbutts]

Since when do we have unbridled capitalism? Government sets rates on power, insurance. They are now involved in healthcare.


I forgot since I am fiscal conservative and morally liberal. I am classifed as a moron.

I think you have it backwards. The energy, insurance, and health care industries are involved in government, legislating themselves monopoly power and lax regulations.

Folks should read Inside the Koch Brothers' Toxic Empire from this month's Rolling Stone Magazine.
This is your "conservative" GOP.

 

[Edd]

I somehow doubt the thousands of Atheists, Christians, and not-correct-brand of Muslims that they've murdered for not converting to Islam, or the women being forced into sexual slavery, or the children being handed AK-74 rifles and told to fight, feel their "scariness" is quite as phoney as you do.

No, I don't imagine they do. I won't be booking flights over there. I'm not sure what sets them apart from the countless horrible terrorists and tyrants that have come before and we ignore but there's something special here.

 

[Smellytele]

I think you have it backwards. The energy, insurance, and health care industries are involved in government, legislating themselves monopoly power and lax regulations.

Folks should read Inside the Koch Brothers' Toxic Empire from this month's Rolling Stone Magazine.
This is your "conservative" GOP.

Might as well read "Liberal Magazine for liberals". And no I am not a GOP member. I have a hard time getting information from RS or Fox and taking it seriously.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I'm not sure what sets them apart from the countless horrible terrorists and tyrants that have come before and we ignore but there's something special here.

That's painfully obvious.