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VAIL SUCKS
- Thread starter thebigo
- Start date
drjeff
Well-known member
That only 2 groomer operator thing shocked me when I was at Attitash a few weeks ago and happened to ride up a chair with a Dad of of kid on the race team there who has one of the places between the 2 base areas and we got talking about Vail operations. He told me the 2 groomer operators couldn't cover all the terrain daily that the mountain wished they could, so that created plenty of issues, especially for the race team, as they often had to "fight" with mountain ops to get race and training hills groomed regularly.Attitash
Good for you guys
meanwhile in the MWV we get Food & Bev Managers who know nothing about the Mt. Operations.
Heard they just lost 50% of their groomers. That would be 1 person
The only 2 groomer operator thing was really put into perspective as I was skiing from the Bear Peak side over to the main side and went past the mountain ops facilities, where there were 2 winchcats and probably 4 to 6 non winchcats parked there, which is likely a realistic sign of how many cats they need to work the terrain they want to on a daily basis.
Hopefully next season for the sake of the mountain and it's loyal regulars, they can have operators in all of those cats on a nightly basis!
RichT
Active member
Hope Hunter gets a new GM
NYDB
Well-known member
Fifydrjeff is a vail mole.
Total fucking lack of caring. aka Vail Fail
I think tiny Black Mt (NH) has more groomers and more groomer operators than both WC & AT combined.
3 of the non working AT groomers were SR "hand me downs" that Les loaned to AT in the 90's.
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Edd
Well-known member
Cranmore was fantastic spring skiing today. Hope that event happens soon, though, the snow won’t last.
FBGM
Well-known member
For what it’s worth Brian was my boss for 7+ years and the best boss and best person in general I’ve ever met in the ski industry.
With that being said, I’m shocked he’s going to Mt Snow. The place is a dump and was a cluster for years under Peak. I’m sure it’s better under Vail but still.
drjeff
Well-known member
Your praises for him FBGM certainly are noted and grabbed my attention for sure in a good and optimistic way.
My home mountain certainly needs some more attention in the coming decade (realistically there could be 5 to maybe 8) lifts that very well may reach the end of the economically viable functional lifespan and need replacement (likely going to be a thing for many ski resorts as all of the lifts built in the 80's expansion boom will be approaching the 50 season mark), going to likely need to do some major work and or new construction of 1 to 2 base lodges and the Summit Lodge, and likely work to figure out an improved and expanded parking situation. However the place also has an up to date snowmaking system with an ample water supply, a new mtn ops facility, a base lodge that is only a few seasons old, a fair amount of on site employee housing, and a strong annual visitor draw.
Peak definitely had some things they focused on and spent some money on those things. They also had other things where it's easier to see now in retrospect how they seemingly kept pushing aside often with the "well maybe we'll get to that in the next capital improvement cycle...." mentality and kept pushing that down the road without ever really addressing it.
In general though I can say that Peak left the place in better shape than ASC did for sure, and I am hopeful based on some of what I have seen the last few years under Vail that they will continue to address and actually fix the deficiencies in some areas that they acquired
catskillman
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2009
- Messages
- 1,214
- Points
- 48
sounds like they have. Brian Foley. Check on the Hunter Facebook page for his video !! and then meet him at the "Oasis" or "his trailer down by the creek".
So I am on Maui time, but as to the news about Vail going to $20 per hour, two comments: (1) as to NH areas, believe it when I see it; (2) as to it improving the problems that have plagued NH areas, I am going to wait and see. Pay was only part of the problem. Throwing money at these areas to increase pay does not resolve the other issues we have been hearing.
elks
Member
This has already been communicated to current NH employees. With this second raise since Vail took over, our pay has increased 150% compared to Peaks. Not too many employees complaining about that.
jimmywilson69
Well-known member
So let me ask you this. From an insiders perspective, why did they have such a hard time retaining or hiring at Attitash and Wildcat if the wages are so much better.
Not trying to be a jerk, I'm just trying to understand if the pay is so much better what the catalyst is for the poor retention/hiring of staff to properly run the mountain.
Not trying to be a jerk, I'm just trying to understand if the pay is so much better what the catalyst is for the poor retention/hiring of staff to properly run the mountain.
elks
Member
I can only speak from what I saw in our department, but I imagine it was the same at other Vail resorts. The non-returning ski instructors were put off by the vaccine mandate implemented by Vail. It had nothing to do with the pay, which increased significantly at the beginning of the 2021-2022 season. Vail employee perks and benefits are also much more generous than Peaks ever were. I haven't seen this be a source of controversy in the locker room.
KustyTheKlown
Well-known member
lol. sure. it was the vaccines.
FBGM
Well-known member
If I had to guess part of it is the pay is still not as high as other companies or job openings in area. Also people/employees are just fed up with Vail. Sure you can make more money but it’s still not the best company to work for.
Vaccine mandates might play a small part.
Also the work force in general is smaller now then before pandemic. That 55-65 year old workforce is smaller.l with people just retiring early via pandemic. Small percentage maybe but still less people.
$20/hr in some of these rural areas should help. That should be more then other companies. Should help draw in employees
elks
Member
There's never been real money in ski school instruction at our resort and I don't know any adult instructor at our ski school that does it for the money. Some of the high-school and college instructors are more tuned in to what they get paid and may look more closely at the hourly rate, but that's the only segment that may make that calculus in my experience.
As to "it’s still not the best company to work for," I can unequivocally say that working for Vail is a LOT better than working for Peaks. They provide so much more to their seasonal employees beyond better pay. Not even close.
There is a lot that goes into hating vail and the employees feel it too. Last year was actually run better then this year at atticat. When u have to wait over a half hour in line to buy a ticket you are already pissed off, the ticket sellers feel it. When you have to wait in over a half hour line and their are multiple lifts not running people are pissed and the ticket checkers and liftees feel it. At attitash when you wait in line to get your vaccine card checked to buy food but then you are crammed in with tons of people who don’t have to be checked the food service workers feel it. At wildcat when you just want to warm up with your kids and you have to find the photo on your phone or go back to your car to find your vax card the cafeteria workers feel it. Or you can work at anywhere else for more money and your not getting yelled at constantly. Plus you don’t get bossed around with what you have to do with your body.
Lifts are constantly broken at atticat, parking lots full on weekends. It has really sucked this year. The pay raise is good but the problems run a lot deeper. The vibe has been completely ruined this year especially at at wildcat. No fucking bar on weekdays, no table service. I skied at Burke recently the mountain is similiar to wildcat. Great vibe, fully staffed, nice bar, warm with music blasting. The vibe in Walmart is better then atticat and it’s a shame.
Lifts are constantly broken at atticat, parking lots full on weekends. It has really sucked this year. The pay raise is good but the problems run a lot deeper. The vibe has been completely ruined this year especially at at wildcat. No fucking bar on weekdays, no table service. I skied at Burke recently the mountain is similiar to wildcat. Great vibe, fully staffed, nice bar, warm with music blasting. The vibe in Walmart is better then atticat and it’s a shame.
My time working for the company was mostly good for 4 seasons and a couple summers as I had an excellent team that I worked with that appreciated my work and made an honest effort to retain me. Eventually they got replaced or moved on. At that point I was not willing to move up as it was a shit deal all around and from what I can see the higher you move up the worse the pay vs work/expectation got.
That's a major problem they need to fix vs placing some delusional manager that happens to have some company knowledge...doesn't mean shit if you don't know how to manage people.
I've worked for a few resorts over the years. The closest comparison would be asc. Their pay was better but overall I liked my time at vail better
