VAIL SUCKS

[jimmywilson69]

There's literally no reason for a high speed lift at JF. If they just ran all of the lifts the line problems wouldn't be as bad.

 

[machski]

There's literally no reason for a high speed lift at JF. If they just ran all of the lifts the line problems wouldn't be as bad.

True, there are plenty of areas where High Speed lifts are just overkill or put in to be flashy. 4000' line lengths and shorter really do not justify the higher install and the double + operational expense of a detach in most cases IMHO . Now, larger high revenue resorts that can afford them make some sense, especially in novice alignments and high traffic areas. Otherwise, 9 minute or less rid times aren't ridiculous.

 

[ss20]

Ok, this makes almost no sense. Just because a FGC has more chairs, doesn't mean it reduces lines. They also run at least than half the speed of detaches (often FGC are not run at their full operating speeds to make loading easier. So a FGQ will potentially run at 1/4 the speed of new, modern D-Line equipment). The FG slow speeds negate any line eating capacity over detaches given their slow speeds. They usually don't have lines if they are near detaches as folks vastly prefer riding detach chairs.

Detaches rarely run at full speed either. Both HSQ's and FGQ's usually have the same name-plate capacity of 2000-2400pph and the same chair loading interval. But my argument is not hourly capacity or guest preference- look at it through the lense of CCC. Let's say your resort has one chairlift and a couple trails. With a FGQ that has 100 chairs you can have 200 people riding the lift. Let's assume for simplicity that your trail capacity is also 200 people, and a comfortable lift line is also 200 people. If you build a HSQ now you have 50 chairs and you can only have 100 people riding the lift. Your trail capacity is still 200 and a comfortable lift line is also still 200 so you're going to exceed your CCC on one of those fronts if you still have 600 visitors.

Essentially it's the familiar paradox of long wait time for a short lift ride or short wait time for a long lift ride. In Vails case where the lifts lines were a key issue this season, running the backup lifts that are fixed grip would be an efficient way of reducing lift lines because you'd at least have people sitting on chairs rather than standing in line.

 

[gittist]

There's literally no reason for a high speed lift at JF. If they just ran all of the lifts the line problems wouldn't be as bad.

Or if they sped up the ones they run Monday to Thursday; I don't do weekends. My butt gets worn out long before my 64 year old legs do b/c the damn lifts are so bloody slow. I spend more time on the lift than I do skiing.

 

[jimmywilson69]

That's PA skiing for you. 5 or more minutes up and 1 minute down.

The lifts are old and slow there...

 

[drjeff]

The lower loading speeds of a highspeed lift does actually help some lower level skiers and riders with loading and unloading and instructors with lower level groups as well as younger kids often find loading a highspeed easier than a fixed grip chair,

Sometimes one of the benefits of a highspeed lift has nothing to do with the travel time from base terminal to summit terminal, but has something to do with ease of some guests getting on/off a lift

 

[machski]

Detaches rarely run at full speed either. Both HSQ's and FGQ's usually have the same name-plate capacity of 2000-2400pph and the same chair loading interval. But my argument is not hourly capacity or guest preference- look at it through the lense of CCC. Let's say your resort has one chairlift and a couple trails. With a FGQ that has 100 chairs you can have 200 people riding the lift. Let's assume for simplicity that your trail capacity is also 200 people, and a comfortable lift line is also 200 people. If you build a HSQ now you have 50 chairs and you can only have 100 people riding the lift. Your trail capacity is still 200 and a comfortable lift line is also still 200 so you're going to exceed your CCC on one of those fronts if you still have 600 visitors.

Essentially it's the familiar paradox of long wait time for a short lift ride or short wait time for a long lift ride. In Vails case where the lifts lines were a key issue this season, running the backup lifts that are fixed grip would be an efficient way of reducing lift lines because you'd at least have people sitting on chairs rather than standing in line.

If your name is the Quicksilver 6 at Breck, then yes that rarely runs at full speed. Most other High Speed lifts do actually run regularly at their planned full rated speed (granted the lift could be rated a bit faster, but most are run at 1000 FPM although many are rated at 1100 FPM. The newer D-Line from Dopp are rated at 1200 FPM and most of those are actually run at that). I get the extra folks hanging on the chair instead of on the trail. That is fine at smaller resorts, but you are not going to string up FG lifts at larger resorts on longer lines just to hang more folks on the chairs vs trails.

 

[Harvey]

Former Vail Resorts CEO Rob Katz Addresses Overcrowding and Takes Responsibility for Staffing Shortages - SnowBrains

The Storm Skiing Journal and Podcast has been given a recording of former Vail Resorts CEO Rob Katz's acceptance speech at the NSAA awards

snowbrains.com

Katz is a smart man, and he is conflating some things on purpose. Cheaper passes don't mean that skiing is cheaper, or more accessible or bringing in new skiers.

You're a capitalist dude, it's no crime, own it.

To his credit he does take responsibility for the degraded experience this year.

 

[jimmywilson69]

sure he takes responsibility for it, but then tries to deflect it by saying its not really that bad and its not bad that more people are skiing. I agree with the later, but there needs to be some control on how to handle the experience and not make getting to the mountain and riding lifts such a shit show.

 

[gittist]

That's PA skiing for you. 5 or more minutes up and 1 minute down.

The lifts are old and slow there...

More like 15 minutes up and 90 seconds down, maybe two minutes if I stop to blow my nose

 

[drjeff]

The old towers and cross arms from the Sundance and Sunbrook lifts were flown out today at Mount Snow.

A little communication about this event that some would likely have liked to see in person from a safe distance, would of been nice...

 

[jimmywilson69]

They probably fired the communications person or they quit. 50/50 chance, flip a coin.

Actually the dude who runs the social media in the East actually lives near me, so he probably doesn't even know it was happening.

 

[machski]

The old towers and cross arms from the Sundance and Sunbrook lifts were flown out today at Mount Snow.

A little communication about this event that some would likely have liked to see in person from a safe distance, would of been nice...

Most resorts do not announce helicopter fly dates ahead of time just to keep the public away. Say it with me, Liability.......

 

[eatskisleep]

After Rough Winter, Wildcat Mountain Focusing on Maintenance Projects

Wildcat Mountain in New Hampshire was probably one of the worst run Vail Resorts properties last season. They blew an insufficient amount of snow

unofficialnetworks.com

 

[FBGM]

The old towers and cross arms from the Sundance and Sunbrook lifts were flown out today at Mount Snow.

A little communication about this event that some would likely have liked to see in person from a safe distance, would of been nice...

Vail does not want to flaunt construction news. The Powder/Peak/smaller other companies love to have pics and info on that. Vail does not. I was told I could not post any construction related pics during my time at Vail. Their reason was if OSHA saw something….

 

[thebigo]

After Rough Winter, Wildcat Mountain Focusing on Maintenance Projects

Wildcat Mountain in New Hampshire was probably one of the worst run Vail Resorts properties last season. They blew an insufficient amount of snow

unofficialnetworks.com

Dumbass does not know the difference between a quad and a triple. Just when you think they cannot possibly suck more, they zoom in on the tomcat while talking about running the wildcat express.

 

[2Planker]

Dumbass does not know the difference between a quad and a triple. Just when you think they cannot possibly suck more, they zoom in on the tomcat while talking about running the wildcat express.

This summer will really start to show the damage Vail has done to the MWV. Both WC and AT used to do descent summer biz. But now, they are ghost towns

 

[drjeff]

Just announced on their social media feeds, next Summer, the Summit triple at Attitash will be replaced with a HSQ (permit approval pending).

A little less sucking by Vail in their NH portfolio

 

[RH29]

Just announced on their social media feeds, next Summer, the Summit triple at Attitash will be replaced with a HSQ (permit approval pending).

A little less sucking by Vail in their NH portfolio

Very happy to hear this news. I imagine it'll be similar capacity to the Summit Triple, but at least the 15+ minute ride will be gone.

 

[bigbob]

Just announced on their social media feeds, next Summer, the Summit triple at Attitash will be replaced with a HSQ (permit approval pending).

A little less sucking by Vail in their NH portfolio

Regarding calendar year 2023 capital expenditures, Lynch said, “We remain committed to consistently reinvesting in the guest experience. In addition to this year’s significant capacity expanding investments, planning is already underway for our calendar year 2023 capital plan, and we are pleased to announce the first projects from that plan, with additional calendar year 2023 investments and upgrades to be announced in the coming quarters. At Breckenridge, we plan to upgrade the Peak 8 base area to enhance the beginner and children’s experience and increase uphill capacity from this popular base area. The investment plan will include a new four-person high speed 5-Chair to replace the existing two-person fixed-grip lift and will include significant improvements, including new teaching terrain and a transport carpet from the base, to make the beginner experience more accessible. At Stevens Pass, we are planning to replace the two-person fixed-grip Kehr’s Chair lift with a new four-person high speed lift, which will improve out-of-base capacity and guest experience. At Attitash, we plan to replace the three-person fixed-grip Summit Triple lift with a new four-person high speed lift, increasing uphill capacity and reducing guests’ time on the longest lift at the resort. These lift projects are subject to regulatory approvals and are currently expected to be completed in time for the 2023/2024 North American winter season.”