VAIL SUCKS

[thetrailboss]

The state's report is shocking. Vail Exec comes up with 4 different reasons he doesn't want to follow manufacturer requirement to replace lanyards annually. $26 lanyards are not replaced for years. Lanyard fails and sends poor employee to the ground at 80 miles an hour. No documented training or inspections of said equipment.

The guy in Broomfield literally accused the zip line company of trying to pump up Petzl's gear sales. And he's still there.

https://webpubcontent.gray.tv/wcax/docs/VOSHA%20Case%20No.%201570437%20Right%20Side_Redacted.pdf

Enhancing the guest experience at the cost of the employee!

"It's a war, son. We lose Stormtroopers everyday!"

 

[cdskier]

So the decedent was an employee, so that’s workers comp. But I imagine that the family will try to sue Petzl because of product defect.

What are the chances of successful lawsuit against Petzl for product defect? If they outline a particular replacement interval and someone doesn't follow that and it fails after that time, that doesn't really seem like a product defect to me.

Who thinks that there are going to be some killer deals this summer on the Stowe Zip Line?

Am I right folks?

Not really sure this is a topic to be making jokes about...

And on a serious note, Stowe's not running the zip line this summer (and it is unclear if they ever plan to re-open it).

 

[machski]

Well they rolled the dice. If they had to replace 1000 At this moment it would have only saved them $1000 as the fine was only 27k. Obviously they still will get sued but the insurance will cover that.

Probably not given this finding they did not follow equipment manufacturer guidance. Vail will be paying out of pocket most likely for any lawsuits.

 

[thetrailboss]

So this gives some additional context:

State finds Vail Resorts’ failure to replace equipment contributed to Stowe zipline employee’s death

“Mr. Lewis would not have been killed if the primary attachment lanyard had been replaced due to aging and (wear) of the lanyard,” a report by the Vermont Occupational Safety and Health Administration concludes.

vtdigger.org

Apparently the issue is that the vendor/company that built the zip line and provided the equipment told Vail to replace these lanyards annually. Apparently, Petzl has a different standard and different replacement schedule:

“The term heavy use is undefinable,” Barrow replied. “We are not willing to accept your change to another company’s retirement criteria without a clear safety alert or service bulletin per ASTM We will continue to follow the Petzl retirement data that is clear and definitive.” (ATSM was formerly known as American Society for Testing and Materials.)

It also sounds like Vail may have stopped "inspections" by Terra Nova after 2019 or so.

 

[jimmywilson69]

So a few weeks ago someone posted on hear saying they were affiliated with the deceased and that members of his family read this forum, I think we should dial back the jokes and bad taste comments. I know they are aimed at Vail, but someone unnecessarily lost their life.

I might just be better to move on.. and hate on them for fucking up skiing.

 

[cdskier]

So this gives some additional context:

State finds Vail Resorts’ failure to replace equipment contributed to Stowe zipline employee’s death

“Mr. Lewis would not have been killed if the primary attachment lanyard had been replaced due to aging and (wear) of the lanyard,” a report by the Vermont Occupational Safety and Health Administration concludes.

vtdigger.org

Apparently the issue is that the vendor/company that built the zip line and provided the equipment told Vail to replace these lanyards annually. Apparently, Petzl has a different standard and different replacement schedule:



It also sounds like Vail may have stopped "inspections" by Terra Nova after 2019 or so.

I'm still smelling a lawsuit by the family against Terra Nova and Petzl. In doing so, Vail will be dragged in.

In reading the VOSHA report itself, one of the documents referenced is Petzl's own PPE inspection form for the lanyard. That form specifically lays out the same time-lines as what Terra Nova referenced:


Vail's "issue" was they seemingly didn't agree with Terra Nova's assessment that a zip line constitutes "intensive" use as opposed to "normal" use. Although even based on the "normal" use guidelines, depending on the exact number of months that particular lanyard was in use on the zip line, it may well have been near or even past the 12 month mark anyway, making Vail's argument against replacement even weaker.

 

[snoseek]

Remember that time the zipline snapped at heavenly and wrapped up the adjacent chair killing a dude on his honeymoon...

 

[thetrailboss]

Remember that time the zipline snapped at heavenly and wrapped up the adjacent chair killing a dude on his honeymoon...

Did Vail own it then?

 

[snoseek]

Did Vail own it then?

You're damn right they did and they settled with and undisclosed amount of money

 

[2Planker]

"It's a war, son. We lose Stormtroopers everyday!"

View attachment 54504

So glad to see that they're all wearing Conterra Radio harnesses
Came out of SR, circa late 80's.

 

[thetrailboss]

You're damn right they did and they settled with and undisclosed amount of money

Well, if it was before this Stowe incident, then Vail CERTAINLY should have been EXTRA careful in running zip lines.

 

[nycskier]

Vail closed Breck last weekend, looked like this then from the air:
View attachment 54503
Now I see the town of Breckenridge is reporting over 18" from the storm yesterday. Nice Vail, good call

Vail closing Breck last week is an absolute disgrace. They just got a ton of snow and Abasin was packed.

 

[crystalmountainskier]

Vail closing Breck last week is an absolute disgrace. They just got a ton of snow and Abasin was packed.

Vail's opening and closing dates have virtually nothing to do with weather. Determined by data-driven marketing calendar analysis benchmarks blah blah blah blah blah.

 

[nycskier]

Vail's opening and closing dates have virtually nothing to do with weather. Determined by data-driven marketing calendar analysis benchmarks blah blah blah blah blah.

Vail said they were keeping Breck open until May 30th. Then they closed it 2 weeks earlier because of weather conditions. They promised it would be open through Memorial day weekend and then they backtracked on it.

 

[thetrailboss]

Vail said they were keeping Breck open until May 30th. Then they closed it 2 weeks earlier because of weather conditions. They promised it would be open through Memorial day weekend and then they backtracked on it.

"You gotta problem with that, big guy?"

 

[jimmywilson69]

Wasn't Breck melting out when they decided to close? They definitely had stated they would be open until Memorial day. I know A-Basin had lost a lot of snow and they had started farming snow to be able to stay open into June.

 

[drjeff]

Wasn't Breck melting out when they decided to close? They definitely had stated they would be open until Memorial day. I know A-Basin had lost a lot of snow and they had started farming snow to be able to stay open into June.

Yup, there were a bunch of pictures from down near the base where it had gotten very thin around when they closed. With the ground warming, reality is that what fell there over the weekend, down low fell onto thawed ground and while from afar looked good, likely was just a fresh coat of paint on top of a non usable surface underneath for a product that would of stood up to some folks making turns on it

 

[ss20]

Yup, there were a bunch of pictures from down near the base where it had gotten very thin around when they closed. With the ground warming, reality is that what fell there over the weekend, down low fell onto thawed ground and while from afar looked good, likely was just a fresh coat of paint on top of a non usable surface underneath for a product that would of stood up to some folks making turns on it

That was our problem out here early and late season. Snowbird down low was totally exposed off the snowmaking trails til the late December storms. Then when we finally got some good snow again in the spring it wouldn't hold.

 

[drjeff]

That was our problem out here early and late season. Snowbird down low was totally exposed off the snowmaking trails til the late December storms. Then when we finally got some good snow again in the spring it wouldn't hold.

Yup, and this time of year, a late season storm on top of a thawing, warming, muddy groud does behave diferently than an early season storm on top of a cooling, muddy ground. Granted, both are less than ideal for keeping the underlying ground/rocks covered

 

[machski]

Yup, there were a bunch of pictures from down near the base where it had gotten very thin around when they closed. With the ground warming, reality is that what fell there over the weekend, down low fell onto thawed ground and while from afar looked good, likely was just a fresh coat of paint on top of a non usable surface underneath for a product that would of stood up to some folks making turns on it

You need to add to this that Vail didn't put down enough manmade early on at Breck to help allow the long season they were promising. It was very thin when we got there down low on March 4th. Had it not snow the next 3 days, the conditions there would have been brutal. Regardless, the crowds everyday were. Was not impressed at all.
Snowbird's ops this year are an outlier and can't be compared as they do not have Tram download options this year that they normally would. Vail could have farmed into this storm cycle (again, town level reported 18 inches Saturday. I think that would go a decent way to shore up lower terrain) but they took the easy way out. But I have no doubt CO folks will still buy up the Epic in large numbers.