VAIL SUCKS

[drjeff]

BW is making a go at summer w/ lots of stuff going on.
Gondi rides to the summit restaurant start this weekend.
Not to mention golf, Spa, fly fishing, biking, carriage rides.....

And weddings and other large, similar type functions. Those big groups coming in for functions like weddings and/or corporate meetings/retreats certainly bring a decent amount of $$ into the property.

Wonder how much the selling of th Grand Summit Hotel at Attitash played in to Vail choosing to not pursue continued Summer Ops as they no llonger get the $$ benefit from any wedding/corporate retreat events that may be held there? While I am sure it wasn't the primary reason they have chosen not to pursue Summer Ops, I am guessing from a revenue generation standpoint it had some contributory effect

 

[jimmywilson69]

I've been peppered with emails saying that summer operations are opening at the "select" places they actually run them.

Its a matter of them still not understanding the markets they are now in. maybe Ludlow is a Ghost town, but New Hampshire is busy. Bean counters don't understand that stuff, but that's where regional and resort GMs should be providing them intel. if they want it... Then again its not like they've had a long tenured GM at Attitash...

 

[deadheadskier]

I think the biggest argument for having some semblance of summer operations is talent retention. Having more core middle management stick with you due to having a viable year round job, only serves to create a better product in winter.

 

[drjeff]

I've been peppered with emails saying that summer operations are opening at the "select" places they actually run them.

Its a matter of them still not understanding the markets they are now in. maybe Ludlow is a Ghost town, but New Hampshire is busy. Bean counters don't understand that stuff, but that's where regional and resort GMs should be providing them intel. if they want it... Then again its not like they've had a long tenured GM at Attitash...

I suppose you could argue that with Vail owning the Grand Summit and Mount Snow and the Jackson Gore Hotel at Okemo and the Spruce Peak village at Stowe, there's your wedding/business retreat business there to justify Summer Ops (Not sure of the Jackson Gore Wedding/Business Retreat volume, I I can attest that Mount Snow has signs out, directing guests where to park for weddings and business retreats, most every weekend from May through October, and often with different names on the signs each day of the weekend, so that business is brisk, even if the guests aren't all going to mountain bike or golf, but might take a scenic chairlift ride while there...

Okemo also has a decent amount of non zipline Summer activities out of the Jackson Gore base, and Stowe with their facilities at Spruce, along with the Cliff House, likely has a busy Summer of weddings/meetings as well.

Still makes no sense, unless its all about the wedding and meeting revenue, that they're not investing in Summer Ops at Attitash given the North Conway guest volume in the Summer.....

 

[2Planker]

All the Quebecois are PO'd... More outlet shopping less Zip Lines

 

[AdironRider]

I think you guys are missing the forest for the trees. Attitash is would have to rebuild basically all of their summer infrastructure (it was falling apart when I was a kid 25 years ago), and compete against hundreds of other establishments. None of that is cheap or easy.

For what, to compete with Story Land or any of the dozens, of lets face it, more desirable wedding venues? Have you seen a ski area in the summer? It isn't exactly a manicured golf course.

North Conway is also busy with outlet store patrons, not Vail clientele.

 

[2Planker]

I think you guys are missing the forest for the trees. Attitash is would have to rebuild basically all of their summer infrastructure (it was falling apart when I was a kid 25 years ago), and compete against hundreds of other establishments. None of that is cheap or easy.

For what, to compete with Story Land or any of the dozens, of lets face it, more desirable wedding venues? Have you seen a ski area in the summer? It isn't exactly a manicured golf course.

North Conway is also busy with outlet store patrons, not Vail clientele.

I was in a wedding at SR many years ago. HUGE MISTAKE - Construction Equipment parked out side and left running (diesel) Not to mention major Tree trimming and weed whacking all going on during the ceremony/reception. No one from SR around to talk too...
End result was family threatened to sue for 3x and the whole function was comped....

 

[Harvey]

I think the biggest argument for having some semblance of summer operations is talent retention.

This is the reason Plattekill operates on Friday. The more days you are open, the easier it is to get good help.

 

[BenedictGomez]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

 

[BodeMiller1]

I hope I never have to ski Bretton Woods Again. Nice hotel though...

 

[thetrailboss]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

The industry has been creeping this way.

 

[letitsnow1]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

I hate having to decide on season passes in the spring to get the best price,would be nice to be able to wait to the fall. I kind of regret not buying an Indy pass before they sold out

 

[Smellytele]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

You chose the evil empire you have to live by their rules.

 

[Edd]

On Instagram Wildcat is saying May 27th is the last day to get the Epic at the cheapest price.

 

[djd66]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

That’s like 1/2 the price of the seasonal programs at sugarbush. It’s been a while for me, but we always had to pay for the program well in advance to ensure our kids each got a spot.

how many days of skiing does your kid get with the group?

 

[drjeff]

Just had to pay $1,600 a full 7.5 months in advance for kid's seasonal lessons.

I know Vail's always trying to get your money as far in advance as possible, but this is over-the-top. Is this a relatively new thing or have they done this for a long time?

From a logistics standpoint, aside from putting some $$ in their coiffures earlier, it does give them a feel as to what the demand for next season may be like, so they can start planning for how many instructors are returning for next season vs how many they may need to recruit and how that will, or won't affect how many spaces will be available in those programs

 

[deadheadskier]

Our kids seasonal development programs at Gunstock had to be paid for in full at the time of purchase. I don't think a payment plan was an option like our season passes, but maybe I missed it. We signed up the moment registration opened on March 29. Seems the standard programs sell out right away. There are some slots still open for race devo.

$1045 total. Includes 9 weeks with two hours of coaching each session. Our son's was about $100 more than our daughter's as his is racing focused. She will be old enough for that program the 25-26 season.

We think it's a solid value and very beneficial. Added bonus is it frees me up for a couple of hours to work on my racing on the NASTAR course.

 

[AdironRider]

Any kids program is in very high demand currently.

I just put my kid in swim lessons and they sold out in under 3 minutes. 3! With demand like that yeah you are paying in full up front.

On a somewhat separate note, Jay Peak programs are such a great deal, notably for the length. 16+ weeks for like 1650. Full day programs. When my kiddo turns 7 he's definitely signing up.

 

[djd66]

Any kids program is in very high demand currently.

Definitely a first world problem!

 

[machski]

I suppose you could argue that with Vail owning the Grand Summit and Mount Snow and the Jackson Gore Hotel at Okemo and the Spruce Peak village at Stowe, there's your wedding/business retreat business there to justify Summer Ops (Not sure of the Jackson Gore Wedding/Business Retreat volume, I I can attest that Mount Snow has signs out, directing guests where to park for weddings and business retreats, most every weekend from May through October, and often with different names on the signs each day of the weekend, so that business is brisk, even if the guests aren't all going to mountain bike or golf, but might take a scenic chairlift ride while there...

Okemo also has a decent amount of non zipline Summer activities out of the Jackson Gore base, and Stowe with their facilities at Spruce, along with the Cliff House, likely has a busy Summer of weddings/meetings as well.

Still makes no sense, unless its all about the wedding and meeting revenue, that they're not investing in Summer Ops at Attitash given the North Conway guest volume in the Summer.....

Vail doesn't own anything at Spruce Village at Stowe. They got the ski resort only, none of the real estate there.