VT proposing restrictions on Short Term rentals

[kingslug]

Wonder how they like the 1/2 hour liftlines.
We looked at a studio there. If you rent it they get half. Then you get to pay for cleaning everytime its used, you or a renter. And it was pretty expensive for a 500 sq ft room. I like our better. The times..they are a changing..

 

[O09]

Theyre building places all over VT..to rent out. So its ok for company XYZ to build lets say 4 townhomes..like they are doing next to the Edelwiese deli, but its not ok for the average person to buy a place and rent it out? This is BS and will never pass.

I agree. At one point in time, Mt Snow was going to build ~150 2,3,and 4 bedroom condos at the base of Carinthia for use exclusively as short term rentals. How would that be okay and not a regular person renting out their house?

This bill would take away revenue from the State of Vermont and cost money to implement. Short term rentals have become something that is beyond the power of the inns/chamber of commerce to push their regulation. They will run up against other entities that are way more invested than some inn owner chipping in $500 to the chamber to lobby their cause.

 

[mbedle]

Does this apply to condo hotels and timeshares?

I agree. At one point in time, Mt Snow was going to build ~150 2,3,and 4 bedroom condos at the base of Carinthia for use exclusively as short term rentals. How would that be okay and not a regular person renting out their house?

This bill would take away revenue from the State of Vermont and cost money to implement. Short term rentals have become something that is beyond the power of the inns/chamber of commerce to push their regulation. They will run up against other entities that are way more invested than some inn owner chipping in $500 to the chamber to lobby their cause.

I believe that the Carinthia build out are going to be privately owned (through the EB-5 program). I also believe that the business model for them is short term rentals. Since none are going to be occupied by the owners for the required timeframe (that is prohibited), they would not be allowed to rent them out under the new regulations. If that regulation passes, you are going to see a massive sell off of these standalone condos at ski resorts and the adjacent resorts. Look at all the condo resorts along Mountain Road in Stowe, pretty much every one of them is marketed for sale as a short term rental unit and not for any type of full time occupancy. Hence the reason the average HOA fee in Stowe is around $1,000 per month. Maybe these resort condos would be exempt from the regulations??? Maybe you will see a lot of owners eat the 12K a year for the couple of trips they plan to visit Stowe??? Its not like you are going to see any of the owners say or be allowed to start renting them out full-time. Can't imagine the monthly rent is going to be to low when you have to cover such a high HOA fee.

 

[abc]

On the other hand, all the current 2nd home owners can get together and demanded existing property to be grandfathered.

That would limits new construction and competition. Best of both world.

 

[Smellytele]

On the other hand, all the current 2nd home owners can get together and demanded existing property to be grandfathered.

That would limits new construction and competition. Best of both world.

Not a good world for the vt construction world though.

 

[skiur]

On the other hand, all the current 2nd home owners can get together and demanded existing property to be grandfathered.

That would limits new construction and competition. Best of both world.

Vermont doesn't even let 2nd home owners vote in the town they own their house in. They can get together all they want, the state doesn't care.

 

[kingslug]

This is all just...joy. If I can't rent mine out..I wont.

 

[Smellytele]

Vermont doesn't even let 2nd home owners vote in the town they own their house in. They can get together all they want, the state doesn't care.

Does any state?

 

[mbedle]

Does any state?

From what I found, Delaware, Connecticut and New Mexico are the only states that allow non-residents to vote in municipal or town elections. However, there are a lot of other states there select counties and towns allow non-residences to vote on certain issues. The article I read listed Mountain Village (Town made at base of Telluride Ski Resort) in Colorado as one that non-residence sued for the right to vote on local issues.

 

[djd66]

Does any state?

Delaware, Connecticut, and New Mexico are the only three states in the country that allow non-residents to vote in municipal or town elections.

 

[cdskier]

Does any state?

I was wondering that as well.

From what I found, Delaware, Connecticut and New Mexico are the only states that allow non-residents to vote in municipal or town elections. However, there are a lot of other states there select counties and towns allow non-residences to vote on certain issues. The article I read listed Mountain Village (Town made at base of Telluride Ski Resort) in Colorado as one that non-residence sued for the right to vote on local issues.

Interesting info. It certainly is an interesting idea to allow non-resident property owners to vote in local elections or at least on certain issues.

 

[machski]

We almost bought a small A frame in Viking village before we opted to move to Sugarbush. It was going for 250K at the time. If we bought that things might have turned out entirely different. I bet it is worth 500K now.

Does that A-Frame still exist as such? I can only think of maybe 2 left in Viking. Seems full rebuilds have been all the rage in there lately.

 

[icecoast1]

Does this apply to condo hotels and timeshares?

I believe that the Carinthia build out are going to be privately owned (through the EB-5 program). I also believe that the business model for them is short term rentals. Since none are going to be occupied by the owners for the required timeframe (that is prohibited), they would not be allowed to rent them out under the new regulations. If that regulation passes, you are going to see a massive sell off of these standalone condos at ski resorts and the adjacent resorts. Look at all the condo resorts along Mountain Road in Stowe, pretty much every one of them is marketed for sale as a short term rental unit and not for any type of full time occupancy. Hence the reason the average HOA fee in Stowe is around $1,000 per month. Maybe these resort condos would be exempt from the regulations??? Maybe you will see a lot of owners eat the 12K a year for the couple of trips they plan to visit Stowe??? Its not like you are going to see any of the owners say or be allowed to start renting them out full-time. Can't imagine the monthly rent is going to be to low when you have to cover such a high HOA fee.

are those condos at Carinthia still happening? The Eb-5 program is basically dead, seems like that basically killed that project under Peak's ownership. Vail would need to come up with different funding methods at a time when cash is tight

 

[drjeff]

are those condos at Carinthia still happening? The Eb-5 program is basically dead, seems like that basically killed that project under Peak's ownership. Vail would need to come up with different funding methods at a time when cash is tight

While not dead completely, as I understand it Vail is/will be doing an entire reassessment of the 20ish year master plan that had the Carinthia base area development in it.

The EB-5 money that they had raised was a "phase 1" kind of thing that covered the new Carinthia Base Lodge as well as all of the snowmaking upgrades.

Phase 2, which essentially hadn't started when the entire Vail purchase of Peak happened which put a pause on things.

So I do not believe as I understand things, that there's any liability issues for EB-5 funds and the Carinthia development, and the phase 1 EB-5 part apparently met the criteria it had to, so that part is OK in the eyes of those who oversee/over saw the program

 

[abc]

Interesting info. It certainly is an interesting idea to allow non-resident property owners to vote in local elections or at least on certain issues.

Yep, interesting idea. Doesn't non-resident property owners includes commercial owners like hotels?

On the other hand, there's nothing to stop a 2nd home owner to make their second home their primary residents. Plenty of small landlords even turn their rental property into "primary" resident to avoid paying capital gain tax on the sale of the property.

 

[cdskier]

Yep, interesting idea. Doesn't non-resident property owners includes commercial owners like hotels?

On the other hand, there's nothing to stop a 2nd home owner to make their second home their primary residents. Plenty of small landlords even turn their rental property into "primary" resident to avoid paying capital gain tax on the sale of the property.

You can't have 2 primary residences...so if you make your 2nd home your primary one, then you no longer would have a say/vote over things in the town/state for your first home.

 

[NYDB]

If you are married you can do it no prob. One spouse each has a different primary residence.

 

[drjeff]

If you are married you can do it no prob. One spouse each has a different primary residence.

That takes the concept of separate bedrooms to a bigtime level!

 

[NYDB]

Yep, interesting idea. Doesn't non-resident property owners includes commercial owners like hotels?

On the other hand, there's nothing to stop a 2nd home owner to make their second home their primary residents. Plenty of small landlords even turn their rental property into "primary" resident to avoid paying capital gain tax on the sale of the property.

there are a few reasons why this doesn't workout well. Please consult your tax advisor.

 

[Hawk]

Please explain. I do not see how your taxes will change. What am I missing.