Anybody else hear this..........

[AdironRider]

Ill agree, I think Ive seen Whiteface piss out at least 100 grand on snowmaking so far this season. Im glad you see my point that this is a pretty big deal, I wasnt getting that vibe earlier. Im not trying to trash on MRG at all, its just sad to see an area closed.

But, it does cost money to keep an area ready to open. They did pay employess for the last 2 months or so before shutting down. They have to keep the trails maintained. The new single chair costs money. Upkeep of buildings costs a bit. Administration costs play a factor. I understand these costs (minus the new lift) are petty, but they are sunk costs that must be recognized.

 

[JimG.]

I understand these costs (minus the new lift) are petty, but they are sunk costs that must be recognized.

Agreed, and the revenue needed to cover those costs are already collected from the coop.

And that's the only reason I said they are more insulated from the poor weather than other resorts.

 

[ski_resort_observer]

AR...you asked, "how they can concievably profit and exist as a business given the weather conditions" . We have all tried to answer your question but I'm not sure you still get it. Yes, it is a big deal that they are not open but your "big deal" implied they were heading to NELSAP. Not gonna happen. :smile:

 

[thetrailboss]

OK, let's try this....

THIS just in: MRG will reopen this weekend.

 

[andyzee]

Good morning TB

 

[Greg]

This post on FTO is a positive one for the MRV:

http://firsttracksonline.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=2606

Hopefully, the weekend stays frozen, then things get cold for a longer time and maybe the Greens can pick up more lake effect giving MRG a chance at staying open.

 

[Mr MRG]

We Are Back!!!!

Greetings Alpine Zoners
This is what I just posted to our website at www.madriverglen.com Be sure to check out the pics of the day on the snow report page and take note of the difference between this mornings pics and the one I just posted at 4 PM.

Oh my goodness it is actually SNOWING. yes, frozen whiteness is actually falling from the sky! After a brief hiatus Mad River Glen will be making a miraculous comeback for the Martin Luther King weekend. Due to decent snowmaking temps and an improved forecast we will be able to open the Practice Slope this weekend. We also hope to have enough snow to crank up the Callie’s Corner Handle Tow for the youngsters as well. rest assured that the main mountain will be re-opened as soon as Mother Nature gives us the remotest of opportunity.

This has been an interesting thread. It is nice to know how many fans we have. One thing I would like to correct. Jim G said;

"All I said was that their business model allows them to ride out these poor winters. And they aren't making money, but how is it costing them money? They don't blow much snow, so that isn't a big expense, they don't groom much, and they don't depend on day trippers or vacationers for the bulk of their revenue. They already collected the bulk of their revenue from the coop."

Actually we are VERY much dependent on day skiers. Our shareholders only represent about 30-40% of our revenues. Everything else comes from non-sharehodlers and it is vital that we sell those lift tickets, sell those burgers, sell that Single Chair Ale and sell those T-shirts. So come one, come all!!!!

Greg said:
"Not sure how this and last season has been affecting them financially, but MRG is not in the red. Before the single chair project, they had no debt, and I'm not sure how their donation campaign is going. Perhaps an update, Eric? "

Well at this point we still don't have any debt and we hope to keep it that way. It has been the cornerstone of our success. Our campaign has tremendous momentum. We have raised well over $500,000 which gets us a 1/3rd of the way there. Now with snow on the ground maybe folks will show up and we can start building up that total. Learn more about our Single Chair Capital Campaign at www.madriverglen.com/single/

 

[ctenidae]

Well at this point we still don't have any debt and we hope to keep it that way. It has been the cornerstone of our success.

A lesson many other ski area operators (I'm looking at YOU, ASC) would do well to learn.

 

[JimG.]

Greetings Alpine Zoners
This is what I just posted to our website at www.madriverglen.com Be sure to check out the pics of the day on the snow report page and take note of the difference between this mornings pics and the one I just posted at 4 PM.

Oh my goodness it is actually SNOWING. yes, frozen whiteness is actually falling from the sky! After a brief hiatus Mad River Glen will be making a miraculous comeback for the Martin Luther King weekend. Due to decent snowmaking temps and an improved forecast we will be able to open the Practice Slope this weekend. We also hope to have enough snow to crank up the Callie’s Corner Handle Tow for the youngsters as well. rest assured that the main mountain will be re-opened as soon as Mother Nature gives us the remotest of opportunity.

This has been an interesting thread. It is nice to know how many fans we have. One thing I would like to correct. Jim G said;

"All I said was that their business model allows them to ride out these poor winters. And they aren't making money, but how is it costing them money? They don't blow much snow, so that isn't a big expense, they don't groom much, and they don't depend on day trippers or vacationers for the bulk of their revenue. They already collected the bulk of their revenue from the coop."

Actually we are VERY much dependent on day skiers. Our shareholders only represent about 30-40% of our revenues. Everything else comes from non-sharehodlers and it is vital that we sell those lift tickets, sell those burgers, sell that Single Chair Ale and sell those T-shirts. So come one, come all!!!!

Greg said:
"Not sure how this and last season has been affecting them financially, but MRG is not in the red. Before the single chair project, they had no debt, and I'm not sure how their donation campaign is going. Perhaps an update, Eric? "

Well at this point we still don't have any debt and we hope to keep it that way. It has been the cornerstone of our success. Our campaign has tremendous momentum. We have raised well over $500,000 which gets us a 1/3rd of the way there. Now with snow on the ground maybe folks will show up and we can start building up that total. Learn more about our Single Chair Capital Campaign at www.madriverglen.com/single/

I stand corrected. I still maintain that the revenue you do collect up front, even if only roughly 35% of gross receipts, still puts MRG in a better position to hunker down and withstand a poor winter or two.

And I certainly didn't mean to imply you do not value day trip/vacation revenue...one of my previous posts did kind of make it sound that way.

 

[SkiDog]

I'd just like to say how great it is that on this forum we get information RIGHT FROM THE PROVERBIAL HORSES MOUTH......it doesnt get ANY better than that....

While most resorts use bloated snow totals and gimmicks to get you to show up, its nice to see that even though you still need the daily skier visits that you dont compromise your reputation by embelishing the facts....

Kudos to MrMRG and Mad River Glen itself.......i'm headed up there asap All for one pass paid for or not........

HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY...

M

 

[AdironRider]

AR...you asked, "how they can concievably profit and exist as a business given the weather conditions" . We have all tried to answer your question but I'm not sure you still get it. Yes, it is a big deal that they are not open but your "big deal" implied they were heading to NELSAP. Not gonna happen. :smile:

You guys are putting words in my mouth. I never said that it was a guarantee that they were heading to NELSAP, I was just pointing out the reality of the situation that by not opening, it does cost them money as MRMRG pointed out.

Its great to hear that they are opening, hopefully mother nature works in their favor.

 

[highpeaksdrifter]

You guys are putting words in my mouth. I never said that it was a guarantee that they were heading to NELSAP, I was just pointing out the reality of the situation that by not opening, it does cost them money as MRMRG pointed out.

Its great to hear that they are opening, hopefully mother nature works in their favor.

A-ride took his lumps in this thread and it turns out he had it right. :beer:

 

[riverc0il]

II understand that MRG operates under its own unique circumstances, but after last years season ending early and this season not even starting, whats to say that next year isnt that 3rd year your talking about?

MRG closed early last year? any ski area that make's it to april 1st is hardly closing early. granted they did shut down for a few days due to bad weather in march, but they came back and opened up for two more weeks to finish out the season. this just shows MRG is not about profit, so i have no idea why you are hammering the "they can't make a profit if they don't blow snow" line, MRG isn't about making a profit. MRG is about being a sustainable ski area dedicated to the way skiing used to be and preserving the special aspects of the mountain and the ski area. MRG blew snow a few weeks ago when they could to get the practice hill open and opened almost half the mountain after an 8" storm. i am not sure where you get this notion that MRG is going to have a hard time bouncing back from the poor early season... if anything, MRG is BETTER PREPARED to bounce back than other ski areas because they don't need a huge man made snow base. MRG can open almost the entire mountain on 2 1' storms. add in one more clipper and MRG is 100% open with tree skiing accessable. 36" isn't much when you consider the average season totals at stark mountain, even when you cut off the least two snowiest mountains of the season (dec and nov). i am rev'd up to get to MRG as soon as terrain allows. they made a tough call, and good for them. other ski areas closed down due to the bad weather as well. in NH & VT alone, there were a dozen ski areas closed due to bad weather and many others barely holding on with single digit trail numbers (even jay which had over 30 last week). if anything, MRG will weather this bad season WAY better than any other ski area because they thrive on their hard core skier base, many of whom (myself included) prepaid for skiing. the big resorts will be the one's hurting because regular skiers and families don't go skiing when it isn't snowing in the cities and the big mountains have bad years. MRG certainly won't have a great financial year this season most likely (could easily turn around quickly though), but they will weather the storm far better than most because of their clientel.

 

[2knees]

dude, paragraphs.

try them. lol.

right on though.

 

[ski_resort_observer]

Yea, I think we all support their success.....I wish I didn't have to work this weekend as I have always wanted to photograph the VNG do their training thing up at MRG.

 

[Greg]

Check out the cam:

http://madriverglen.com/?Page=cams.html

Looks like a couple inches at the base based on the snow on the railings. Getting pounded right now!