Big Burke announcement

[Tin]

I put a nice post on their FB page and got this....

http://vtdigger.org/2013/12/22/q-burke-kingdom-trails-mend/

 

[from_the_NEK]

I put a nice post on their FB page and got this....

http://vtdigger.org/2013/12/22/q-burke-kingdom-trails-mend/

I pretty sure there are some serious discussions going on in the main office right now. Right now the train is completely off the tracks and the bridges are out. It is likely going to take some big changes to get everything put back together (not just fixing the relationship with KT). I wonder if Ary realizes that his attempt to save some $ has likely ended up costing them $$$.

 

[billski]

I pretty sure there are some serious discussions going on in the main office right now. Right now the train is completely off the tracks and the bridges are out. It is likely going to take some big changes to get everything put back together (not just fixing the relationship with KT). I wonder if Ary realizes that his attempt to save some $ has likely ended up costing them $$$.

The timing couldn't be worse. Here we are, coming into one of the two biggest weeks of the season and they're forced into a damage control operation. No time for a strategist.

 

[Tin]

Had guests up Saturday & parked initially at the base lodge since we had beginners with us. Lower chair not running for a couple of hours. So we moved up to the mid Burke.

1) no tickets there. Had to go back to the base. Still no lower chair. We drive back up.

2) Friends wife stepped in a CLOSSAL puddle in front of the mid Burke. Why? because both groomers were parked right where the ski racks normally are. You had to go around them to get into the building. Sadly there was a deep and wide puddle there that many, many walked in. Does "world class" customer service really involve being too cheap to buy a couple more extension chords so the grooming equipment isn't part of an obstacle course to get into the lodge? I understand that they don''t want to drive them trough the mud back to the maintenance area every night in early season, but they used to at least park them away from the building.

3) Willoughby trail (only way off the top) skied nicely. By the time we made one run the lower chair was back open so we picked up the beginner and skied down. Snow on most of the trails down there was thin but adequate. J-bar is NOT a beginner area- they have built terrain park features on the beginner slope and something like a halfpipe below the magic carpet? I am not sure what that was but the magic carpet was not running anyway.

4) J-bar hill is a disaster and NOT SAFE for beginners. There is not enough room beside the terrain features for a beginner to ski. There is only a narrow flat strip that intermediate skiers can navigate happily, but not my friend's wife who needs a wide area for her big traverse technique. ALSO, when we were there, they were loading with only one attendant at the base of the j-bar. Since that attendant must stay by the buttons they can no longer run along and help a beginner. This is new. They used to be really good at chatting with the beginners and running along with them. There will be more falls and likely people getting tangled up as they learn how to ride the lift. If you have never had to work the bottom of a beginner's surface lift it is hard to understand how much help is needed by newbies. I understand that they are cutting expenses, but only one person there is STUPID. ALSO- the only way to make any use of those terrain park like features on the j-bar hill was to get some speed coming down Bunker hill and scoot through them. Do we really need that in the exact space I had a first time skier? I do not blame the folks who came in with speed as it was the only way the snake like feature make any sense.

All in all a hill I have skied at and loved for years totally failed my friends this weekend. This is NOT about the weather. There was plenty of cold earlier in the year to make snow and they chose to start late- no doubt when it was more efficient. (I skied on more open terrain at Bretton Woods over Thanksgiving then Burke this weekend). They have cut staff in areas that effect skier safety. They made boneheaded decisions about what to do with what used to be the beginner area- no doubt to appease the park crowd while they wait to make snow on their terrain park trail.

With the base lodge nearly empty, one of the staff did tell a family using the upper cafeteria for brown bagging that there is a brown bag area down in the basement. REALLY? on a rainy day in December when the lower lift did not run for hours. Ballsy & stupid.

Perhaps calmer heads will sort out the Kingdom trails mess, but who the hell is going to sort out the operational mess at Burke right now? Q2 has been lecturing the staff about delivering great customer service and doing more with less. The staff has NO CHANCE given what I saw this week. These are not minor operational glitches- This is a total lack of understanding of customer service and inexperience. They need HELP, now.

We left early- very, very sad.

Copy and paste this on their FB site. Would love to see their response. They have been responding to all the negative stuff.

 

[oldtimer]

Anyone with a facebook presence has my permission. I am not a user and do not wish to be.

 

[Zand]

Wow... speaking of Burke's Facebook page... check out all the negativity from everybody. :-o I would've hoped that after all of this crap they've done, the management of the actual skiing experience would at least be better, but oldtimer's report is exactly what I was afraid of. What a shame.

Check out this reply on the Facebook page to a comment: "Christian, we're less than 10 days into the first season of winter ops. Let's maybe take a deep breath before proclaiming the coming of the apocalypse, yeah?"

Think Hannah would've ever written something that arrogant?

 

[Tin]

Anyone with a facebook presence has my permission. I am not a user and do not wish to be.

Can't wait to see the response. If it does not get deleted ill be shocked.

 

[Tin]

Anyone with a facebook presence has my permission. I am not a user and do not wish to be.

Within 5 minutes...

Thanks for the feedback - we know there are some issues to be worked out around here and we apologize for the experience. We've passed on the info to the appropriate folks and they are definitely taking it all into account. We're doing what we can to address these things with the resources at our disposal. If this was your particular experience, let us know and we can dig into a few of the issues with you directly.

 

[kingdom-tele]

how many days at Burke Tin?

this is sad.

We could stand to look at the folks involved in KT, and Burke Mt, the people who have gladly spent much more time and actual physical effort into making it what it is instead of all the chatter and grand standing. If half the people who spent all this energy being pissed at a clueless, detached guy into actually trying to keep Burke alive it wouldn't even be in this mess. Really touching how in love everyone is with Mr. Stenger, and yet its his vision that is going to transform burke into something miles away from the "heart" of Burke. Pathetic, they build their mecca and all this pud pulling over a guy on a working vacation will be a dream, the people coming won't care your principles have been stepped upon, nor will the management as they fill the piggy bank. Nice sentiments though, I guess winning a facebook argument counts for something in this day and age, you really got em.

 

[oldtimer]

Here's the thing: my friends think the place is a dump. That cannot be undone. Sensible grooming and lift loading on the J-bar hill they can fix and I hope they do. But none of that change's the impression from last weekend. Good for them for not deleting the post, but re-inventing how to run a ski area is silly. Get some professional help & pay attention to them.

 

[kingdom-tele]

but you know better OT, its a shame the changes are screwing with the product at this point, but they're your friends, bring them back when the place is going full tilt, early season burke has never been something to write home about, hell laps on the jet at J isn't exactly something special

 

[thetrailboss]

Hey Tin did they correct you to say that those are "Snow Qats" parked out front?

:lol:

 

[thetrailboss]

The thread that keeps on giving. Wow. I hope someone is reading the constructive criticism/feedback.

 

[DJAK]

Get some professional help & pay attention to them.

They already have it. SW is THE BEST in the biz at this (change with minimal pain). Andrew is on a parallel track and is quite skilled. It's that second part that is TBD and may or may not allow for a fruitful future. Once (if) it does this all gets better fast. They have the talent. Can/will they let it lead? Fingers crossed. Might require a certain character having a change in job title. Want that character to succeed as well. Not his fault he got put into a position of poor fit. Easy fix. Fix soon please. Too many NEK'ers livelihood's at stake to wait and see based on what we've already seen.

 

[oldtimer]

I have met Andrew and he seems well intentioned and likely is very good from his posts. SW? the name is not ringing a bell.

They already have it. SW is THE BEST in the biz at this (change with minimal pain). Andrew is on a parallel track and is quite skilled. It's that second part that is TBD and may or may not allow for a fruitful future. Once (if) it does this all gets better fast. They have the talent. Can/will they let it lead? Fingers crossed. Might require a certain character having a change in job title. Want that character to succeed as well. Not his fault he got put into a position of poor fit. Easy fix. Fix soon please. Too many NEK'ers livelihood's at stake to wait and see based on what we've already seen.

 

[DJAK]

I have met Andrew and he seems well intentioned and likely is very good from his posts. SW? the name is not ringing a bell.

Winner of the most NSAA marketing awards in perhaps the history of the award. Also knows the lyrics to Wharf Rat.

 

[oldtimer]

thanks- we all have our ah daaa moments.

 

[thetrailboss]

They already have it. SW is THE BEST in the biz at this (change with minimal pain). Andrew is on a parallel track and is quite skilled. It's that second part that is TBD and may or may not allow for a fruitful future. Once (if) it does this all gets better fast. They have the talent. Can/will they let it lead? Fingers crossed. Might require a certain character having a change in job title. Want that character to succeed as well. Not his fault he got put into a position of poor fit. Easy fix. Fix soon please. Too many NEK'ers livelihood's at stake to wait and see based on what we've already seen.

Exactly. I think that the "certain character" would be a good airplane manufacturer manager.

And, to sum up what's happened since the "certain character" came to town:

1. Citing cost, he laid off 4 senior managers--the mountain manager, the "inside" retail manager, the marketing director, and the HR manager. They collectively had several decades of service. Several other managers and staff were let go as well.

2. Quietly over the summer, a new logo was unveiled on FB that had "Burke" encircled by a "Q". After some negative feedback, the logo was changed again to a mountain with a bear and the word "Burke" encircled by a "Q". In an interview with WCAX, Ary said that the "Q" represented his family and their desire to make their mark.

3. Several thousands of dollars have been spent on new signs and logos on the property.

4. Over the summer, Ary learned of the agreement with KT to share revenue for lift-served biking and trail access fees. He initially said that he would not honor the agreement, despite it being in writing. He later decided to pay the $20,000, per the contract, but said that he would not agree to such an arrangement in 2014. That led to this firestorm, including an Email purportedly from him, in lower case, mocking the writer and even saying that:

"the mistake is following all of you" and "kingdom trails took advantage of a weak and vulnerable organization to their benefit. now I have stopped it with great pleasure."

In a VTDigger article, Ary stated that cost was the issue and even implied that the previous President/manager entered into the contract while serving as a director with KT thus creating a conflict of interest.

We can also see the many issues with operations including those that oldtimer cited (no tickets at Mid-Burke, no Sherburne Express operating, forcing guests to eat brownbag lunches in the basement of Sherburne despite the main lodge area being empty, inadequate staffing for lifts, despite improved snowmaking a start one week later than usual, etc). I also think I read here that Ary was not going to offer season passes to staff to save money (this is a normal industry practice).

So overall, I'd say a pretty bad start.

And, as said, with many visible EB-5 fundraising efforts afoot for Jay, Burke, and the NEK, there is a lot of scrutiny about how well these related businesses are being run.

 

[thetrailboss]

It's also telling that Burke Cheerleader Masskier is nowhere to be heard from on this latest firestorm.

 

[the original trailboss]

For the past several seasons, Burke (yup, no Q here) has received awards for customer service and the area operated with "we're all working for something" approach. The customers nearly always praised Burke for its friendly staff, high level of returning employees and a great skiing product on slopes that have served, and continue to serve, some of the world's best skiers. While Burke's history made it a less than stellar business model, its character, personality, culture and history have carved out a special place in the ski world, and, slowly, very slowly, people have migrated to the ski area for what it is and for what it isn't. What many of us thought was going to be the corner-turning event for Burke (on-mountain beds) has turned out to be a 5-story double (yup, two of 'em) hotel that is so over-sized that it will dwarf everything around it, ruin the entire vista and create a parking and logistical nightmare for skiers, racers, and I'm sure, hotel guests as well. We now have a change to one of the most iconic names in the ski world (think, BMA and its world-wide tentacles) from Burke to Q Burke. We have a new power structure (team, I believe is the new term) but the team quarterback (Q) is not in the middle of the huddle on every play. We have a torn (albeit repairable) relationship between the ski area, Kingdom Trails, and the community at large. We have a beginner-heaven J-bar area that has been compromised, the very well known Dashney Mile terrain park is not open, paying customers relegated to the basement (no windows) if they brownbag. And its not even Christmas yet!