Chairlift Overkill!

[gregnye]

So yeah--you know what I mean!

Overkill Chairlifts=

Singular noun:
-a chairlift that dumps too many people into one area.
-A chairlift that is way too fast for the area it is serving.
-A chairlift that is too luxurious (gondola, tram, heated chairlift) for the area it is serving

Plural:
-Too many fast chairlifts in one area!
-Chairlifts going "every which way" and none a good way up the mountain!

So--that is my definition of "overkill chairlifts"--what is yours? And what chairlift/group of chairlifts would you consider an "overkill chairlift"???


My examples:
--Attitash--Summit triple and the fast quad cross! Weird lift set up! On Bear peak the bear express dumps waaay too many people their at once. Overkill!

-Deer Valley--When a ski are has to start limiting the amount of tickets they sell because they don't want to overload the mountain--that is a bad sign!! 5 HS-quads come to a point on Flagstaff mountain (I think)--overkill!

What over examples do you have??

 

[gregnye]

Just to make it clear--I don't want to bash the resorts and make this a negative thread--I just think that there is something for "too many ways to get up a mountain"

 

[skiNEwhere]

Killington - I still feel the Northbrook Quad is the most pointless lift of the mountain. Why is it even a quad?

On the flip side, I think Jay has the most efficient lift system. Not too many lifts, the lifts provided let you access most of the terrain, and not too long of a line

 

[gregnye]

Killington - I still feel the Northbrook Quad is the most pointless lift of the mountain. Why is it even a quad?

On the flip side, I think Jay has the most efficient lift system. Not too many lifts, the lifts provided let you access most of the terrain, and not too long of a line

Yes, I agree with you that Jay is the most efficient. Even the tram makes sense! (The cannon tram however doesn't make much sense as it is isolated and doesn't need to span a gap between two peaks. However, the cannon tram makes sense when put into historical perspective and the time period when it was built.

 

[steamboat1]

Killington - I still feel the Northbrook Quad is the most pointless lift of the mountain. Why is it even a quad?

There are many days when the Skyeship gondola stage 2 & Needles Eye chair aren't running because of wind holds. If not for the Northbrook chair not only would that section of the mountain be closed to skiing but they would also have to close stage 1 of Skyeship because of no way to access the rest of the mountain from where it drops you off. Does Northbrook need to be a quad? Probably not but I don't agree that the chair is pointless.

 

[skiNEwhere]

There are many days when the Skyeship gondola stage 2 & Needles Eye aren't running because of wind holds. If not for the Northbrook chair not only would that section of the mountain be closed to skiing but they would also have to close stage 1 of Skyeship because of no way to access the rest of the mountain from where it drops you off. Does Northbrook need to be a quad? Probably not but I don't agree that the chair is pointless.

It does serve a purpose, but I think ASC could have taken another route like building a trail that returns to base

EDIT: Or add a surface lift there, quad seems like overkill. I don't think the topology allows for a downhill trail

 

[steamboat1]

It does serve a purpose, but I think ASC could have taken another route like building a trail that returns to base

EDIT: Or add a surface lift there, quad seems like overkill. I don't think the topology allows for a downhill trail

A lot of what ASC did was overkill. Not only at K but at their other areas as well. Guess that's why they went bankrupt. A surface lift wouldn't work there because the High Road trail would have to cross the surface lift. A lot of people ski High Road to get to either Needle's Eye or Skyeship stage 2 also exiting from the Stairs gladed trail would cross a surface lift. Not to mention I don't think there's a significant price difference between installing either a fixed grip double/triple chair over a quad so why not a quad. I'm glad you edited your post because I was also going to point out there's no way to cut a trail over to Snowshed base from the base of Northbrook/ top of stage 1 Skyeship unless you plan on skinning it up.

 

[Tin]

American Express at Stratton.

Great alternative to the gondola but it is a traffic jam at both ends. I stay clear of it after I get up it to the mid mountain and just ride URSA most of the day occasionally head over to Snowbowl or Sunrise. Love hitting Vertigo and Free Fall but that long run out is a pain.

 

[steamboat1]

Love hitting Vertigo and Free Fall but that long run out is a pain.

Which leads us back to how poorly laid out The Shooting Star six pack is. If it was laid out differently & started lower down the mountain the run out wouldn't be an issue. Especially after taking out the Kidderbrook lift. But this has already been discussed in another thread.

 

[steamboat1]

Mt. Snow having a HSQ & a six pack starting & dumping skiers off at just about the same spot is overkill.

Stratton isn't to far behind having 2 six packs, a quad & a 10 person gondola dumping people off on top of their mountain.

 

[snoseek]

Mt. Snow having a HSQ & a six pack starting & dumping skiers off at just about the same spot is overkill.

Stratton isn't to far behind having 2 six packs, a quad & a 10 person gondola dumping people off on top of their mountain.

Definitely those two although I've only skied Stratton once. Killington has its areas but mostly just chokes, same with Loon.

Out west anything owned by Vail Resorts minus Kwood (for now). Winter Park is also a little crazy with the six packs...I guess it sorta spreads out though.

 

[bobbutts]

Mt. Snow having a HSQ & a six pack starting & dumping skiers off at just about the same spot is overkill.

Stratton isn't to far behind having 2 six packs, a quad & a 10 person gondola dumping people off on top of their mountain.

At Mt. Snow Don't forget the double and triple north face lifts and the sunbrook quad also dumping people at the same spot as the 2 front side high speed lifts.

 

[Tin]

Which leads us back to how poorly laid out The Shooting Star six pack is. If it was laid out differently & started lower down the mountain the run out wouldn't be an issue. Especially after taking out the Kidderbrook lift. But this has already been discussed in another thread.

I know there was mention of adding a trail or two there but when I was there in March it looked like they were cleaning out all of the woods in between Kidderbrook and Midderbrook as well as Midder and Rick's. Would be nice to just cross over via some glades and avoid the run out.

 

[xlr8r]

Fixed quad overkill

Sunday River: white heat, little white cap, white cap, aurora, and oz are fixed quads that never seem to be busy. ASC didn't seem to believe in building any chairlifts smaller than a quad.

Okemo: 2 South Ridge quads, and Sachem quad.

Sugarbush: Inverness quad

Killington: Canyon quad and Devil's Fiddle quad (RIP).

 

[deadheadskier]

Pains me to say it, but definitely the Wildcat Quad. I love the lift. It's perhaps the quickest lift for accessing 2000 vert of skiing in the East. That said, there isn't much terrain off the top of Wildcat, so conditions can get skied off pretty quick. Hence Wildcat's reputation for being an icy mountain.

 

[MadMadWorld]

Pains me to say it, but definitely the Wildcat Quad. I love the lift. It's perhaps the quickest lift for accessing 2000 vert of skiing in the East. That said, there isn't much terrain off the top of Wildcat, so conditions can get skied off pretty quick. Hence Wildcat's reputation for being an icy mountain.

Dammmmn I can't believe you went there. I think the icy reputation comes from the crazy winds. I think Wildcat is setup perfectly. The HSQ is the best in the business and when it can't run because of wind hold, is usually able to run and still covers most of the mountain.

 

[drjeff]

Mt. Snow having a HSQ & a six pack starting & dumping skiers off at just about the same spot is overkill.

Stratton isn't to far behind having 2 six packs, a quad & a 10 person gondola dumping people off on top of their mountain.

At Mt. Snow Don't forget the double and triple north face lifts and the sunbrook quad also dumping people at the same spot as the 2 front side high speed lifts.

I'm sure that some of the other Mount Snow regulars will chime in on this, but frankly after a full season last year experiencing their "new" lift capacity to the summit on all but 2 or 3 of the weekends they were open last season, while on the trail map it may look like overkill, in reality volume wise it wasn't appreciable different IMHO than in previous years. Most folks that used to ride the Grand Summit Express rode the Bluebird Express and as a result the line for the Grand Summit Express (when they ran it basically only on weekends between say 10 and 2) was rarely more than a couple of minutes long. And most folks DON'T make the hike UPHILL over from the Sunbrook Quad to the main mountain (I really wouldn't mind when the day finally comes that they replace the Sunbrook Quad if they realigned it to make transitioning from Sunbrook back to the Main Mountain easier) and while more folks riding the Northface lifts do use the Main Mountain than folks riding the Sunbrook Quad, you still find a far greater percentage of folks who just rode up a Northface Lift riding a Northface lift on their NEXT chair ride than a main mountain lift.

The reality is that if a mountain has a bunch of lifts that end in the same basic area, that's because that mountain generally speaking does a bunch of business and needs that capacity. Personally I've also found over the years that at MANY different ski areas, portions of the mountain that on the trailmap look like they'd be a crowding cluster F tend to not be nearly as bad once you get say 100 yards away from the unloading areas.

Especially in the world of today's modern ski areas, there's a heck of a lot of behind the scenes thought process that goes into the location and planning as well as what is needed for permitting approval to get a lift installed in a certain location on the mountain

 

[drjeff]

-Deer Valley--When a ski are has to start limiting the amount of tickets they sell because they don't want to overload the mountain--that is a bad sign!! 5 HS-quads come to a point on Flagstaff mountain (I think)--overkill!

What over examples do you have??

Actually it's "ONLY" 4 that end at the top of Flagstaff within that roughly 75 yard area. Ruby, Silver Strike, Northside and Quincy HSQ's. Now if you added a 5th in that same area, that would be total and complete overkill!! :lol:

 

[fbrissette]

So yeah--you know what I mean!

Overkill Chairlifts=

Singular noun:
-a chairlift that dumps too many people into one area.
-A chairlift that is way too fast for the area it is serving.

Well said. People always want high-speed chairs but in reality, in many cases, high-speed chairs only result in a worse skiing experience because the skiing area cannot handle the traffic.

 

[drjeff]

Well said. People always want high-speed chairs but in reality, in many cases, high-speed chairs only result in a worse skiing experience because the skiing area cannot handle the traffic.

One thing that you DO have to remember with high speed lifts. A good portion of them run at a capacity that is below what they're maximally rated for than run at maximum capacity because of the ski area's concern for too great a downhill density of skier's/riders.